BTW -- just finished my expenses. Due to the crappy CAD, my CAD44.00 return fare, CAD22 each way even given the Presto charge that will drop to CAD19 each way next time, cost the bank USD33.66 total. Very, very cheap for a much better travel experience than a taxi/limo.
 
Just came across an interesting article that pointed me to Denver's new rail plans to the airport which should be finished next year. I hadn't read much about it before, and thought it made an interesting comparison to UPX. If you haven't been to Denver, the airport is quite far from the city...you drive along a highway with tumbleweed fences for a good chunk of it before arriving. Here's the website for the Denver system: http://www.rtd-denver.com/a-line.shtml
  • Distance: UPX: 14.5 miles, Denver: 23 miles
  • Stations: UPX: 4 (including termini), Denver: 8 (including termini)
  • Time to Airport from Union Stations: UPX: 25 minutes, Denver: 37 minutes
  • Effective speed to airports: UPX: 34.8 mph, Denver: 37.3 mph
  • Rolling Stock: UPX: Nippon Sharyo Diesel Multiple Units, Denver: Silverliner V (Electric)
  • Fare Union to Airport: UPX: $27.50 ($19 with Presto), Denver: $9 (shorter distance fares $2.60-$4.50)
 
Napoleon said:
Just came across an interesting article that pointed me to Denver's new rail plans to the airport which should be finished next year. I hadn't read much about it before, and thought it made an interesting comparison to UPX. If you haven't been to Denver, the airport is quite far from the city...you drive along a highway with tumbleweed fences for a good chunk of it before arriving. Here's the website for the Denver system: http://www.rtd-denver.com/a-line.shtml
  • Distance: UPX: 14.5 miles, Denver: 23 miles
  • Stations: UPX: 4 (including termini), Denver: 8 (including termini)
  • Time to Airport from Union Stations: UPX: 25 minutes, Denver: 37 minutes
  • Effective speed to airports: UPX: 34.8 mph, Denver: 37.3 mph
  • Rolling Stock: UPX: Nippon Sharyo Diesel Multiple Units, Denver: Silverliner V (Electric)
  • Fare Union to Airport: UPX: $27.50 ($19 with Presto), Denver: $9 (shorter distance fares $2.60-$4.50)
Click to expand...
Denver RTD got $1bn from the Feds for their heavy rail projects which included the airport line. I think UPX might have gotten Fed $ from somewhere but it wasn't on anything like that scale. Am interested to see how the Denver Silverliners work out as the build quality of the SEPTA ones wasn't universally liked there.
 
Took the UPX for the first time from the airport. Conclusion is that it doesn't really save much time (10 minutes tops, and I live within 15 minutes walking of Union) compared with subways+192, but it is definitely more comfortable and less stressful.
 
I'm still going to wait for ridership stats to accumulate to next summer. But if the UPX can't achieve its ridership targets, there will need to be a serious discussion about it and what it's future should be.

I certainly concerned that this is supposed to be an express train, yet it takes 25 minutes and stops at Bloor (which seems intuitive) and Weston (which was merely appeasing local residents; not NIMBYs, as IMO they rightly fought against having their community divided, but they should have stopped short and only gave them the tunnel). Seems few people are utilizing these stops.

Looking on the horizon, we have two potential future upgrades to the UPX: electrification (which will reduce travel time) and a stop at Mt Dennis (increasing time). We also have rapid transit connections that are on Metrolinx's books: westerly extensions of the Eglinton Crosstown (f*ck the SmartTrack nonsense) and the Finch West LRTs, as well as BRT on the 427. This will undoubtedly eat into ridership, but it also makes the demands to transform UPX into local transit a mute point.

I think Metrolinx will have to buck up and get back to basics: this is an express link between Pearson and Union, Canada's two busiest transportation hubs. Cut out the stops between, electrify, and adjust the price to something more palatable. I think this has the potential to be 15-for-15: a non-stop 15-minute train ride for $15. And please, no stupid promo videos, just focus on wayfinding.
 
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DonValleyRainbow said:
I think Metrolinx will have to buck up and get back to basics: this is an express link between Pearson and Union, Canada's two busiest transportation hubs. Cut out the stops between, electrify, and adjust the price to something more palatable. I think this has the potential to be 15-for-15: a non-stop 15-minute train ride for $15. And please, no stupid promo videos, just focus on wayfinding.
Click to expand...

Why is $15 for 15mn palatable, but not $19 for 25mn? How will saving 10mn on a trip to the airport change the ridership dynamics (you then have to stand in line with your luggage at the terminal, and go through security checks to get to your gate)? How will saving $4 change your mind about the hassle / non-hassle of getting to Union as opposed to grabbing a cab from College and University?
 
The thing that makes the UPX even more of a money loser {which Metrolinx refuses to acknowledge} is that it also costs the prov/feds lost revenue due to being a business write-off. Metrolinx keeps telling everyone that this is a business line but make no mistake, business people may use it but they are not paying for it. They will write it off as a business expense which costs the government way more money than the standard transit credit by the feds.

All Metrolinx has to do to get them selves out of this mess which has done nothing but bring ire from taxpayers and undermined all their credibility is do a trial. Basically they can make a public announcement that they are cutting fares by 50% for 6 months and if ridership grows by 50& then it will continue but if it doesn't and it ends up costing more money then end the trial. Basically they will be saying "use it or lose it" and if Torontonians still don't embrace it then they can go back to the original fares and legitimately say " you had your chance and blew so don't bitch about the fares".

It wouldn't cost Metrolinx anything and god knows there is tons of capacity available as the thing is only running at 20%.
 
But those people writing it off as a business expense would be writing off a taxi or limo or whatever else they have to take anyways. Doubt there's a noticeable negative effect in that regard.
 
Zach6668 said:
But those people writing it off as a business expense would be writing off a taxi or limo or whatever else they have to take anyways. Doubt there's a noticeable negative effect in that regard.
Click to expand...
Given that they'd be writing off a cab fare that's 2 to 3 times higher, then doesn't this make the UPX economics MORE favourable? Assuming there is anything to this creative accounting.
 
nfitz said:
Given that they'd be writing off a cab fare that's 2 to 3 times higher, then doesn't this make the UPX economics MORE favourable? Assuming there is anything to this creative accounting.
Click to expand...

If they are writing off a 4 or 5 star hotel downtown. Cab or limo fare is pocket change.
 
Riverdale Rink Rat said:
Why is $15 for 15mn palatable, but not $19 for 25mn? How will saving 10mn on a trip to the airport change the ridership dynamics (you then have to stand in line with your luggage at the terminal, and go through security checks to get to your gate)? How will saving $4 change your mind about the hassle / non-hassle of getting to Union as opposed to grabbing a cab from College and University?
Click to expand...

Will saving 10 more minutes versus an alternative change the ridership dynamics (you then have 10 extra minutes to check your luggage at the terminal, and go through security checks to get to your gate)? I'm willing to bet so. But will saving $4 change your mind from College and University? Not sure that it does, not about to argue that. The 192, an extended Eglinton Crosstown or a cab may be better or worse anywhere north of Dundas and outside the core. Within that box however, I'm also willing to bet $4 will change minds.
 
The push and pull between more stops and fewer stops is kind of unnecessary. The solution is simple. Have a premium express train that makes no stops, and a cheaper local train that stops at each GO station. The former would be for tourists and business travellers, the latter for regular transit users. The all stops option would probably have the majority of ridership and, interlined with the Kitchener GO line, could serve as a western DRL. Of course, electrification and fare integration would probably have to come first.
 
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