How did 30 years of operating & capital cost get added to the initial construction costs?

How much would your car cost if you added 30 years of operating it to it?
 
robmausser said:
Ignoring the fabricated inflation to 5.5$ billion when including ongoing costs, 2.8$ billion for the capital costs of this project seem quite high. And almost triple the $1 billion estimate.

It would be interesting to know what happened
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This is Metrolinx were talking about--so good luck finding that out...
 
This government is the biggest joke in Canadian political history, right next to the United Conservative-Wildrose-Wexit Party in Alberta.

The ROI on this project would have more than made up for their initial $1+ billion invesment; so the fact that they decided to randomly come out today and magically inflate the cost to $5 billion in order to justify cancelling this LRT show how petty, short-sighted, and laughable this government is. All the money that has been spent on planning, land acquisition, utility works, etc.. has all been wasted for nothing. Let's get a running tally of how much the PCs have just wasted unnecessarily. And what we have 3 years left of this comedy gong-show?

This deluded government is going to pull us into a recession single handedly, forget about what's happening in the global economy. We'll see how much their tax credits will do for the thosands who will lose their jobs because of their idiotic lack of proper decision making.
 
And yet another study to spend on nothing concrete. This is the ultimate delay spending tactic, which is something I was counting on from Ford and the Conservatives. .
 
mrxbombastic said:
It's a complete lie they are selling. Full stop. The costs on Capital construction may have increased, but the $5.5 billion cost is a combination of Constructing+Financing+Maintenance+Operations. This is not a 5x balooning of costs. It's the assembling of a variety of costs which were implicit regardless of any Construction cost increases. For comparison: Finch W LRT and Missisauga LRT

Missisauga LRT:
$1.6 Billion in construction costs
$4.6 Billion RFP award which includes operations, maintenance, financing etc. Also operations are to be done by Transdev, the P3 partner.

Finch LRT:
$1.2 billion in construction costs *with 2 below grade stations*
$2.5 Billion RFP award which includes partial maintenance & financing for the private partners. TTC is covering all ops costs and some maintenance costs not included in that $2.5 billion iirc

both of those RFP awards were done by the Ford govt. I have no idea how on earth they get to $5.5 billion with the Hamilton LRT costs even including all those factors, the Hamilton system is less complex than the Missisauga LRT.

They need to release all their numbers so the public can see. I expect FOIs to be flying in any moment...

Correction: Metrolinx did not want Hamilton HSR to operate the LRT for it would have been in the p3 price.
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This is where it doesn't make sense. Hurontario is significantly more complex than Hamilton's LRT, I can't see Hamilton's line being twice as much. Hamilton's line is 2/3 the length, has 2 bridges and an underpass (while Mississauga has 5 overpasses, one underpass, and 2 underground stations).

It's only projected to carry 30K PPD, similar to iON.
innsertnamehere said:
One thing with the Hamilton LRT is that there is much more extensive land acquisition requirements. That alone is something like $100 million.

I'm sure the $5.5 number is using absolutely every trick in the book to inflate the cost however.

Edit: looking at the above the actual projected capital cost is $2.8 billion.

Hamilton LRT had some expensive parts, like the rail-rail grade seperation towards the east end of the project and the Longwood Bridge replacement, but generally speaking I'm surprised the number is that high.
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100M shouldn't double the price. Something else is at play, it could be a worker shortage, or something more sinister.

Operations also shouldn't cost 2 billion, especially when Eglinton's operation costs are unionised and are estimated to cost 2.4 billion over 30 years (no inflation)
 
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Cobra said:
They are pissing off the biggest voting bloc (millennials) who although tend not to vote as much will do so if provoked for too long
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I think you overestimate how much the generation that will opt for Lyft/Uber over a trip that could very easily be accomplished with a bus ride cares about transit
 
Hamilton's rebirth is still-born, at least until the next government revives this plan.
 
That's kind of ruthless. They are cancelling because they can afford to. Either they don't expect much electoral impact, or they figured they aren't getting seats in Hamilton anyway.

And then they don't even bother coming up with a good excuse.
 
micheal_can said:
The good thing is, with a different government, this is revivable.
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Im sorry to say this but with Fred Eisenberger in charge in Hamilton, it wont ever be done while he's in power. Even though he had no had in this cancellation, he's had 3 terms to deliver on this LRT and time and time again for whatever reason it has fallen through the cracks.

This is exactly what happens when contracts arent signed. The Finch West LRT was spared only because contracts were signed and locked in, while Hurontrario barely escaped the wrath. The main difference between Mississauga and Hamilton when you compare their LRT cases, is you guessed it politics! Mississauga has the all important 905 seats, Hamilton not so much
 
Amare said:
Im sorry to say this but with Fred Eisenberger in charge in Hamilton, it wont ever be done while he's in power. Even though he had no had in this cancellation, he's had 3 terms to deliver on this LRT and time and time again for whatever reason it has fallen through the cracks.

This is exactly what happens when contracts arent signed. The Finch West LRT was spared only because contracts were signed and locked in, while Hurontrario barely escaped the wrath. The main difference between Mississauga and Hamilton when you compare their LRT cases, is you guessed it politics! Mississauga has the all important 905 seats, Hamilton not so much
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If Finch or Hurontario balloon, they will go to. Both these projects are passed the 3 billion dollar mark.
 
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