[TransitBart]

We are certainly closer now that $150M of taxpayer money has been committed.

Someone else can confirm it to @BurlOak, but I believe that the $150.0M is clearly for taking The Relief Line from here to shovel ready, not only for Pape to Osgoode, but for the big-J which encompasses Don Mills to Dundas West. It is the city whose plans only encompass Pape to Osgoode. Metrolinx has discarded the short line because it does not provide sufficient volume relief on Line 1.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Someone else can confirm it to @BurlOak, but I believe that the $150.0M is clearly for taking The Relief Line from here to shovel ready, not only for Pape to Osgoode, but for the big-J which encompasses Don Mills to Dundas West

This is true.

It is the city whose plans only encompass Pape to Osgoode

This isn't true. In Spring 2016, the City of a Toronto approved plans to move forward with the entire Relief Line, from Dundas West to Sheppard-Don Mills.

Toronto City Planning is currently finalizing plans for the Relief Line Short, from Downtown to Danforth. The TPAP and project design for that project will be initalized in early 2017 and concluded later that year, bringing that phase of the project to shovel-ready status. Immediately thereafter (should be around late 2017/early 2018), Toronto City has said they will begin planning for the extension from Danforth to Sheppard. This includes the TPAP and project design, which will bring that extension to shovel-ready status. I haven't seen any timeline for completion of that phase, but based on prior projects, I'd expect the Relief Line extension to Sheppard to be shovel ready in 2020/20201. Immediately after planning for the extension to Sheppard is complete, Toronto City Planning will commence planning work on the western extension to Dundas West Station.

We're really close to changing gears on the Relief Line. In a years time we should be seeing a lot of work on the extension to Sheppard. Alignments, station locations, service planning and all that good stuff UT gets excited about. Exciting times.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

When will the construction of this actually start? Is there already funding? Has the specifics been worried out? Will I be dead before this begins?

If funding materializes without delay? It can be under construction 2018 to 2019, depending on how long the certain design details take to complete.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

It is unfunded, and the alignment has not yet been decided, though the province recently committed $150M to usher along the next part of the planning/design phase. Publicly, officials have said the project will take at least 10 years from commencement, though that clock has not yet started, and they acknowledge they'll know more regarding timing as the design phase progresses.

The alignment has was chosen a few months ago

http://urbantoronto.ca/news/2016/06/relief-line-preferred-alignment-now-includes-unilever-stop

 

[ADRM]

The alignment has was chosen a few months ago

http://urbantoronto.ca/news/2016/06/relief-line-preferred-alignment-now-includes-unilever-stop

It was not chosen. A preferred corridor was identified, as that article states.

 

[DonValleyRainbow]

This isn't true. In Spring 2016, the City of a Toronto approved plans to move forward with the entire Relief Line, from Dundas West to Sheppard-Don Mills.

Toronto City Planning is currently finalizing plans for the Relief Line Short, from Downtown to Danforth. The TPAP and project design for that project will be initalized in early 2017 and concluded later that year, bringing that phase of the project to shovel-ready status. Immediately thereafter (should be around late 2017/early 2018), Toronto City has said they will begin planning for the extension from Danforth to Sheppard. This includes the TPAP and project design, which will bring that extension to shovel-ready status. I haven't seen any timeline for completion of that phase, but based on prior projects, I'd expect the Relief Line extension to Sheppard to be shovel ready in 2020/20201. Immediately after planning for the extension to Sheppard is complete, Toronto City Planning will commence planning work on the western extension to Dundas West Station.

We're really close to changing gears on the Relief Line. In a years time we should be seeing a lot of work on the extension to Sheppard. Alignments, station locations, service planning and all that good stuff UT gets excited about. Exciting times.

Can you provide sources? My understanding, from meetings on March 31-April 1, 2016 and July 12-15, 2016, approved the Pape-Eastern-Queen alignment for the Relief Line between Danforth and downtown, and authorize the City Manager and Andy Byford to "develop a Terms of Reference with the Province of Ontario and Metrolinx to advance the next phases of planning and design for the Relief Line, including extensions of the Relief Line north to Sheppard Avenue and west to the Bloor Subway line."

That is not approving the extensions, just discussions about them. I wouldn't nitpick about this stuff, but it's Toronto City Council, so...

 

[W. K. Lis]

...including extensions of the Relief Line north to Sheppard Avenue and west to the Bloor Subway line."...

Likely there will be tail tracks at each end of phase one, where trains could be stored if needed. Those tail tracks could then be put into revenue service after the extensions are constructed.

