Stations near freeway unless situated by a very big employer {such as U. of Calgary LRT station in the median of the Crowchild Trail} usually get lower ridership than those in high density residential.

That should have nothing to do with the fact that Toronto needs far more transit than a little DRL can offer and a Toronto-only GO Rex system using tram-trains is an excellent and, unlike the DRL, affordable idea.
 
M II A II R II K said:
It can also approximate and diverge at times from the rail corridor, doesn't have to actually be in it for the whole route.
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Rail corridors actually have very few underground utilities (sewers, gas lines, etc.) to worry about so it is almost ideal if TBM construction is used and a route is needed where there will be no stations. Although, I think we would definately want a station at/under the rail line, at least one in the East and one in the West.
 
Platform 27 said:
Disagree.

Eglinton: 79,670
Eglinton West: 21,510 (27% of Yonge)

Lawrence: 25,040
Lawrence West: 21,940 (88% of Yonge)

York Mills: 28,400
Wilson: 19,620 (69% of Yonge)

Sheppard: 75,190
Downsview: 38,710 (51% of Yonge)

IMO, only Lawrence West meets the "aren't much lower ridership than their Yonge counterparts" definition, and that's a bit of a push because Lawrence Station (on Yonge) has aberrantly low ridership owing from its "missing" eastern bus feeder. (Admittedly, Sheppard and Downsview probably aren't the best pairing to draw conclusions from, although whatever distortion the former gets from being fed by a subway is countered in part by Downsview's heavy north-south bus feeders from York U and elsewhere.)

Demographically, the Allan ridershed is a lot less affluent than the Yonge one, so I imagine all things being equal you'd expect higher ridership there rather than lower. The built form definitely plays a major part.
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It looks like rapid transit stations isolated in highway and railway corridors generally have lower ridership. They serve their neighbourhoods worse because it's harder for people to get to them. You can save money building in these corridors, but people in the surrounding neighbourhoods will have inferior access to the transit service for perhaps a century. Lawrence East under a bridge on the Scarborough RT has 8,770 daily ridership. I hate getting off at any subway station isolated in a transporation corridor if I'm walking out of the station (not taking a connecting bus). Crossing ramps, walking through isolated areas on small sidewalks--it's not pedestrian friendly.

If you build a subway station at Dupont and Dundas in the Junction by the railway corridor, that station would miss most of the neighbourhood's population and its commercial heart west of Keele. It would only intercept such trivial bus routes such as the 26 Dupont and the 40 Junction.
 
junctionist:

It doesn't help that Eglinton West, Lawrence West and Downsview isn't exactly surrounding by high density developments, like Eglinton or Sheppard.

AoD
 
Tram-trains/LRT vehicles could take someone right from Mavern Centre or Humber College right to Union station in less than half the time of taking the bus/SRT/BD/Yonge lines or the Spadina/Finch LRT line. They travel most {or all} of the route along current GO corridor but can merge off to regular roads to get rid of the dreaded last mile.

They are Toronto's best option for bring mass/rapid transit to all areas of the city and yes, the city can afford it and have it much of it up and running in less than 3 years.
 
There has to be a bold major plan with clearly defined timetables and funding to support it. If not then it won't be until the 2050s when transit is satisfactory with driverless pods and cars in conjunction with robotic elements to build infrastructure at high speeds and stuff.

The less than enthusiastic Transit City plan will probably only end up seeing a fraction of the whole thing built, with half ass hacked on transfer extensions that are the product of a botched banged up transit planning, which also doesn't have any relief element to them, and quite the contrary when they are dumped by them to existing lines.
 
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Too bad we don't have a DRL (any route alignment) now. In October, starting during the Thanksgiving weekend (see this link) the whole or parts of the Yonge University line south of Bloor will be closed for up to nine days.

The closures start Thanksgiving weekend:

  • The line will be closed from Bloor to St. George stations from Saturday, Oct. 12 to Monday, Oct. 14
  • When riders need to head back to work after turkey day, the line will still be closed from King to Osgoode stations from Tuesday, Oct. 15 to Friday, Oct. 18
  • The line will again be closed from Bloor to St. George stations from Saturday, Oct. 19 to Sunday, Oct. 20
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If we had any DRL now, at least it would be an very good alternate route to get downtown.

No Union Station for nine days!
 
