also given all the hype in the past, this is probably the most anticipated building in Toronto. Whether it lives up to the expectations, that is another question.
 
interested said:
Given the present market, Great Gulf's excellent reputation, the location on 2 subway lines, and what Bazis sold, I would say Great Gulf would be foolish to sell at below $800/foot. In fact, I suspect they will offer upgraded packages for even more money and get it. Also, remember they paid alot for the land so they have to charge alot of money and whether you buy the hype or not, it really is a good location(though not Yorkville). Given that Trump/shangrila/4 Seasons/ Ritz are all at the $1000/sq. ft., and given the price of Aura the next closest thing assuming a very tall (?slender single or maybe 2 towers), I believe they will have no trouble getting $800+ a foot heading closer to $1000 for the higher floors (say 40 and above)
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It seems that downtown has become a play ground for the rich, super rich, lottery winners and, perhaps, foreign money.
 
KA1 said:
It seems that downtown has become a play ground for the rich, super rich, lottery winners and, perhaps, foreign money.
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Ka you are right. but this is no different than many cities in the world. 20 years ago, downtown Toronto was about 25% upper socioeconomic class, 45% middle and 35% lower class. The middle class is down to 25-30% now with a more or less even split between upper/lower socioeconomic class. I don't have the data in front of me but unfortunately, this tends to happen as the middle class with families is forced to move further out towards the suburbs as the costs to raise a family with any amount of livable space or a home in the city is prohibitive in many instances.
 
That being the case, as someone else had made a post in an another thread, with the rich, empty nesters moving in downtown area, perhaps, we will see a slow end of the 'social' scene as we know now -- cafe and restaurants open late in the night and other such activities. What say you?
 
KA1 said:
That being the case, as someone else had made a post in an another thread, with the rich, empty nesters moving in downtown area, perhaps, we will see a slow end of the 'social' scene as we know now -- cafe and restaurants open late in the night and other such activities. What say you?
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I don't think that necessarily follows. True, empty nesters will seek out different activities: theatre, roy thomson concerts, opera, ROM, AGO and not the "bars". however, restaurants will still thrive. those empty nesters moving downtown will be going for the "night life". The rest of the old geasers like myself will probably stay in Suburbia though we may go and spend a few days at a time in the City. It will be a slow evolution. You will have young people (Like I am guessing you are) and older people. what will hollow out will be the 30+'s with families. Other cities such as New York (Manhattan in particular) certainly have a very active night life/activities++ and it is certainly much more expensive to live than toronto(but then they have all the financial people and those crazy bonuses).
 
KA1 said:
That being the case, as someone else had made a post in an another thread, with the rich, empty nesters moving in downtown area, perhaps, we will see a slow end of the 'social' scene as we know now -- cafe and restaurants open late in the night and other such activities. What say you?
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Ka, if you are a younger person (say 30's as I suspect) shouldn't you be one of those people out tonight at the cafe's and restaurants?:)
 
It seems that downtown has become a play ground for the rich, super rich, lottery winners and, perhaps, foreign money.
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I wouldn't go that far as for every Four Seasons there is a half dozen glass "glass boxes" with 10 units per floor with an average size of 600 square feet.
 
maestro said:
I wouldn't go that far as for every Four Seasons there is a half dozen glass "glass boxes" with 10 units per floor with an average size of 600 square feet.
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Good point. But the 600 sq. ft. and smaller condos are usually young people or less affluent older people as a rule. As the young people become more affluent(more middle class) and they have families, they can either settle into 800 sq. ft downtown, or 1200 sq. ft mid town, or go to suburbia and get a 2000 sq. ft home. In the past at least, it has been the latter. The trend is continuing. that said, you are absolutely correct. These hi end projects represent less than 5% of the new condo construction. However, even mid range projects in the heart of the city are now starting at $500/sq. ft and usually in the $600-700 range which hardly makes it affordable for the "middle class with a young family".
 
interested said:
Ka, if you are a younger person (say 30's as I suspect) shouldn't you be one of those people out tonight at the cafe's and restaurants?:)
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No. I am not in 30's. As a matter of fact, if you promise to keep the secret, I am collecting OAS. It is just that I have lived in downtown area for a long long time. Old habits die hard. As soon as I make this post, I will be going for a walk and for a coffee. I gave up beer quite a few years ago.
 
However, even mid range projects in the heart of the city are now starting at $500/sq. ft and usually in the $600-700 range which hardly makes it affordable for the "middle class with a young family".
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I doubt the $500 to $700 price per square foot is sustainable. Wait until interest rates rise.

Also, the units being offered at those prices aren't geared towards families either. New build townhouses, especially freehold, are priced significantly less at $350 to $450 per square foot and likewise older resale condos can be found in the same range.

Professionals nowadays tend to have at least 10 years experience before nesting so a $800,000 2,000 sq/ft townhouse isn't completely out of reach.
 
Nice shots of the Kolter/Y+W proposal Mike. I'll bet the guy who carefully smuggled all those pics out of the City Planning office (long before they appeared on Y+W website) is pleased to see them re-posted after all these years (without proper acknowledgement of course). ;-)
 
$775 per square foot sounds about right. Four Seasons was $1k+ but I doubt this building will have the prestige of a Four Seasons. It's biggest selling point will be location rather than style. My guess is that Great Gulf tries to make it as cheap as possible so as to cash in strictly on the location. They will be somewhat realistic with the price because they want to sell out quickly for fear that rates will soon be hiked and home prices will tank.
 
wonder if they will be rolling this out this coming week? Rumours were the end of January....
 
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