[TheTigerMaster]

Ya.. new streetcars and a transit mall is enough for the west. But the east needs nothing but DRL, ST, GO RER, any other transit investment you could probably think of as well. ATC is insulting!

The RLL isn't for the east, but rather for everyone in our city and region who has to use Yonge Line or Bloor-Yonge Station (note that all of our Yonge relief efforts were undertaken to address Yonge Line and B-Y crowding and reliability issues, not to improve commutes in the east. That's merely a tertiary benefit)

I don't know how you can say ATC is insulting (presumably because it doesn't provide enough Yonge relief) and then complain that the only well performing Yonge relief option on the table shouldn't be built.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

I think the "problem" area is Etobicoke Lakeshore/Humber Bay - and it's probably going to worse given the Christie site and gawd knows if the Food Terminal is going to go.

AoD

We've needed to address that area for decades. The first waterfront transit studies were back in the 90s. Lets hurry up and move forward with it.

 

[minilude]

I think the "problem" area is Etobicoke Lakeshore/Humber Bay - and it's probably going to worse given the Christie site and gawd knows if the Food Terminal is going to go.

AoD

I think Metrolinx is on the page of a Park Lawn station.

 

[Filip]

We've needed to address that area for decades. The first waterfront transit studies were back in the 90s. Lets hurry up and move forward with it.

Wishful thinking won't improve my commute. What's the TTC planning that is relevant to personal timelines (ie: under 10 years)?

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Wishful thinking won't improve my commute. What's the TTC planning that is relevant to personal timelines (ie: under 10 years)?

King Street transit mall (less than one year) and Park Lawn GO stations (less than 5 years) are the only deliverables under 10 years. Relief Line wouldn't be available for at least 15 years, even if we begun work on it today.

 

[Filip]

King Street transit mall (less than one year) and Park Lawn GO stations (less than 5 years) are the only deliverables under 10 years. Relief Line wouldn't be available for at least 15 years, even if we begun work on it today.

It'd be nice if Lake Shore streetcars are routed via the King Mall vs. Queen. Queen is the problem. Is that the plan?

Also, I always thought Park Lawn GO will take much longer than under 5 years. If you've heard something else, that's really encouraging.

 

[DonValleyRainbow]

My only view on phasing is that Phase I should go north of Danforth to the Don Valley. If we know we want to extend it north so be reasonably effective, might as well take the TBMs that are already in the ground and push them further north. It doesn't even need to have stations built north of Danforth, and I know that this is the argument for DRL West too. But at least the Don Valley is a known physical barrier that will require a bridge vs. a tunnel. The DRL west of University...there seems to be multiple candidates for where to pull the TBMs out.

 

[minilude]

It's not secret TTC and Toronto Council's poor planning is jeopardizing not only Toronto citizens but also the entire region. Also it's really amazing that Toronto needs 15 years to physically construct (not the political battles) a subway...what's so different for the Toronto construction workers than the rest of the world? do they just punch one nail while others can punch 10?

 

[Filip]

It's not secret TTC and Toronto Council's poor planning is jeopardizing not only Toronto citizens but also the entire region. Also it's really amazing that Toronto needs 15 years to physically construct (not the political battles) a subway...what's so different for the Toronto construction workers than the rest of the world? do they just punch one nail while others can punch 10?

Madrid built something along the lines of 200km of subway in 15 years.

But Toronto.. We have a high watertable.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Madrid built something along the lines of 200km of subway in 15 years.

But Toronto.. We have a high watertable.

It helps that they had constant funding (among other efficiencies and luck). Well. I will be spending a week in Madrid in May soaking in the Spanish Solution (ironically, just a few days after they closed Line 1 for months of repair work).

AoD

 

[DonValleyRainbow]

This is a great piece I had to share. Edward Keenan just tears it up.

Why Vaughan should stay out of Toronto transportation planning: Keenan

Have you ever been to Vaughan? From what I can tell from my admittedly brief visits, it is a dystopian suburban hellscape of endless asphalt dotted with scrubgrass and children’s birthday party venues. It feels like an asphalt version of the vast desert autodrome battlegrounds of Mad Max: Fury Road, except with some roller coasters.

It looks more like horror movie screenwriting than urban planning to me, but I long ago resolved not to stick my nose, or any other part of my body, into the business of Vaughanwegians. (Vaughntonians? Vaghanians?) Live and let live. Still, it strikes me as a good rule of thumb to never accept transportation planning advice from a member of that city’s government.

This is a rule that bears repeating, since Vaughan councillor Alan Shefman took it on himself last week to challenge Toronto’s “no-capacity mythology” when it comes to the Yonge subway line.

It appears Shefman was actually trying to suggest that there is space for more passengers. A bunch of city officials from York Region have been pushing to have the Yonge line extended north into Richmond Hill (a neighbour city of Vaughan’s, up there in the northlands above Toronto), and as they make their pitch to the federal Liberals for funding, Shefman was suggesting that project could proceed before 416 transit priorities such as the downtown relief subway line.

There are two possibilities here. One is that Shefman is a clown. Anyone who has ever seen a famous clown-car routine, in which dozens of bozos will come parading out of a Volkswagon Beetle, will know that clowns have a different idea of transportation capacity than the rest of us. It could be that Shefman simply sees entertaining circus-style public transportation opportunities in having riders fold their bodies under seats and sit atop each other’s shoulders and whatnot.

The other possibility is that Shefman simply doesn’t know what he’s talking about.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

It'd be nice if Lake Shore streetcars are routed via the King Mall vs. Queen. Queen is the problem. Is that the plan?

Also, I always thought Park Lawn GO will take much longer than under 5 years. If you've heard something else, that's really encouraging.

The plan is being developed still. But seeing how much of an issue the Queensway car reliability has been for the TTC, I see no reasons why they wouldn't create a new Queensway-King streetcar line to improve reliability.

 

[Tuck]

Ideally the DRL won't have to be extended to Sheppard because they'll have built it the whole way from the beginning. It's clear only building it to pape won't provide the needed relief. The west section should be built, and hopefully they don't wait till the East side is done before they start. But it's clear that the East side is more crucial.

This is a great piece I had to share. Edward Keenan just tears it up.

Why Vaughan should stay out of Toronto transportation planning: Keenan

Must say, I really enjoy reading Keenan's articles. He's generally on point, and his articles are witty and fun to read.

His description of Vaughan is also extremely accurate...

 

[Canadian Chocho]

Having been raised in Richmond Hill, I concur with his description of Vaughan.

 

[rbt]

"SmartTrack" ... won't have TTC fares,

I'm finding, increasingly, that's probably not the case. It'll very likely have exact TTC fares for the same trip. What's becoming clear is TTC 2016 fares != TTC 2022 fares.

Tory might not let Metrolinx boost them this term but whomever comes next may have to; we've really loaded up on the cities spending/debt obligations with very little in added revenue, and TTC has a ton of necessary stuff still unfunded.

But yeah, without 5 minute frequencies it's going to be pretty ineffective.