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I was in Vancouver recently and saw a trolley bus ahead of the one I was on operating off-wire for some reason. They have emergency battery power, but they cannot go very quickly without the poles up.

All trolley buses require two poles. Some streetcar systems, such as the one in Cincinnati, also had a dual-wire system, but these were rare as the track itself can return the electrical current.
 
Just to stir things up, New Flyer has changed the designation for the Xcelsior trolley coaches for Seattle and San Francisco. They are XT40 or XT60 models, being Xcelsior Trolley 40 or 60 ft. XE is for the battery powered model.
The Xcelsior line (XT40/60) has replaced the E40/60LFR in New Flyer's product line (just to further clarify things).
 
Meanwhile....

Berlin – The First Capital City with a Wirelessly-Charged E-bus Line (Buslinie) BVG-Busline 204 is now "energised"

From Bombardier's website at this link:

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A milestone has been reached in the development of electric mobility in Berlin with the commissioning of the world's first wirelessly charged electric bus in a capital city. The Berlin Transport Authority, Berliner Verkehrsbetriebe (BVG), has positioned itself as a pioneer in urban mobility by introducing four Solaris Urbino 12 electric buses equipped with the BOMBARDIER PRIMOVE inductive charging system and traction equipment from Vossloh Kiepe. Moreover, the new e-buses will significantly improve the city’s environmental performance. The project is funded by the Federal Ministry of Transport and Digital Infrastructure.

BVG already transports around two-thirds of its passengers electrically with subways or trams, as well as with its four solar-powered ferries. Starting Monday, August 31, Germany's biggest transport company now also runs electric buses. Line 204 between Südkreuz and Zoologischer Garten (Hertzallee) now operates exclusively with electric buses. Thanks to Vossloh Kiepe’s electric drive, these vehicles are not only emission-free, but also produce low vibration and noise, benefitting passengers, local residents and the environment at the same time.

The buses charge like an electric toothbrush at home, wirelessly and contactless, but with a far greater capacity and performance. At the end stops, Bombardier’s inductive PRIMOVE technology enables the buses to recharge in just a few minutes.

State Secretary Rainer Bomba, Federal Ministry of Transport and Digital Infrastructure, explained: "The Federal Ministry of Transport is funding the project with a total of about 4.1 million euros. We want to promote electric mobility in public transport with projects like this. The wireless charging technology that will be used from now, on the line 204, provides low-emission and low-noise transport. This will benefit local residents and transport stakeholders alike."

Rainer Bomba, State Secretary at Federal Ministry of Transport and Digital Infrastructure, Andreas Geisel, Senator for Urban Development and Environment, and Cornelia Yzer, Senator for Economics, Technology and Research, all sent the first e-bus from its charging station at Berlin’s Südkreuz station off to its fixed-route service through the city. As the diesel buses were gradually replaced, line 204 was finally electrified completely.

“I am delighted that the electric buses and the inductive charging devices will start operating today. Electric buses on the streets of Berlin are part of a package of measures to facilitate a breakthrough of this environmentally friendly technology. To get the maximum benefit from this practical use, I have also pledged, to the BVG, to support the co-financing of the project from mid-2016, after the Federal funding, until 2023", said Senator Geisel.

Senator Yzer: "Berlin starts as the world's first capital city to put a complete line of wireless e-charged buses in operation. Thus, we document our claim as a Smart City and as a reference location for the implementation of the energy turnaround. In the German capital city, we can test pilot developments in transparent structures and prepare them for global applications. Besides 'Made in Berlin' also 'Tested in Berlin' is a valid seal of approval."

On the 6.1-km long route through the inner city, passengers now have 18 stops to get on and off and to enjoy the e-buses’ quiet and smooth ride. Worries that the vehicles could run out of power in traffic or while on the road are just as unfounded as concerns about the charging technology itself. The PRIMOVE battery system, with a total capacity of 90 kilowatt hours, offers sufficient energy reserves to handle even Berlin’s most demanding routes. In addition, the wireless charging system is well shielded so that the electromagnetic radiation is lower than that of a conventional induction cooker. To fully charge the batteries overnight and air condition the passenger compartment before starting operation, four stationary and one mobile charging station were also installed by Vossloh Kiepe at the BVG depot. There the buses are supplied with power via charging cables.

Like all BVG’s electric powered vehicles, the new Solaris Urbino 12 electrics are powered exclusively with green electricity. Within one year, the four electric buses on the line 204 will cover at a total of approx. 200,000 kilometres, saving 260 tons of CO2 emissions. Approximately 250 private cars would have to be electrified to reach the same effect. Furthermore, because the e-bus is as quiet as an average car, noise pollution has been reduced as well. As a precaution, an external speaker has been installed enabling the driver to announce the approach to a stop

The pilot project "E-Bus Berlin" will also provide valuable experience about the operation of battery buses and the Technical University of Berlin, whose research helped determined the necessary charging time and capacity of batteries, is now carrying out a technical and economic evaluation of the project. The operational phase of the e-bus 204 as part of the "Internationalen Schaufensters Elektromobilität Berlin-Brandenburg" will run until autumn 2016.

