[Amare]

The Harper government is an absolute joke when it comes to transit, and I think 99% of people on this forum understand that. Its too bad that a lot of the general populous is delusional when it comes this this matter. I wonder if we can get a running total on the amount of money his government has actually put into transit during his time in power (not the amount he has pledged). I guarantee that amount barely exceeds $7-8 billion (which is pathetic as that amount is split across the country over 9-10 years).

 

[Midtown Urbanist]

The Harper government is an absolute joke when it comes to transit, and I think 99% of people on this forum understand that. Its too bad that a lot of the general populous is delusional when it comes this this matter. I wonder if we can get a running total on the amount of money his government has actually put into transit during his time in power (not the amount he has pledged). I guarantee that amount barely exceeds $7-8 billion (which is pathetic as that amount is split across the country over 9-10 years).

Well the polls do say that urban infrastructure investment is the second most important issue after health care for Canadians this election.

 

[DarnDirtyApe]

Ontario's Minister of Transportation Steven Del Duca and Ontario's Minister of Economic Development, Employment and Infrastructure Brad Duguid have released the following joint statement:
June 18, 2015

"We are pleased the federal government has joined us at the table with their share of support to the City's SmartTrack proposal, which will be delivered by Metrolinx, through the Province's GO Regional Express Rail (RER) Plan.

As announced in the 2015 provincial budget, Ontario is leading the way by investing billions of dollars in our GO Transit system through the transformative RER initiative. Recognizing that the City's SmartTrack concept is largely dependent on the province's corridors and infrastructure, Ontario was the first to partner with the City in this project to help manage congestion in Toronto.

With shovels in the ground on hundreds of critical infrastructure projects already underway, Ontario welcomes federal dollars to help continue building the integrated transit and transportation network the people of this region expect us to build.

Our government has already committed to electrify the existing GO corridors which are segments of Toronto's Smart Track proposal, and $13.5 Billion to implement Regional Express Rail across Ontario's GO Transit network. Ontario's investments in RER make Smart Track possible.

As part of the largest infrastructure investment in Ontario's history, our government is investing $16 Billion for GTHA and $15 Billion across the rest of the province in the transportation infrastructure projects that will create and sustain jobs, fuel economic growth, and make moving across our province easier and more seamless.

While this federal investment is positive news for the people of Ontario, our government remains concerned that the federal government is not investing nearly enough in Ontario's public infrastructure. By comparison, the Ontario government is investing over $130 Billion in the province over the next ten years - three times more per capita than the federal government. We will continue to strongly urge the federal government to provide stable, long-term infrastructure funding.

Provinces and municipalities across Canada cannot shoulder infrastructure investments alone; we need a federal partner to invest in our future.

Announcements such as todays leave questions around other Ontario priority projects that we have continually brought to the attention of the federal government. Ontario has submitted over 100 priority projects to the federal government for infrastructure funding under the Building Canada Fund.

To date, Ontario has only received approval on one project within the Provincial Territorial Infrastructure Component - the Ottawa River Action Plan.

The priority projects that Ontario has put forward to the federal government, including six highway expansion projects, two GO transit projects, the Maley Drive extension in Sudbury, a number of nominated Small Community Fund projects, and a call for the federal government to match Ontario's $1 Billion commitment to the Ring of Fire, have not received any response.

Canada needs the Canadian Infrastructure Partnership proposed by Premier Wynne - a collaborative approach to stable, long-term infrastructure funding with a commitment of five per cent of GDP in infrastructure renewal, which is the amount needed to drive productivity and economic growth across Canada."

This is pretty hilarious - just in case you thought that the provincial Liberals were less partisan than the Harper Conservatives...

 

[nfitz]

The Harper government is an absolute joke when it comes to transit, and I think 99% of people on this forum understand that.

They do?

Transit has never been part of the federal remit historically. The Harper government has dropped a lot more infrastructure money on transit than I recall any other government doing. How much more did the Chretien, Mulroney, or Trudeau governments spend? Or even the Pearson or Diefenbaker governments from back in the day when there was a lot of the original transit development in Montreal and Toronto.

Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if Harper has spent more on transit infrastructure in Canada than Diefenbaker, Pearson, Trudeau, Chretien, and Mulroney governments combined! (not that I have run the numbers, though offhand, I can't think of much until late in the Chretien government).

How does this make the Harper government a joke then on transit?

 

[TOareaFan]

They do?

Transit has never been part of the federal remit historically. The Harper government has dropped a lot more infrastructure money on transit than I recall any other government doing. How much more did the Chretien, Mulroney, or Trudeau governments spend? Or even the Pearson or Diefenbaker governments from back in the day when there was a lot of the original transit development in Montreal and Toronto.

Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if Harper has spent more on transit infrastructure in Canada than Diefenbaker, Pearson, Trudeau, Chretien, and Mulroney governments combined! (not that I have run the numbers, though offhand, I can't think of much until late in the Chretien government).

How does this make the Harper government a joke then on transit?

I think, generally, people have lost site of traditional divisions of duties/responsibilities between the different levels of government...and, yes, transit has been the job of the provinces.

