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- Thread starter aquateam
- Start date
Amare
Senior Member
One question. If they want to build only one station for the extension, why are they using one of the costliest alignments? Unless they are planning to allow for the future additions of stations, it makes absolutely no sense at all.
nfitz
Superstar
The report notes that:
Optimizing transit connectivity to Scarborough Centre through the elimination of this potential in-line station does not preclude its later consideration. Further review of this issue is required as part of the next steps in this work.
Though I'm guessing that the conclusion to proceed with McCowan does predate this new decision to cancel the Lawrence East station. Also the report notes that one of the next steps is to "Confirm the alignment of the optimized (express) subway route".
bobbob911
Active Member
How exactly do you build in a later station without massively disrupting that line? Seems like a bit of a pipedream to me.
nfitz
Superstar
I don't recall much disruption when they built North York Centre station.
kEiThZ
Superstar
Spot on. Smart Track should be exactly what it was pitched as. A surface subway with more frequent stops. GO RER can remain express with fewer routes. This way, where Smart Track and GO RER coincide, ST riders will have the opportunity to transfer every couple of stations.
This is also beneficial to the 905. Riders from the 905 won't be stuck on trains stopping every 2 minutes in the 416.
raptor
Senior Member
So let's forget the SmartTrack brand, call it all RER, and have some express RER trains vs local RER trains. problem solved.
kEiThZ
Superstar
Sure. Branding isn't an issue. Service is. Before Tory, Metrolinx didn't have much intention to use these existing rail corridors for local transit inside the 416. That kinda screws us.
I couldn't care less what it's called.
crs1026
Superstar
Adjei
Senior Member
If I hear another politician come up with another transit plan...You are not a transit planner, leave the planning to the experts and get back to focusing on how to fund transit properly...
44 North
Senior Member
But what if these "experts" are politically motivated in their expert decisions? Five years ago in the GO benefits case experts said that AD2W using diesels would be more than optimal for the Stouffville corridor to beyond 2031. Its business case was so-so, and in 2008 its ridership projected at 4.9M by 2031 (i.e not much higher than it is now). Then with the subsequent electrification study again Stouffville wasn't really shortlisted for any significant improvement (unlike other corridors). Instead it was grouped in the unfeasible "entire network" electrification option - a proposal with negative economics and strong negative deliverability.
Now these same experts are telling us no, Stouffville shouldn't have ad2w, nor express rail. Rather it's imperative to have prioritized electrified express rail, and a plethora of new stations for metro-like local service. Is it a coincidence that this promise was made by the premier and just so happened to occur two months before an election? People blast certain pols for changing plans, or bringing something new to the table. But when other pols do it, they're praised. With ST, there's definitely something going on. Whether it's to bolster the Prov's plans, as a vote winning exercise, to kill off the DRL, kill SSE, or a combo of all. Either way, it seems pretty clear to me that politics and 'expert' planning continues to go hand in hand. Both at the municipal level and the provincial level.
bobbob911
Active Member
Good to hear. I wasn't aware of any infill stations opened in a modern context.
kEiThZ
Superstar
Well put. The numbers are most certainly malleable. And the dramatic changes between different reports proves it. I personally think a deal was cut between Tory and the province. The latter has no desire to build a large surface subway line to serve the inner suburbs. So the city would pay for that (Smart Track) but leverage work done by the province (GO RER). While the province would pay for a one-stop subway to STC and extending Eglinton LRT in both directions. This works out well for Queen's Park too. SC could use a rebuild and relocation and orientation along McCowan to better fit its regional bus hub role.
Unlike others, I think the Sheppard subway is now dead. The case for it gets particularly challenging with Smart Track and GO RER converging at Agincourt. At best, there might be a Line 2 extension to McCowan/Sheppard. Even that's a stretch. The subway has less of a case with less ridership flowing towards Don Mills. Likewise, Smart Track, in my opinion, also does damage to the DRL north's case. DRL will now be a downtown subway. South of Danforth/Bloor.
BMO
Senior Member
That's how they do it in the Netherlands. They have a different branding between the routes that stop every couple of stations and another branding for the routes that stop at all the in-between ones. The difference is that the in-between trains don't usually duplicate service along the entire corridor, just in certain spots to funnel riders onto the express service for longer trips.
BMO
Senior Member
Until you realize there's literally no Rapid transit option to traverse E/W anywhere north of Eglinton, that's a huge chunk of area. Finch West takes it part of the way, we still need something to completely go from West to East. I'd say leveraging the existing Sheppard Subway corridor, and modifying it to fit within that need could be enticing to a politician drawing lines on a map. I've got to imagine there's demand for crosstown trips in the north due to the abundance of busy TTC routes that go East-West.