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I'm not quite sure how this fits in but I had an inguinal hernia repair done at the Shouldice Clinic about 10 years ago which I understood somehow falls under the category of a private clinic. All that happens at Shouldice are hernia repairs, nothing else. A friend of mine had a hernia done about a year after me at one of the hospitals downtown, I can't remember which so they're done elsewhere too. While in, I met guys who were local, from across Canada and from the US. My roommate at Shouldice was a really cool guy from New Jersey who works as a Paramedic. He paid to fly up here and paid for the procedure which includes a five day stay (admission is the afternoon before surgery). I can't recall now if he paid for the surgery himself or through insurance, but suffice to say it wasn't paid for by OHIP.
 
Private Health Care in Canada?

Everyone: Interesting topic on allowing private health care in Canada-I did not know that this was NOT allowed in Canada.

The way I feel if that if it improves care for those that truly need it I say "why not?"

Those who would pay for health care and opt out of the Government-run system would be the affluent who can afford a more expensive comprehensive health plan.

With the health care fiasco in the USA reaching fever pitch in the fight for a public option I WISH we had a choice like this...

One thing Canada does NOT have is a block of uninsured people as in the US
44 Million or so at last check? Imagine ALL of Canada being uninsured...That's how big that block of citizens is! It's a travesty...

Thoughts from LI MIKE
 
Any kind of private second-tier system would need to have a ton of regulations to ensure that a) our doctors aren't taking themselves out of the public system completely, leading to even greater shortages and b) that wait times and quality-of-care doesn't get worse on the public side while getting better on the private side - the averages would look better, probably, but at a tough cost.

I don't really think it's a big deal either way, though. For all the doom and gloom, our healthcare system works pretty damn well. As priorities go, we have more important things to worry about.

I'm not really sure who a parallel private system would benefit aside from the very wealthy - I make a fairly high wage but there's no way I'd drop $15,000 on a knee operation just to avoid waiting a few months.
 
dt_toronto_geek said:
I'm not quite sure how this fits in but I had an inguinal hernia repair done at the Shouldice Clinic about 10 years ago which I understood somehow falls under the category of a private clinic. All that happens at Shouldice are hernia repairs, nothing else. A friend of mine had a hernia done about a year after me at one of the hospitals downtown, I can't remember which so they're done elsewhere too. While in, I met guys who were local, from across Canada and from the US. My roommate at Shouldice was a really cool guy from New Jersey who works as a Paramedic. He paid to fly up here and paid for the procedure which includes a five day stay (admission is the afternoon before surgery). I can't recall now if he paid for the surgery himself or through insurance, but suffice to say it wasn't paid for by OHIP.
Click to expand...

I also had an inguinal hernia repaired there last February. To my understanding that it's a for-profit hospital that was allowed to remain private because it was established prior to the Canada Health Act. However, their profits are capped to a certain amount. They're selective in who they take (for instance, if you don't lose the required amount of weight they tell you during an examination, you'll be denied). There was a man who flew from Israel to have his hernia repaired there, who had to pay for it himself, obviously.

It kind of opened me up to the idea of two-tier healthcare, solely on the fact that I actually enjoyed my stay there and the care was fantastic.
 
knlaruw said:
I also had an inguinal hernia repaired there last February. To my understanding that it's a for-profit hospital that was allowed to remain private because it was established prior to the Canada Health Act. However, their profits are capped to a certain amount. They're selective in who they take (for instance, if you don't lose the required amount of weight they tell you during an examination, you'll be denied). There was a man who flew from Israel to have his hernia repaired there, who had to pay for it himself, obviously.

It kind of opened me up to the idea of two-tier healthcare, solely on the fact that I actually enjoyed my stay there and the care was fantastic.
Click to expand...

That's interesting, I thought it was some kind of a private clinic.

I enjoyed my stay there too, it's like a country club there. I chose to leave a day early, I saw no advantage to staying there the last day as I was feeling great and was anxious to get home.
 
Makes you wonder why Canada Health Act prevents any new Shouldice style clinics...
 
We already have private health care. I don't think it's a question of whether or not people wil pay for it out of their own pockets, but whether or not private companies can be set p to provide services that mirror (or exceed) those offered by the current state-run system.

Ever been to a family doctor? Pediatrician? Gynecologist? Dentist? ALL PRIVATE HEALTH CARE.

Proctologist? Dermatologist? Obstetrician? Walk in clinic? PRIVATE.

Why is it that we can go see all these privately operating specialists- covered by the publicly funded system - yet we can't go get a private MRI or radiation treatment? It is stupid that these types of clinics are prohibited when the current wait times can be measured in many months? Within 5 years, there could be double he number of clinics available to the public and any new operators could be trained, without draining the current system.

It's these things that often cause the worst delays.
 
After seeing what has happened in the United States I don't support a two tiered system. Money gets sucked out of the public system and services get reduced, and the mandate to provide truly universal care gets lost in the search for profit.

I've come to accept no medical system will ever be perfect, but Canada has a more perfect system than alternatives with two tiers and its truly universal. Not just semi-universal insurance coverage that pays some of your care if they want to pay it.