 

[Hopkins123]

Ideal DRL phases:

Bloor (Dundas West or Keele) to Danforth (Pape) - Phase 1
Eglinton (Mt Dennis) to Eglinton (Science Centre) - Phase 2
Finch (Humber College) to Finch (Seneca College)- Phase 3

 

[TheTigerMaster]

Can you provide sources? My understanding, from meetings on March 31-April 1, 2016 and July 12-15, 2016, approved the Pape-Eastern-Queen alignment for the Relief Line between Danforth and downtown, and authorize the City Manager and Andy Byford to "develop a Terms of Reference with the Province of Ontario and Metrolinx to advance the next phases of planning and design for the Relief Line, including extensions of the Relief Line north to Sheppard Avenue and west to the Bloor Subway line."

That is not approving the extensions, just discussions about them. I wouldn't nitpick about this stuff, but it's Toronto City Council, so...

Well what is really "approving" the extensions? It takes multiple votes to get it to construction; no one vote will approve it.

In any case, City Planning has the money to move forward on the planning for the northern and western extensions, and planning for the northern extension will begin in the near future.

Jennifer Keesmaat discussed the phasing of the planning for the Relief Line extension in a tweet thread back in the summer. Steve Munro summarized it:

"According to Chief Planner Jennifer Keesmaat (whose Twitter session is in progress as I write this), study of the RL will focus initially on Phase 1 (Danforth to downtown), but will then shift to the northern and western extensions. The northern extension is of particular importance because, according to Metrolinx demand projections, it will have a major effect in offloading demand from the Yonge Subway and the Bloor-Yonge interchange."

 

[crs1026]

Well what is really "approving" the extensions? It takes multiple votes to get it to construction; no one vote will approve it.
"

It's all fingers crossed until it actually goes to tender, but - My acid test for whether a project is moving in this city is a) if there is money being provided and b) if the votes at Council move the project ahead versus asking for more study, or deferring some key milestone, or ducking some tough decision.

The amount of money advanced by the Province for planning and design is significant - far beyond what would be provided if the agenda were to defer it or let it die under study. Even this Provincial Government knows better than to spend this much money with no end product.

So far Council has directed this to move forward. The votes on alignment and scope haven't been ducked.

So I'd argue, yes it's moving.

- Paul

 

[Midtown Urbanist]

Ideal DRL phases:

Bloor (Dundas West or Keele) to Danforth (Pape) - Phase 1
Eglinton (Mt Dennis) to Eglinton (Science Centre) - Phase 2
Finch (Humber College) to Finch (Seneca College)- Phase 3

I hope to reach Sheppard as part of Phase 2 on the east side.

It is needed for the Yonge line, and an easy project to do, relatively speaking.

 

[denfromoakvillemilton]

I hope to reach Sheppard as part of Phase 2 on the east side.

It is needed for the Yonge line, and an easy project to do, relatively speaking.

Yeah. The sheppard Don Mills Rd part will be the easiest to tunnel/dig up. Well except the Don Mills/York Mills intersection. I don't know how they'll fit a subway in that area.

 

[DonValleyRainbow]

Well what is really "approving" the extensions? It takes multiple votes to get it to construction; no one vote will approve it.

It's all fingers crossed until it actually goes to tender, but - My acid test for whether a project is moving in this city is a) if there is money being provided and b) if the votes at Council move the project ahead versus asking for more study, or deferring some key milestone, or ducking some tough decision.

Well I'd say a motion goes through that says "City Council approve...", like with 'SmartTrack' and Eglinton West in item 1 of the July meeting I linked to. If not that, a motion directing the start of shovels in the ground.

 

[gweed123]

Ideal DRL phases:

Bloor (Dundas West or Keele) to Danforth (Pape) - Phase 1
Eglinton (Mt Dennis) to Eglinton (Science Centre) - Phase 2
Finch (Humber College) to Finch (Seneca College)- Phase 3

I think we're more likely to see this:
Phase 1 - Pape to Osgoode
Phase 2 - Pape to Eglinton
Phase 3 - Eglinton to Sheppard
Phase 4 - Osgoode to Dundas West or Dufferin (preferably Dufferin)

Yeah. The sheppard Don Mills Rd part will be the easiest to tunnel/dig up. Well except the Don Mills/York Mills intersection. I don't know how they'll fit a subway in that area.

They managed to do it around the Leslie & Sheppard intersection. Similar topography.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

It's all fingers crossed until it actually goes to tender, but - My acid test for whether a project is moving in this city is a) if there is money being provided and b) if the votes at Council move the project ahead versus asking for more study, or deferring some key milestone, or ducking some tough decision.

The amount of money advanced by the Province for planning and design is significant - far beyond what would be provided if the agenda were to defer it or let it die under study. Even this Provincial Government knows better than to spend this much money with no end product.

So far Council has directed this to move forward. The votes on alignment and scope haven't been ducked.

So I'd argue, yes it's moving.

- Paul

Hopefully the Relief Line extension to Sheppard will be undergoing significant planning before the 2018 elections. That would be the ideal time for parties and candidates to add it to the platform.