Platform 27 said:
IMO, only Lawrence West meets the "aren't much lower ridership than their Yonge counterparts" definition, and that's a bit of a push because Lawrence Station (on Yonge) has aberrantly low ridership owing from its "missing" eastern bus feeder. (Admittedly, Sheppard and Downsview probably aren't the best pairing to draw conclusions from, although whatever distortion the former gets from being fed by a subway is countered in part by Downsview's heavy north-south bus feeders from York U and elsewhere.)

Demographically, the Allan ridershed is a lot less affluent than the Yonge one, so I imagine all things being equal you'd expect higher ridership there rather than lower. The built form definitely plays a major part.
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The entire University-Spadina Line has about ~60% of Yonge's ridership. Once you normalize the Allan stations against that there's no difference. Osgoode's ridership is, what, 30% of Queen's? It's consistent no matter where you look on the line vs. Yonge.

Other than that...

Downsview's not in the Allan median, so it hardly makes a case either way. It also doesn't have the benefit of being the only transfer point for another subway line like Sheppard.

Wilson's definitely lower ridership than York Mills, but you're ignoring Yorkdale, which is comparable to York Mills.

The only station which is really unambiguously lower ridership than its Yonge counterpart is Eglinton West. Part of this is that Eglinton West hasn't been developed as intensively as Yonge and Eg, but by far the bigger factor is the dearth of connecting routes compared to the bus terminal at Eglinton.

Which was really my entire point, that in response to TOW, most rapid transit users get there via some other form of transit. That doesn't negate the point that transit has to serve origins and destinations (duh...). Just that the majority of origins will always be transfers from local transit anyways.
 
junctionist said:
It looks like rapid transit stations isolated in highway and railway corridors generally have lower ridership. They serve their neighbourhoods worse because it's harder for people to get to them. You can save money building in these corridors, but people in the surrounding neighbourhoods will have inferior access to the transit service for perhaps a century. Lawrence East under a bridge on the Scarborough RT has 8,770 daily ridership. I hate getting off at any subway station isolated in a transporation corridor if I'm walking out of the station (not taking a connecting bus). Crossing ramps, walking through isolated areas on small sidewalks--it's not pedestrian friendly.

If you build a subway station at Dupont and Dundas in the Junction by the railway corridor, that station would miss most of the neighbourhood's population and its commercial heart west of Keele. It would only intercept such trivial bus routes such as the 26 Dupont and the 40 Junction.
Click to expand...

40 junction is a major route. I take it almost everyday and it's consistently full, and runs every 6 minutes most of the time.

Dundas and dupont really is not a bad location for a station in this neighbourhood. It's a very short walk to where the most popular businesses are currently, and development is going to continue eastward in this neighbourhood anyway.
 
nrb said:
40 junction is a major route. I take it almost everyday and it's consistently full, and runs every 6 minutes most of the time.

Dundas and dupont really is not a bad location for a station in this neighbourhood. It's a very short walk to where the most popular businesses are currently, and development is going to continue eastward in this neighbourhood anyway.
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And where do you put the station since this is where the Georgetown/KW lines go under CP tracks starting at Dupont?? No room south of it since there are 4 tracks closely space together for the underpass.
 
All these dreams mean nothing ..........Toronto doesn't have the money!

Toronto does have the money to create a large tram-train system and initially could be up and running as soon as the trains arrive.
 
nrb said:
40 junction is a major route. I take it almost everyday and it's consistently full, and runs every 6 minutes most of the time.

Dundas and dupont really is not a bad location for a station in this neighbourhood. It's a very short walk to where the most popular businesses are currently, and development is going to continue eastward in this neighbourhood anyway.
Click to expand...

Average weekday ridership on the 40 Junction is just 4,800 people. By comparison, 41 Keele's ridership is 24,600. Intercepting the Keele bus with a station on Keele in the Junction would be better from a network perspective for another point of relief for the Bloor-Danforth line (which will probably need relief in the next decades). Most businesses in the area are west of Keele, so the Dupont and Dundas location wouldn't serve the business core of the neighbourhood well. There isn't much development that's going to happen around Dupont and Dundas; there's no land for it.
 
ssiguy2 said:
All these dreams mean nothing ..........Toronto doesn't have the money!

Toronto does have the money to create a large tram-train system and initially could be up and running as soon as the trains arrive.
Click to expand...

And who told you they even have the money for even that?
 
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