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Boeing intentionally ignored the 100-seat market because they wanted to force the airlines to buy larger and more expensive aircraft. You can only act this way in a monopoly, which is what they tried to move towards.
 
drum118 said:
Bombardier rail division president unfazed by global challenges it faces
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Thanks for that! Even though the Rail Division is not fully owned by BBD parent, I beg to differ with his view. It's time for them to change their tune:
MONTREAL – None of the challenges facing Bombardier’s railway business — including the threat of lost streetcar contracts, a bribery investigation and a super-sized European rival — will derail its plans to become a stronger, more profitable global competitor, division president Laurent Troger said Thursday.

“I am pretty convinced that we have all the assets in our hands to remain a leading edge company in this industry,” he told The Canadian Press in an wide-ranging interview from Ottawa. [...]
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I'm reminded of Monty Python's Black Knight.

They cannot survive alone, how clear does the message have to be from their parent company? If BBD Rail aren't absorbed by one of the European rivals, there's two choices left: CRRC or Hitachi.

Looking forward to more discussion on this...
 
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The Bombardier Rail division better be fazed by their challenges because after the Q400 and CRJ programs are sold of, they're next in line. That's if they cant get into the merger with Siemens-Alstom later on.
 
Amare said:
The Bombardier Rail division better be fazed by their challenges because after the Q400 and CRJ programs are sold of, they're next in line. That's if they cant get into the merger with Siemens-Alstom later on.
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a merger to form a triumvirate?? yea no way will that ever happen....
 
I haven't heard much about Bombardier (or Canada) challenging the American tariff lately, so are we going to take this matter sitting down or what?
 
kEiThZ said:
Looks like some people will get their wish about Bombardier shuttering Downsview:

http://www.fliegerfaust.com/bombardier-sold-the-q400-division-2499101163.html

Sylvain Faust is a fairly reliable source. Unless the buyer is Viking Aero or Airbus ATR, the buyer will probably move the tooling and close the plant.
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My prediction is Bombardier sells the Q400 to Viking (if not them due to size, it will be an outside Canada buyer) and sells the Downsview property and runway to a real estate developer.

cq5dam.web.750.750.jpeg
 
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The amount of condos that will be built the day the downsview plant is sold off will be absolutely mind blowing. Of course im operating under pure speculation here, but since Toronto is so unimaginative these days, that's probably the only outcome that would come out of a sale of these lands.
 
rbt said:
The "Like" button should be an "I concur" button. I don't particularly like it but I agree that it has a high probability of occurring.
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Exactly my feeling for the last three posts I "liked".

Just doing some background digging on this, and this particular article over a month and a half old, speaks volumes to losing the Q Series. My particular feeling is that Airbus or an associate company (they have many) will snap it up. It's one of the best turbo-props if not the best out there for the niche:
Bombardier says NAFTA talks not factor into relocation of Q400 work
by Ross Marowits, The Canadian Press

Posted Sep 12, 2017 8:01 am PDT

Last Updated Sep 12, 2017 at 2:20 pm PDT


MIRABEL, Que. – Bombardier Inc. will not factor the fraught NAFTA renegotiations into a decision on whether to shift component work on its Q400 plane from Toronto to Mexico or another lower-cost region, the Canadian plane and train maker said Tuesday.

The Montreal-based company has announced it will reduce costs on the turboprop plane by moving Q400 wing and cockpit work from Toronto. However, when and where that work will move hasn’t been decided, said Todd Young, vice-president of customer service and support for Bombardier Commercial Aircraft.

“The final decision will be based on economics,” he said at an all-day session updating the company’s commercial aircraft programs.

“We will not make a decision that is not going to save money for the Q400.”

The component assembly work could be transferred to its low-cost centres in Mexico or Morocco or be outsourced to third-party suppliers. The final assembly of the plane will be completed in Toronto.