But does Canada need improvements? Absolutely. But delivered through a public system that is accountable and responsible and truly universal.

As others have stated, Canada has enough private medicine as is. Family practices are mostly private and many clinic or testing services are private. No need to expand private services at all.
 
family doctors are a private business operation funded by public insurance (OHIP) yet look how hard it is to get a family doctor if you don't already have one. and even walk-in clinics who are private business operations, look how packed those places are. i think the problems with our system comes from not having enough doctors. why don't we have enough doctors? lets fix that.
 
Brandon716 said:
After seeing what has happened in the United States I don't support a two tiered system. Money gets sucked out of the public system and services get reduced, and the mandate to provide truly universal care gets lost in the search for profit.
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The biggest problem in the US is the way the insurance and HMOs operate, but that is a separate thing from the Canadian discussion, since the province would still essentially be paying for most things that are being provided. And don't kid yourself - there are a lot of things the government doesn't cover, or will reduce coverage on.

Canada is very socialized, of course, but does someone making $28k really think they are entitled to be provided the same services that someone making $280k can afford to buy? All that does is drag everyone down to a lower level.

Public health care from day one was not created to provide all services to all people - it was created to ensure that all people, regardless of means, could get at least the basics covered. Trying to be all things to all people is not feasible, nor even possible.

Brandon716 said:
But does Canada need improvements? Absolutely. But delivered through a public system that is accountable and responsible and truly universal.

As others have stated, Canada has enough private medicine as is. Family practices are mostly private and many clinic or testing services are private. No need to expand private services at all.
Click to expand...
The only thing universal will be that is is universally limited to everyone who can't afford to go to the US. Either we allow some private care or we don't. Since we already do, I don't understand the resistance to open up more private facilities to relieve the overburdened public system.

Yes - there is a doctor and nurse shortage that needs to be taken care of, regardless of the public vs private debate. Is anyone able to illuminate us on what is or isn't being done in this regard? Beyond the people themselves, there are also equipment and facility shortages that need to be addressed. Both these shortages need to be improved and it's entirely reasonable to think that some sort of workable balance between public and private care can be reached.

One thing would be to remove limits that doctors are working under. If there aren't enough doctors, why make it worse by limiting the number of people that doctors can see? Suppose a doctor/nurse/xray tech wants to work in a private clinic - ensure they get paid the same rates in either system and put in some sort of oversight that requires them to work a certain number of hours in either system, say 1:1 or whatever is deemed workable.
 
As others have stated, a shortage of doctors isn't the same thing as an 'overburdened public system'. The system isn't overburdened because its public, its got a need for more doctors.

For what its worth, Canadians expect a family practitioner and want one for good health. Americans don't expect to have a family practitioner. While the US has an adequate amount of specialists, the US actually has fewer family doctors than Canada per capita. If every American demanded a primary care physician, there would be longer waits than Canada has ever seen.

That's part of the problem with American care: almost no preventative care. People go directly to a clinic or ER with major complications and immediately have to see a specialist after years of ignoring the underlying symptoms. Why? Because we don't cover preventative medicine very much in the US.

There isn't a need to open up more private services in Canada as it zaps the public system and creates an actual overburdened system instead of a system that works but needs more doctors.
 
Yes, they tried "fixing" the system with HMO's a while ago - and it only made it worse. Each system has it's holes.

This one is my own history with healthcare in Canada.

I had problems with walking - my knee making sounds and trying to walk was very very painful. I went to the doctor and then ordered up ex-rays to look at it and found nothing. I went back to the doctor and they said the x-rays found nothing, and they would do a ultra-sound on it. I asked what that was found (began having questions) and the doctor said - most likely nothing other than there is something wrong - I asked why that test was necessary. I asked what the best test was to find the problem and they said that an MRI would be the best. I asked why they did not just order it then. They said first they had to do test a, and if that does not find something then test b, and if that did not find anything then test c (all ordered based on increasing cost of procedure). It did not matter that in the end it would cost more since the other tests were only being done to justify having an MRI. I asked how long it would be to schedule an MRI, and they said likely around 8 months after setting up the appointment. I then asked if they could schedule one now, and I would do the other tests in the meantime for the proof. The answer was no - they could only do that once the evidence indicated that one was necessary. It did not matter if the doctor knew from experience that this other stuff was useless - it was just the government setdown process to get to the end-point. I went back to my office and searched for a clinic in Buffalo and called them on friday. I asked what the cost would be and when they would be able to do it - and got the answer of $450 (Canadian discount - obvious the actual price is set at $800 for "insurance" companies), and tomorrow Saturday was available. I booked it, went there, had the images created hard copies and computer media in hand when I left for the border on Saturay (return). If I waited for the Canadian system, I would probably still be waiting to find out what the problem was :p
 
I would like to have an option to opt out of basic health coverage, and only get insurance with a high-deductible (i.e. critical care for things that are huge - like serious illness etc.). The other stuff I would prefer to cover out of pocket (or from a health savings account) - i.e. regular checkups - blood tests - basically anything that you can plan for happen
 
What if your MRI shows nothing wrong?
 
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