[TOareaFan]

Just saw one of the new ones heading east on King near Bay - was several storeys up so I couldn't make out the number. Is 4400 or 4403 being rerouted, or is 4404 already here for testing?

4401 and 4402 are still here for training as well - unless one was loaded back on that flatcar to go back to Thunder Bay.

4401 was on King this morning.

In fact, almost every day for the last 7/10 days it seems I see either 4401 or 4402 on King ....I get that they have to test these.....but during the work day on already congested King seems a strange place to be running/flaunting these empty machines

 

[TheTigerMaster]

....I get that they have to test these.....but during the work day on already congested King seems a strange place to be running/flaunting these empty machines

War on cars!

 

[the lemur]

4401 was on King this morning.

In fact, almost every day for the last 7/10 days it seems I see either 4401 or 4402 on King ....I get that they have to test these.....but during the work day on already congested King seems a strange place to be running/flaunting these empty machines

It actually wasn't very congested when I saw it - it was well after the morning rush.

 

[TOareaFan]

War on cars!

sure...if that is what you saw in my post.....but a regular occurance on King is bunching of streetcars....irrespective of what cars and people in them think.....I was thinking that being the 3rd or 4th streetcar in a bunch is frustrating enough without the knowledge that the one in front of you is an empty test car.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

sure...if that is what you saw in my post.....but a regular occurance on King is bunching of streetcars....irrespective of what cars and people in them think.....I was thinking that being the 3rd or 4th streetcar in a bunch is frustrating enough without the knowledge that the one in front of you is an empty test car.

I was joking.

 

[nfitz]

sure...if that is what you saw in my post.....but a regular occurance on King is bunching of streetcars....irrespective of what cars and people in them think.....I was thinking that being the 3rd or 4th streetcar in a bunch is frustrating enough without the knowledge that the one in front of you is an empty test car.

With 30 streetcars already deployed on King mid-day (and over 50 during rush hour), I don't think the presence of a single training vehicle, is going to do that much disruption. Particularly as they can move faster than the other vehicles, not having to wait at stops, etc.

Surely, best that drivers be trained on a real route, rather than simply driving in circles on a short piece of test track somewhere.

How is this any different than the many training CLRVs you see on the streets of the city every day?

 

[TOareaFan]

With 30 streetcars already deployed on King mid-day (and over 50 during rush hour), I don't think the presence of a single training vehicle, is going to do that much disruption. Particularly as they can move faster than the other vehicles, not having to wait at stops, etc.

I guess unless they were always at the front of a bunch of streetcars they may lose that ability to go faster (unless these are blessed with special skills that I am not aware of )

Surely, best that drivers be trained on a real route, rather than simply driving in circles on a short piece of test track somewhere.

How is this any different than the many training CLRVs you see on the streets of the city every day?

They are only different in that they are empty and I was simply expressing that passengers might get a bit frustrated (more so than normal) sitting behind an empty car.

My comment didn't intend to spark such a lengthy debate....and I don't actually think they should never test on King...it just struck me as a bit strange that i see one almost daily now and since there are only two of them testing it kinda makes you think that (for some reason) there is a bit of a focus on testing on King during the day.....that's all i kinda meant.

 

[innsertnamehere]

I wonder how long until we get streetcar 4444? At 3 cars a month, it should be sometime around early 2016.

 

[dowlingm]

I think BBD should be obliged to leave 4401/2 here under their ownership until they have reached the promised 3/month delivery rate at least. No point in either using out of service accepted cars to train or being unable to dispatch cars for insufficient numbers of trained operators.

 

[khris]

I saw a new one on Carlton yesterday around 5:15 going eastbound at Church. Not sure of the number, as I was too far away to see it.

 

[nfitz]

I think BBD should be obliged to leave 4401/2 here under their ownership until they have reached the promised 3/month delivery rate at least. No point in either using out of service accepted cars to train or being unable to dispatch cars for insufficient numbers of trained operators.

Bombardier already agreed to leave them here because of the delivery problems. But they are of no use other than training.

 

[dowlingm]

Bombardier already agreed to leave them here because of the delivery problems. But they are of no use other than training.

That's use enough for me. The question is, how long will BBD allow them to remain.

 

[TOareaFan]

That's use enough for me. The question is, how long will BBD allow them to remain.

At some point fairly soon, you would think, they would have limited use as training vehicles....they have been here a while so a lot of people have had their training and soon the flow of new vehicles will pick up that need their 600km testing so having two more around that have no purpose other than training has to, at some point, be superfluous. ...no?

 

[muller877]

At some point fairly soon, you would think, they would have limited use as training vehicles....they have been here a while so a lot of people have had their training and soon the flow of new vehicles will pick up that need their 600km testing so having two more around that have no purpose other than training has to, at some point, be superfluous. ...no?

I've always read the posts this required 600km of testing. Is this a federal, Ontario or TTC requirement? And why do they do it on the street vs a dedicated loop track?

Kinda silly to pay TTC drivers to go 600km and wait for lights to change. I thought Thunder Bay has a large loop. Get a worker up there to hop in and at the end of the day (8 hrs @ 75km/hr) its done vs the 30 hours or so in Toronto (assuming 20 km/hr). Assuming the driver makes 50k + 50k in benefits this road testing vs track testing costs us >$1,000.

 

[TOareaFan]

I've always read the posts this required 600km of testing. Is this a federal, Ontario or TTC requirement? And why do they do it on the street vs a dedicated loop track?

Kinda silly to pay TTC drivers to go 600km and wait for lights to change. I thought Thunder Bay has a large loop. Get a worker up there to hop in and at the end of the day (8 hrs @ 75km/hr) its done vs the 30 hours or so in Toronto (assuming 20 km/hr). Assuming the driver makes 50k + 50k in benefits this road testing vs track testing costs us >$1,000.

Others may know better but I think it has to do with warranties and maintenance and repair responsibility.

Flaws/defects discovered during the test period are Bombardier's sole responsibility as The TTC hasn't actually taken delivery/ownership until a completed flaw free 600km.

Does it not make sense to test them in the environment they will operate in?