ProjectEnd
Superstar
Not that I agree or disagree with anything being said but Bathurst is not an Avenue in this section. Furthermore, the Dundas section ends below Nassau while the College section picks up around the Beer Store.
- Thread starter androiduk
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Not that I agree or disagree with anything being said but Bathurst is not an Avenue in this section. Furthermore, the Dundas section ends below Nassau while the College section picks up around the Beer Store.
urbandreamer
recession proof
Sunnyray: Can you persuade Daddy Warbucks to change to aA for the exterior window dressing? I'm certain they'd create a much better looking Walmart etc.
sunnyraytoronto
Senior Member
No I can not.
See my previous post number 203,.... City could have influence better looking project with more windows, bricks and 10 store subdivision at street level,..... But all that goes out the window as Rio-Can will now deal with OMB,.... As they originally wanted to do all a long,..... Basically,... The Kensington market folks, those two local local councillor Mike Layton and Adam Vaughan,.... City council and city planning,.... Played right into Rio-Can's hand,...... Through OMB,... This project likely to be plain Jane with minimum windows and no bricks to match surroundings,...
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AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
In which case, one would be extremely correct to question the commitment of said company to urban excellence.
AoD
sunnyraytoronto
Senior Member
Anything,... would be better than what's currently there at this site,... which looks like urban decay,...
AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
sunnyraytoronto:
That's a rather poor justification - and speaks volume on ones' priorities.
AoD
That's a rather poor justification - and speaks volume on ones' priorities.
AoD
urbandreamer
recession proof
A parking lot is way better than a dreary Orange & Beige Mart filled with cars. A parking lot represents potential; a Walmart represents another missed opportunity for the next 25 years.\
What is wrong with "urban decay?" It is a natural part of city life.
What is wrong with "urban decay?" It is a natural part of city life.
Mike in TO
Senior Member
The appeal to the OMB is not with respect to the project itself, but related to the if the city acted properly in the application an Interim Control By-Law to freeze development for a year. It is basically a question of whether or not the city is acting in good faith in the application of the ICBL or if it was implemented as a delay tactic to avoid dealing with the application - if the OMB determines in their view that is the situation (and Rio-can may have a pretty strong case) then the ICBL will be overturned and the city will actually have to deal with the application (meaning the councilors, community, planning department etc will have an opportunity to work through the planning process to deal with the issues Sunnyray & AoD have noted.... unless the city continues to delay beyond the prescribed timelines in the Planning Act, at which time Rio-Can could again appeal to the OMB due to a non-decision from the city).
From a community planning perspective I would certainly share many concerns raise regarding the proposed tenant - however the planning process focuses on land-use rather than tenants and cannot discriminate against specific tenants or discriminate against specific people. Furthermore the OMB appeal is not to circumvent council or the community on the application itself, but rather that any landowner affected by the passing of an ICBL has 60 days to launch an appeal to the OMB if they believe that the ICBL was inappropriately applied. ICBLs have also under the Municipal Act been appealed to the courts.
ICBLs have in the past been overturned by the OMB or by the courts if they were initially passed by a municipality in bad faith after finding that it was unfair and discriminatory and represented an abuse of process. So the question in this specific situation is - was the ICBL passed in good faith with strong planning rationale to study the Bathurst corridor and determine appropriate future planning? or was the ICBL passed in bad faith as a reaction with the intent to delay and discriminate specifically against the Rio-Can application?
People may not like the appeal to the OMB, but Rio-Can may have a case in this situation - should be interesting to watch.
Torontovibe
Senior Member
I would prefer it be left as is for the time being, then getting something inappropriate and ugly. Your expectations are way too low. "Better than what's currently there" should never come out of any Torontonian's mouth. (or computer) We are dealing with North America's fourth largest city, have a little ambition. (and pride)
sunnyraytoronto
Senior Member
Look, you can't build a Talfalgar Square or a Times Square or a Central Park or an Arc de Triomphe with Avenue des Champs-Élysées at every street corner,... but as long as you build something better than what is currently there,.. that neighbourhood have improved,... and all these little improvement will improve the city.
Actually,.... most people who know me,... would say my expectations are way too high!
And I really do like Rio-Can's proposal for this site,... especially if they execute like they did at their QueenSteetWest & Portland location.
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sunnyraytoronto
Senior Member
Well,... the Friends of Kensington folks seems to think otherwise,.... hence their crowdfunding,...
"What happens next?"
"RioCan has just appealed the by-law to the Ontario Municipal Board (OMB), which means their entire proposal could be decided at an OMB hearing in the next four or five months. RioCan is challenging the ICBL, saying it is inappropriate. They’re also asking the OMB to allow re-zoning of 420 Bathurst St., which would enable a 65’ high, 129,000 sq ft shopping mall, anchored by a suburban-sized Walmart to be built in close proximity to Kensington Market and directly adjacent to dozens of homes. Did we mention that the development would include a 300-car parking lot and a large four-bay loading dock?"
https://projexity.com/projects/view/Save-Kensington-Market-from-Big-Box/18
https://www.facebook.com/FriendsofKensingtonMarket
The Interim Control By-Law that city council passed 36-1 without any debate on the last day council sat before their summer break,... which they are still on, even though the other school-kids are back in class already! ;P
"The by-law was passed without debate or discussion at Friday’s city council meeting and restricts new building developments on both sides of Bathurst Street from Dupont to Queen streets for one year while the city prepares a land-use study. This includes a controversial proposal from RioCan Real Estate Investment Trust for a three-story retail complex with a Wal-Mart store."
"Councillor Mike Layton represents the ward and brought forward the by-law to give the city time to research what kind of effect big-box stores might have on the area. While he said the Wal-Mart proposal played a role, he added that the uncertainty surrounding some lots, such as the site of Honest Ed’s, which was recently put up for sale, spurred him to investigate what the future of Bathurst Street might look like."
http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/toronto/wal-mart-put-on-hold-for-kensington/article13331100/
BTW,... AlvinOfDiaspar,.... if this project gets more windows,... then there will just be more windows for opponents to break.
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AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
No offense, but given your answer and how the QW project turned out, I am not sure if your expectations are "way too high". That example is barely sufficient IMO.
AoD
sunnyraytoronto
Senior Member
Well,... what exactly don't you like about Rio-Can's QueenStreetWest & Portland project?
http://www.riocan.com/Content/PDF/sitePlan/223A.pdf
https://www.google.ca/search?q=quee...QHl3ICYDQ&ved=0CCsQsAQ&biw=1024&bih=672&dpr=1
That's a very relevant question,... especially since both Rio-Can and city planning have been using that project as a template for this project.
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pw20
Active Member
The commercial component of that project is actually quite well executed. It's the condo portion that's brutal. And for those calling for a taller development here... considering that the neighbourhood is freaking out over a three story mall - how would a 10 story condo tower have fared?
Like it or not - allowing the thousands o f new residents the opportunity to shop downtown will be part of what makes downtown continue to be livable.
arvelomcquaig
Active Member
People are mostly opposed to this development because of the Walmart, not the fact that it's a three storey retail building. I think a ten storey condominium with tiny, old-fashioned retail at the bottom would fare MUCH better (though admittedly not wonderfully) than a Walmart.