[CMQSD402F9011]

I mean , the biggest road block to trolleys would be the actual facilities.

I assume the overhead wires would be the same as what the streetcars use? Actually streetcars use panto, so no. But we do have the overhead department at TTC.

I remember David Miller was studying to bring back trolleybuses in 2009. I wonder if a report actually came out from it. Either way, Rob Ford came in a year later.

Also, the same company that made the last trolley buses TTC had are still around today, NFI, and they still make trolley buses today. I can only imagine the improvement in technology and off during capabilities. NFI is also Canadian, fully Canadian too.

But to be honest , with the amount of traffic we have and the road designs that don't help bigger vehicles navigate the downtown area, and then to still follow a overhead wire will be annoying for operators. I get the nostalgic behind it, and love that it's actually proven technology, I just don't think it would be practical to have them.

TTC can't even get a bus garage in the old former city of Toronto, much less a garage for trolleybuses.

It would be interesting to see how things would have played out if TTC kept they're trolleys. Old Eglinton and Lansdowne would still be around. But the. Cuts of 1996 would have still taken place. I wonder if it would have been Danforth Garage instead of Lansdowne that would have closed?

By now, if TTC were to bring back trolleys, it would have been Mount Dennis and Wilson bus garages have trolleybuses

 

[drum118]

Why Some Transit Agencies Are Re-Examining Hybrid Buses​

 

[CMQSD402F9011]

Here are some files that were probably never seen before. Back in the early 1980s(?), route 7 and 29 were to be converted to Trolleybus routes. I suppose this could happen today, if funding from all 3 levels of governments come in.

 

[IRT_BMT_IND]

Here are some files that were probably never seen before. Back in the early 1980s(?), route 7 and 29 were to be converted to Trolleybus routes. I suppose this could happen today, if funding from all 3 levels of governments come in.

I have to think it's more likely the trolleybus system survives if this actually happened. With better fleet utilization on the E700s and a bunch of new wire (especially on high ridership suburban trunk routes) the calculus re: keeping the trolleybuses would be different and I would suspect the TTC would be more amicable to pulling the trigger on ordering some New Flyer E40s in the late 80s or early 90s.

 

[CMQSD402F9011]

I have to think it's more likely the trolleybus system survives if this actually happened. With better fleet utilization on the E700s and a bunch of new wire (especially on high ridership suburban trunk routes) the calculus re: keeping the trolleybuses would be different and I would suspect the TTC would be more amicable to pulling the trigger on ordering some New Flyer E40s in the late 80s or early 90s.

It would appear that sometime in 1988(?) that TTC almost got to sign the contract for New Flyer E40s. But never came to fruition.

 

[RapidTransit]

With TTC eventually getting rid of all the older bus garages , maybe it was a good thing they didn't get new trolleys. The cost to upgrade all the facilities, and the massive cuts that were to happen in the mid 1990s. Would have made the 1990s financial situation worse.

But replacing trolleys with CNG was boneheaded. Just to get hybrids in the 2000s and EV in the 2020s. And after looking at all that waste of money, they were better off sticking with trolleys.

Today, the same company from the 80s still make trolleys to this day with better technology, and Canadian made. Maybe one day history will repeat itself , and we get trolleys again. We came close under David Miller.

Let's be honest, with the city always crying poor for money, they still manage to keep and upgrade the streetcar fleet, facility and infrastructure. So if there's a will there's a way. And I'm sure it's way cheaper to get trolleybuses over streetcars. Most you'll need is overhead wires , something TTC already gets anyways. Trolley buses cost a lot, but probably the same cost maybe cheaper than EV. But more guarantee reliability than EV. So you'll still get your money's worth.

Getting trolleybuses is not a matter of finances, it's really just a will.

 

[Steve X]

With TTC eventually getting rid of all the older bus garages , maybe it was a good thing they didn't get new trolleys. The cost to upgrade all the facilities, and the massive cuts that were to happen in the mid 1990s. Would have made the 1990s financial situation worse.

But replacing trolleys with CNG was boneheaded. Just to get hybrids in the 2000s and EV in the 2020s. And after looking at all that waste of money, they were better off sticking with trolleys.

Today, the same company from the 80s still make trolleys to this day with better technology, and Canadian made. Maybe one day history will repeat itself , and we get trolleys again. We came close under David Miller.

Let's be honest, with the city always crying poor for money, they still manage to keep and upgrade the streetcar fleet, facility and infrastructure. So if there's a will there's a way. And I'm sure it's way cheaper to get trolleybuses over streetcars. Most you'll need is overhead wires , something TTC already gets anyways. Trolley buses cost a lot, but probably the same cost maybe cheaper than EV. But more guarantee reliability than EV. So you'll still get your money's worth.

Getting trolleybuses is not a matter of finances, it's really just a will.

The city has no money, they should just buy very well established and proven diesel buses and spend the rest of the money on service improvements like queue lanes and transit priority. Instead they are spending hundred of millions on batteries than makes zero improvement to actual service levels, millions on chargers and millions on electric supply infrastructures. With 340 ebuses on the road vs millions of trucks and cars, it wouldn't even make a dent in emission reduction.

 

[APTA-2048]

Update on TTC’s electric buses and new bus orders, including hybrids:



Also, some of the stored 3700-series New Flyer electric buses have been put back in service.

 

[RapidTransit]

Update on TTC’s electric buses and new bus orders, including hybrids:

View attachment 730165View attachment 730166

Also, some of the stored 3700-series New Flyer electric buses have been put back in service.

Interesting that the 3700 are back in service. Why were they out of service? And what's the reasoning for them to be brought back?

And is TTC planning on bringing the Proterras back or the BYD?

Even though TTC has had issues with NFI buses not meeting reliability goals, I don't believe this will affect NFI from bidding on the 200 hybrid order. Seeing as how one is EV the other is a more proven hybrid platform.

 

[smallspy]

Interesting that the 3700 are back in service. Why were they out of service? And what's the reasoning for them to be brought back?

The 3700-series New Flyers use an older generation of motor/drive system than the ones currently being delivered.

And is TTC planning on bringing the Proterras back or the BYD?

It seems unlikely, as those two fleets have even less parts commonality than the current battery bus fleets. Plus there is/was the issue with body cracking on the Proterras.

Even though TTC has had issues with NFI buses not meeting reliability goals, I don't believe this will affect NFI from bidding on the 200 hybrid order. Seeing as how one is EV the other is a more proven hybrid platform.

The hybrid buses from New Flyer have been performing reasonably well (some minor mechanical annoyances compared to the Nova ones), and so it seems like there should be no reason why they couldn't win that tender if they were aggressive enough on price. That they share more mechanical commonality with the other hybrids - versus the battery buses, which are completely different mechanically - probably helps.

Dan