[Midtown Urbanist]

As someone who lives in the general idea, bus service on Duplex will not fly well with the locals.

 

[Hopkins123]

I was thinking about the 59 Maple Leaf but the bus operates between Lawrence West Station to the Weston Rd and Oak area (goes through Benton an industrial area) before crossing keele St. Perhaps it might work somehow. it would have to go south to keelsdale and then turn around and continue the journey north. But passengers that get on at lawrence won't be happy that the bus goes south before it returns north again to continue its journey. Although passengers at keelsdale will be happy as they can avoid a transfer at Lawrence if they had to get on the Keele bus and live in the Weston area. Well, there are winners and losers in everything

Well actually, I envisioned it as more something like this:



This way instead of the huge meandering loop of Church, Weston and Oak; it would operate in a bi-directional manner via Pine Street. Short turns of either trips originating at Keelesdale or at Lawrence West could resume the original Church, Weston Oak loop though.

 

[Palma]

Meeting scheduled at York Civic Centre:
To discuss:
Integration of SmartTrack and RER
Electrification of GO
DRL and preferred route and next steps to select preferred alignment and stations
Scarborough subway
Integrated transit fares

Monday February 29, 2016
York Civic Centre
2700 Eglinton Ave West (west of Keele St)
Starts at 7:00pm

MPP and councillors for Ward 11 and 12 to be present

 

[Hopkins123]

Are you saying if there is a Jane stop on Crosstown west extension, there would be no terminal for the Jane bus and that it would need to come to Mt Dennis? That would be strange. Wouldn't there at least be a stop for the Jane bus and then it would continue north along Jane

Jane-Eglinton is perfectly set up for a bus terminal, if even for just Jane and Jane express buses (and the Emmett bus of course). Being in the flood plain in a valley floor, the Jane stop most likely will be on a elevated guideway, meaning the land use underneath the station at street level is well-suited for bus bays within a fare-paid area.

 

[Palma]

Well actually, I envisioned it as more something like this:



This way instead of the huge meandering loop of Church, Weston and Oak; it would operate in a bi-directional manner via Pine Street. Short turns of either trips originating at Keelesdale or at Lawrence West could resume the original Church, Weston Oak loop though.

So is that Tretheway that the bus would come down to keelesdale? How i hate this name

 

[Steve X]

Are you saying if there is a Jane stop on Crosstown west extension, there would be no terminal for the Jane bus and that it would need to come to Mt Dennis? That would be strange. Wouldn't there at least be a stop for the Jane bus and then it would continue north along Jane

It's all up in the air right now. The transit city plan is to have a LRT on Jane so a bus terminal wasn't necessary. The current stops will stay and people can transfer to the LRT. The bus terminal won't get that many years of use.

Well actually, I envisioned it as more something like this:



This way instead of the huge meandering loop of Church, Weston and Oak; it would operate in a bi-directional manner via Pine Street. Short turns of either trips originating at Keelesdale or at Lawrence West could resume the original Church, Weston Oak loop though.

This route isn't reliable. There are way too many places with congestion. Lawrence/Allen, Weston/Grey and Eglinton/Keele are all major points of congestion. The 58 is way better the way it is. What's wrong with short routes? They perform much better than a tangled mess. Plus what do you put on the designation sign? 58 Maple Leaf-Trethewey to Lawrence West Stn via Oak, Weston, Grey, Culford and Benton?

They could merge the 52G on The Westway with this new 58. Then all 52's will stay on Dixon which would be less confusing. Although having 58 on The Westway and 52 on Dixon is really messed up since it was the other way around not too long ago.

 

[Hopkins123]

So is that Tretheway that the bus would come down to keelesdale? How i hate this name

Yes, that's THREE-TO-WEE Drive from Keelesdale to Jane/Denison.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

I'm pretty sure it's TRE-THE-WAY, and it's one of my favourite street names in the city

 

[Hopkins123]

This route isn't reliable. There are way too many places with congestion. Lawrence/Allen, Weston/Grey and Eglinton/Keele are all major points of congestion. The 58 is way better the way it is. What's wrong with short routes? They perform much better than a tangled mess. Plus what do you put on the designation sign? 58 Maple Leaf-Trethewey to Lawrence West Stn via Oak, Weston, Grey, Culford and Benton?

They could merge the 52G on The Westway with this new 58. Then all 52's will stay on Dixon which would be less confusing. Although having 58 on The Westway and 52 on Dixon is really messed up since it was the other way around not too long ago.

But two of the congestion points you speak of are at the terminals themselves. Congestion would still exist at those points even if it wasn't a combined route. The 58 as is would only have like 10 stops. Milk-run routes (like what I'm proposing) capture so much more of where commuters want to go in and around their community. People in the Maple Leaf area may want a quick alternative over going to Lawrence West to get to Eglinton or the Crosstown Line, for instance.