Patrick Searle is the mouthpiece for MoT and he often tweets comparisons between what the Ontario Liberals have invested in transit (or promised to) and what the federal Tories have....I answered one of his tweets with (paraphrase) ...if that is relevant then tell me how much the provincial Liberals have invested in national defense.

 

[nfitz]

So we should buy into the province's spin and partisan spin, ignoring that the Harper government has spent much more on transit infrastructure that any other federal government I can think of?

There's a whole lot of stuff that Harper can arguably be criticized for. Capital funding of transit isn't one of them in comparison to his predecessors. He's the first one to put money where his mouth is.

 

[agoraflaneur]

"This is pretty hilarious - just in case you thought that the provincial Liberals were less partisan than the Harper Conservatives..."

Well, um, the Liberals are actually spending the money to keep this province afloat. And they need more. And the Conservatives haven't done much. So why wouldn't they point out the peanuts given to infrastructure investment (not just transit) in this country.

What most people need to realize is that the federal government's capacity to spend is simply larger than the provinces, who have had to deal with huge increases in health spending in particular. Structurally, they are the only level of government with spare cash. Almost every other (decent) country has a national transit strategy. I don't really care if you want to talk about Dief or Trudeau. I'm sure that many governments chipped in for all our projects such as the Great Lakes canals, transcanada highway and railway, airports, etc etc. Transit is the missing link. And no, federal liberals didn't spend much either - but it didn't help that people like Harris literally filled in subway lines already under construction. What were they to contribute to, exactly?

What ToAreaFan misses is that the feds take in too much money for their narrow mandate, so they have to spend the money. They have a crucial role to play in investment in virtually everything in Canada. Ontario spend money on defence? Yeah that's a great comparison. Zing.

 

[agoraflaneur]

I'd like posters like nfitz to give me concrete numbers to back up that claim.

 

[agoraflaneur]

As I go to read the G&M, something apropos pops up:

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news...s-smarttrack-draws-criticism/article25045609/

Mr. Tory said he wants his proposed SmartTrack line to be in place within seven years. Ottawa says the money will come from a new Public Transit Fund announced in the budget, but that fund is based on financing projects over 20 to 30 years which makes it unclear how long it would take for the city to get the promised cash.

A spokesperson for Finance Minister Joe Oliver, who is responsible for the new fund, said Friday that the amount would be transferred “over a long period of time, to be negotiated with the City of Toronto.” The full details of the new plan won’t be announced until the fall.

 

[nfitz]

I'd like posters like nfitz to give me concrete numbers to back up that claim.

It is hard to prove a negative. But do you remember any federal government providing funding for new transit lines until Chretien suddenly popped $300 million for the Canada Line in December 2001, during his final term in office.

I can't find anything significant before that. Nor do I remember anything. Though I confess, I don't remember Pearson (other than his death), and I only remember Diefenbaker in opposition (I don't recall him even appearing in Parliament during the 1979 Clark government ... though now I think about, given that Clark took so long to bring back Parliament after the election, I guess he'd not have had the opportunity).

Feel free to point out what I've missed. Perhaps there was some huge forgotten bonanza in Clark's 1979 budget that Bob Rae triggered an election over ...

 

[BurlOak]

I think PM Paul Martin gave a few Million for the design of the Spadina subway extension. Does that count?

I think that was a few years before Harper gave $700 M for the construction.

 

[nfitz]

I think PM Paul Martin gave a few Million for the design of the Spadina subway extension. Does that count?

Count to what. To my statement that "Harper has spent more on transit infrastructure in Canada than Diefenbaker, Pearson, Trudeau, Chretien, and Mulroney governments combined". No.

I think that was a few years before Harper gave $700 M for the construction.

But after "Chretien suddenly popped $300 million for the Canada Line in December 2001".

 

[BurlOak]

Count to what. To my statement that "Harper has spent more on transit infrastructure in Canada than Diefenbaker, Pearson, Trudeau, Chretien, and Mulroney governments combined". No.

But after "Chretien suddenly popped $300 million for the Canada Line in December 2002".

Was the EA completed before Chretien gave the money or is that only a requirement for Conservative PMs?

 

[nfitz]

Was the EA completed before Chretien gave the money or is that only a requirement for Conservative PMs?

I don't believe there is a requirement to do Environmental Assessments to build urban transit in British Columbia.

However it was over 3 years after the provincial government announced plans to build it!

 

[Rainforest]

The Harper government is an absolute joke when it comes to transit, and I think 99% of people on this forum understand that. Its too bad that a lot of the general populous is delusional when it comes this this matter. I wonder if we can get a running total on the amount of money his government has actually put into transit during his time in power (not the amount he has pledged). I guarantee that amount barely exceeds $7-8 billion (which is pathetic as that amount is split across the country over 9-10 years).

I did not follow Harper's handling of transit across the country; but for Toronto, it was not bad at all:
- $300 million for Sheppard LRT (allocated)
- about $700 million for Scarborough subway (committed)
- up to $3 billion for SmartTrack

The latter is not really committed, but the project is not really ready to receive committed funding.