That's Berlin, Germany; not the city formerly known as Berlin, Ontario and now called Kitchener.
 

I think you lost the sales pitch at the "Made by Bombardier" the new "AMC Gremlin" of public transportation. :D

I don't think the city is going to spend the money on a new mode of transportation. I wouldn't be suprised in 10 years that the "wirelessly-charged" e-bus will be replaced by the wireless power, no battery needed, bus that gets its power from buried power lines in the road like an hidden third-rail.

That's Berlin, Germany; not the city formerly known as Berlin, Ontario and now called Kitchener.

I voted for the name "Benton" in that referendum, but the side of "Let's name it after the late Lord Kitchener" won. :rolleyes:
 
Comment from Steve Munro's website at this link, on TTC Surface Ridership and Service: 1976 to 2016:

Some of the declines in bus ridership look to be attributable to new routes or subways. 96 Wilson ridership drops as 165 Weston Road North opens; 63 Ossington ridership drops as 161 Rogers Road opens. The 29 Dufferin bus takes a big hit in 1978 as the Spadina subway opens.

Three ex-trolley coach routes have really declined: 4 Annette (and its Dupont offspring), 6 Bay, and 40 Junction. I wonder how much of that is due to much worse service with diesel buses. In the TC days, 40 Junction buses seemed twice as frequent as the King and Dundas cars. I remember plenty of times waiting for a streetcar to pull into Dundas West, while the Junction buses were coming and going like clockwork. And Bay was a relief line for the Yonge subway in the late 1980s, complete with “urban clearway”. The trolley coaches moved right along. Today, even with massive condominium development along Bay, the ridership just isn’t there.
 
While extending the 40 Junction bus to Jane Street or Scarlett Road (maybe replacing the 79A St. Clair leg of the Runnymede bus) may get an increase in ridership, it would see an even better increase with trolley buses or streetcars.
 
I don't see why a trolley bus would greatly improve ridership. I guess it's quieter, but it's not really faster or more comfortable. And until the Jane LRT is being built, a streetcar seems very excessive for a route that has less than 5,000 passengers per day. Extending the route to Jane or Scarlett makes sense, but it should still be a bus.
 
While talk of trolley-buses is interesting there is ZERO chance the TTC will buy them again in most of our lifetimes. The answer to the Thread Title (TTC: Trolley buses to return?) is NO. )
 
While talk of trolley-buses is interesting there is ZERO chance the TTC will buy them again in most of our lifetimes. The answer to the Thread Title (TTC: Trolley buses to return?) is NO. )

I dunno about "zero". It wouldn't surprise me if the BRT proposals, assuming they're built, end up running as trolley buses rather than diesel. But for existing routes, yes - trolley buses aren't coming back.
 
I dunno about "zero". It wouldn't surprise me if the BRT proposals, assuming they're built, end up running as trolley buses rather than diesel. But for existing routes, yes - trolley buses aren't coming back.

The TTC had a report on this a couple of years back. The gist of it was that despite their current (and ongoing) investments in the infrastructure that could be used to power a trolley bus system (the trolley bus power system would - and did - piggyback on the existing subway and streetcar power system), the capital costs didn't make sense.

Until diesel prices increase to become more than a tiny (~4-7% IIRC) fraction of the operating cost of the vehicle, the internal combustion engine will continue to be the primary source of propulsion for transit buses in Toronto.

Dan
Toronto, Ont.
 
I dunno about "zero". It wouldn't surprise me if the BRT proposals, assuming they're built, end up running as trolley buses rather than diesel. But for existing routes, yes - trolley buses aren't coming back.
Trolley buses are a thing of the past and are being replace with battery power buses. Never will see another trolley bus on TTC systems.

As the existing systems in NA need to start replacing their existing fleet in the next 10 years or so, they will be replace by battery power buses, not the Hybrid types.
 
And plus why would you add busses that have no extra capacity than regular busses and has the disadvantage of not being able to pass each other.
 
A few Canadian agencies have dipped their toe in the water (battery-electric buses).

Laval
Montreal
Quebec
St. Albert
Winnipeg

But like many have already said, I think Toronto will be watching them closely while the technology matures. The last time they bought into an emerging technology, they got the hybrids. At the same time, CNG technology, which the TTC tried out early on, now has a solid reputation. Hamilton has renewed their CNG fleet in the past two years.
 
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