[44 North]

Assuming it will be at Bay St and called "City Hall" station. Wonder what will happen to the connections with Osgoode and Queen Station.

Oh right, I guess we don't know how they'll deal with that. One station leading right into City Hall would be interesting...not unlike a kid's book from decades ago. Perhaps Robert Munsch was more of a visionary than people realized.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Probably easier to service that with Smarttrack/RER? Swinging the subway down there would probably be redundant if ST happens.

No doubt, but I was under the impression that having subway access is almost a must have. Guess not!

As to the City Hall station - I wonder if it is going to be an analogue to the current St. George-Bay-Yonge/Bloor arrangement vs. just having a single station serving as an informal interchange for both lines.

AoD

 

[raptor]

If only the new "City Hall" station had pedestrian (ie, tunnel) connections to BOTH Osgoode and Queen stations...

 

[innsertnamehere]

I'm happy with the recommendations. But I suppose this means no more Queen Streetcar. It's hard to imagine Queen without streetcars. It's part of the identity of that street.

They were pretty clear that the existing Streetcar routes would be going nowhere at previous public meetings.

What we will likely see though is Queen going 8-10 years without a streetcar while the line is built.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

If only the new "City Hall" station had pedestrian (ie, tunnel) connections to BOTH Osgoode and Queen stations...

It could be done, but the experience will not be ideal - and not efficient (probably even worse than the current Yonge/Bloor T interchange - this will be a L)

AoD

 

[gweed123]

If only the new "City Hall" station had pedestrian (ie, tunnel) connections to BOTH Osgoode and Queen stations...

Personally, if Queen is the choice (I still don't think it's the best choice, but I digress), I'd like to see City Hall Station centred in front of the Old City Hall. That way the east end can be at Yonge and the west end at Bay. That would open up the opportunity to have a station further west stretch from University to around Duncan. This would also then provide adequate spacing for a station centred at Spadina.

 

[DonValleyRainbow]

If we assume if there's no green, it's a no-go, that makes a short list of 5 options for the CBD.

1. Queen and Osgoode
2. City Hall
3. King and St Andrew
4. Financial
5. Exchange

Where it goes would probably be dependent on:

• Station evaluation to the east
• Whether being closer to Liberty Village outweighs cannibalizing ridership for the Waterfront West LRT
• Mayor Tory's desire to do a favour for First Gulf
• Whatever hairbrained ideas councillors come up with

I think it is safe to say the days are limited for Moss Park and Gerrard Square. The big surprise is no linkage to Unilever.

AoD

 

[ottbike]

The good thing about putting a station at City Hall is that they have alot of room to work with when building the station box.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

That would open up the opportunity to have a station further west stretch from University to around Duncan. This would also then provide adequate spacing for a station centred at Spadina.

My fantasy in that case would be cut and cover bury the Spadina from Wellington to College - the most intractable part of the route.

AoD

 

[gweed123]

My fantasy in that case would be cut and cover bury the Spadina from Wellington to College - the most intractable part of the route.

AoD

That would be very helpful! An underground connection at Spadina would be a huge bonus. It would also basically turn the median of that section of Spadina into a University Ave-style boulevard.

 

[Forgotten]

King would be a lousy choice. PATH is to elaborate so it would be a technical nightmare, cost a king's ransom, and the tunnels would be 10 feet short of China to make it all possible. Also King will already have ST /RER/GO so it already has the best transit connections in the city.

Queen is the natural alternative not only because it would more new riders but Queen is a more important commercial and pedestrian strip than King. Also Queen would be the easiest to build under. The biggest problem when building underground is interchange stations with other subway lines and Queen will be as easy as it gets as opposed to any other downtown street. The Queen underground station is there and yes it would have to be completely redesigned and expanded but it is still there. It would get rid of the most of the tunnelling under Yonge station.

Due to Queen station, Osgood was also designed with a Queen subway in mind. The assumption was made that it would be the crosstown route and hence Osgood station has all clearances for plumbing, sewer, electrical etc for the eventuality of a station and this is a bonus that other stations don't have. Queen's PATH system is relatively small and I think there should be subway access to City Hall.

To me Queen is not only the superior choice but also the easiest, less disruptive, and cheapest to boot.

You never lived in Ontario or Toronto but you are always here lecturing us on what's best for us because we don't know about anything????

 

[ShonTron]

I'm happy with the recommendations. But I suppose this means no more Queen Streetcar. It's hard to imagine Queen without streetcars. It's part of the identity of that street.

There is both a streetcar/LRT and heavy rail metro tunnel beneath Market Street in San Francisco. Above, you've got streetcars (heritage PCCs!), trolley buses and diesel buses. I wouldn't worry about the 501.

 

[Edward Skira]

A cool map showing why this is needed.

 

[ShonTron]

It's worth noting that Metrolinx looked at a Queen Street DRL alignment as part of a study evaluating options for Union Station capacity.

Look at alternative 4B here. [PDF] The Georgetown and Barrie Lines (I guess you could add Milton too) terminating at a new station at Spadina and Front. The Queen Subway dipping south to serve it.

I can see why Planning Staff and Mayor Tory would be on board with this plan, and with the Scarborough plans as well. A Queen Relief Line alignment doesn't compete with SmartTrack, avoiding Unilever. If Metrlolinx goes ahead with the option mentioned above, it will also free up capacity at Union Station for SmartTrack.

I think the pieces are falling into place.

 

[gweed123]

There is both a streetcar/LRT and heavy rail metro tunnel beneath Market Street in San Francisco. Above, you've got streetcars (heritage PCCs!), trolley buses and diesel buses. I wouldn't worry about the 501.

That type of setup would be awesome if the lower level was RER trains and the top level was for LRVs.

EDIT: Looks like that kind of setup was investigated in the report ShonTron linked. Option 5.