Combing the 52G with the 58 via Weston is interesting, though commuters in Etobicoke may miss their direct connection to YUS. My proposal affects no one since the original 32C and 59 routings are kept in tact for the most part, main addition is the Pine Street extension which permits bidirectional travel.

 

[Johnny Au]

Here is my Roselawn/Castlefield Bus route proposal:

 

[Palma]

Here is my Roselawn/Castlefield Bus route proposal:

View attachment 67532

were you not joking

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Here is my Roselawn/Castlefield Bus route proposal:

View attachment 67532

Don't think that makes sense. It's very close to the Eglinton line.

 

[Steve X]

But two of the congestion points you speak of are at the terminals themselves. Congestion would still exist at those points even if it wasn't a combined route. The 58 as is would only have like 10 stops. Milk-run routes (like what I'm proposing) capture so much more of where commuters want to go in and around their community. People in the Maple Leaf area may want a quick alternative over going to Lawrence West to get to Eglinton or the Crosstown Line, for instance.

Combing the 52G with the 58 via Weston is interesting, though commuters in Etobicoke may miss their direct connection to YUS. My proposal affects no one since the original 32C and 59 routings are kept in tact for the most part, main addition is the Pine Street extension which permits bidirectional travel.

In PM rush hour, the congestion around Lawrence West is really bad. you can be stuck there for 10 minutes with a whole row of cars lined up from Dufferin to Allen. All because everyone is trying to merge in to the left lane to get on Allen. The right lane is usually filled with buses.

The 59 Maple Leaf bus hardly even runs in off peak. Evenings and weekends are at 30 min headway. The current 32C runs much more frequent. Even the current 171 gets a lot of riders taking it for 5 stops.

Hardly anyone in central Etobicoke take transit in the east-west direction. It's much faster to go down to line 2 than across to line 1. In North York/former Borough of York, going east-west is faster. It takes the same amount of time to get from Keele/Lawrence to Lawrence West and Keelesdale. The 52 is much more frequent. Guess where everyone is going to go?

 

[crs1026]

Today's public meeting at Richview Collegiate was apparently meant to be overview and consultation of all the various ML/City projects on the table, but the audience turned its focus directly towards the Crosstown West LRT proposal. Very vocal skepticism/opposition from local residents. The local MP, MPP, and two City councillors in attendance.

City staff positioned this as merely a reportback delivering their position that the Tory heavy rail option will not be recommended. Audience were one step ahead of them, turned this into "so why does this make LRT a given?"

Several speakers put BRT on the table. Staff responded that they would give this option greater profile and study. Next meeting in April will include reportback on BRT.

Much commentary about whether LRT implied a middle of road alignment, versus something more elaborate. Staff response - nothing is preferred at this point, but cost and time to construct being considerations. Planner present emphasised that City did preserve a 45m corridor and staff maintain that LRT will fit in this width.

Councillor made an interesting point that while Eglinton is heavily trafficked, once you pass East Mall, it disperses in many directions. There is no logical or prevailing "destination" for a transit line. (This kinda argues for a busway - routes fanning out at Renforth). Councillor indicated his own view that this project was not top of the list for him.

My personal observations
- I wonder how 45 meters width compares to Finch, Eglinton East, and Kingston Road - is this really enough to do anything more than a streetcar style center of road. The point was made that "LRT is not streetcar" but no one could provide assurance that CT West would deliver anything more than streetcar performance.
- Ridership numbers were challenged. Given the numbers we've seen are so low, this will assist the detractors.
- This is a pretty organized and well-connected community.
- There will have to be a good traffic plan, otherwise neighbourhood objections will be loud and long.

- Paul

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Much commentary about whether LRT implied a middle of road alignment, versus something more elaborate. Staff response - nothing is preferred at this point, but cost and time to construct being considerations. Planner present emphasised that City did preserve a 45m corridor and staff maintain that LRT will fit in this width.

I wonder how 45 meters width compares to Finch, Eglinton East, and Kingston Road - is this really enough to do anything more than a streetcar style center of road.

A side of road alignment shouldn't take up any more room than centre of road.

The point was made that "LRT is not streetcar" but no one could provide assurance that CT West would deliver anything more than streetcar performance.

The surface section, west of Mt. Dennis, with the stop spacing and alignment proposed in Transit City is expected to operate with an average speed of 28 to 31 km/h. This is faster than the Yonge-University and Bloor-Danforth lines, and 2.5 times faster than the 32 Eglinton West. This is all available in the Crosstown EA. It's too bad the planners didn't know this; it would've helped to dispel their worries.

Councillor made an interesting point that while Eglinton is heavily trafficked, once you pass East Mall, it disperses in many directions. There is no logical or prevailing "destination" for a transit line. (This kinda argues for a busway - routes fanning out at Renforth). Councillor indicated his own view that this project was not top of the list for him.

Which Councillor was this? Mr. Campbell?