Canadian companies with manufacturing capacity in Mexico are worried that the U.S. push to renegotiate the trade deal between the three North American countries will add restrictions that make it costlier to maintain their operations or lead to higher tariffs if the deal is terminated.

Unionized workers at the Toronto plant originally objected to the company’s efforts to shift the work to make the plane more competitive. However, they eventually agreed to the move.

The company also said in its market update Tuesday that there is a global market of 12,550 for the size of commercial planes it produces, worth US$820 billion over the next 20 years.

The 100- to 150-seat segment, which includes its CSeries passenger jets, will lead the way with 6,800 deliveries valued at US$580 billion at 2017 list prices. That’s down from 7,000 forecast two years ago, which the company said is due to a slowdown in China.

Bombardier expects to capture about half the global market with its controversial CSeries, which it says is burning three per cent less fuel than originally promised — resulting in lower operating costs.

The improvement hasn’t yet translated into new orders but marketing head Patrick Baudis said it is one of the plane’s selling features.

“The better the plane, the more you get value out of the plane, the more your plane becomes competitive and attractive to the market,” he said in an interview.

The company’s CSeries jets continue to be at the centre of an ongoing trade battle with United States-based Boeing, which has accused Bombardier of selling the jets to U.S.-based Delta Airlines at an unfairly low price with help from government subsidies in Canada.

Boeing walked away from talks with Canadian officials aimed at resolving the American aerospace company’s trade dispute with Montreal-based Bombardier, Canada’s ambassador to the U.S. said Tuesday.

David MacNaughton’s comments are the first revelation that the Trudeau government has spoken directly with Boeing about the dispute, which has become a flashpoint for the Liberals.

They also come as media reports say British Prime Minister Theresa May, who will visit Canada next week, defended Bombardier during a recent call with U.S. President Donald Trump.

Bombardier said it welcomes the support from Britain but wouldn’t say what it feels would be an appropriate settlement.

“I’m not going to speculate on the outcome of a deal. We will be strategic in our thinking and we’re going to do what’s right for our people here at Bombardier and for aerospace in Canada,” Fred Cromer, the company’s president of Commercial Aircraft told reporters.
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http://www.news1130.com/2017/09/12/...will-be-shipped-with-up-to-150-seats-by-2036/

Obviously one aspect, the CSeries has just changed radically, and the fix is already in for the De-Havilland series....but one of the Airbus associates would be far more prone to selling these than a smaller company like Viking, just as is the case with the CSeries.

Again, I'm with rbt...I don't like it, but see it as being inevitable. I can't see anyone without global clout selling the Q series in enough quantity to make them pay.

One possibility not mentioned, albeit I'm sure it's been discussed behind closed doors...is Alabama....
 
Rainforest said:
If the runway and plant close, some space should be reserved for transit infrastructure (either expanded subway yard or a yard for another type of city rail).
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Is it possible for Sheppard Ave West to be realigned to go straight across?
 
Amare said:
The amount of condos that will be built the day the downsview plant is sold off will be absolutely mind blowing. Of course im operating under pure speculation here, but since Toronto is so unimaginative these days, that's probably the only outcome that would come out of a sale of these lands.
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The Downsview subway station is underused, so there's certainly transit capacity available. Better than building thousands of more condo units downtown. Though I do hope if this comes to pass that they build more mid-rise condos. I suppose I'm using the wrong name for that station http://urbantoronto.ca/news/2017/04/ttc-renaming-downsview-station-sheppard-west-may
steveintoronto said:
One possibility not mentioned, albeit I'm sure it's been discussed behind closed doors...is Alabama....
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Alabama has a much better business enviromment than Ontario. Labour is much cheaper due to Right To Work http://statelaws.findlaw.com/alabama-law/alabama-right-to-work-laws.html, energy and transportation costs and corporate taxes are lower.
Rainforest said:
If the runway and plant close,
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Is the runway wholly owned by Bombardier?
 
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