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I'm surprised and somewhat pleased with my grumpy self in that I am quite liking the arrival of new streetcars. They're giving the city a modern look. A few things I might change, like having the driver control the wheelchair ramp call button, as people push it when the door doesn't immediately open, and I'd change the seating so we're not facing each other. Otherwise, all good. I like how quietly they turn 90 degrees at Carlton and Parliament - the old cars were screechers.

Had Bombardier delivered them per the original schedule without any reliability/assembly foibles I think Toronto could have served as the ultimate sales brochure to US cities considering streetcars. As it is, looking back on this list of 2010 projects, did Bombardier get any of them? https://www.thetransportpolitic.com...dvance-nationwide-thanks-to-local-initiative/

Regardless, we have a good looking fleet of seemingly working cars.
 
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Admiral Beez said:
Had Bombardier delivered them per the original schedule without any reliability/assembly foibles I think Toronto could have served as the ultimate sales brochure to US cities considering streetcars. As it is, looking back on this list of 2010 projects, did Bombardier get any of them? https://www.thetransportpolitic.com...dvance-nationwide-thanks-to-local-initiative/

Regardless, we have a good looking fleet of seemingly working cars.
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SEPTA need to replace 130 Kawasaki and PCC cars - even on a non 1:1 basis that would be a tasty order. How Bombardier is viewed in Philly is hard to say but they did lose the mainline push pull bilevel RFP to CRRC.
 
dowlingm said:
SEPTA need to replace 130 Kawasaki and PCC cars - even on a non 1:1 basis that would be a tasty order. How Bombardier is viewed in Philly is hard to say but they did lose the mainline push pull bilevel RFP to CRRC.
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BBD cars aren't impressing the folks at SEPTA at all, as well the company itself. If so, they would have looked at doing an order some years ago. Then, SEPTA not a fan for streetcars these days.
 
drum118 said:
BBD cars aren't impressing the folks at SEPTA at all, as well the company itself. If so, they would have looked at doing an order some years ago. Then, SEPTA not a fan for streetcars these days.
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That's not what the folks at SEPTA said when I talked to them.....

Dan
 
The current conditions on streetcars and light rail vehicles coming out of Bombardier have had most of their "bugs" discovered and taken care of.
 
Admiral Beez said:
Are they walking the talk and buying Bombardier then?
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No, they will be putting out a tender for replacement equipment - much as they have to being a public agency. It is expected that when that time comes Bombardier will be one of the bidders.

But they were very impressed with the equipment and the way it handled the Toronto network, which is configured very similarly to Philadelphia's. They are far more confident in the choice of a 100% low-floor car than they were when the TTC began its replacement process.

Dan
 
smallspy said:
No, they will be putting out a tender for replacement equipment - much as they have to being a public agency. It is expected that when that time comes Bombardier will be one of the bidders.

But they were very impressed with the equipment and the way it handled the Toronto network, which is configured very similarly to Philadelphia's. They are far more confident in the choice of a 100% low-floor car than they were when the TTC began its replacement process.

Dan
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Philadelphia's streetcar track guage is 5 ft 2 1⁄2 in (1,588 mm).
 
W. K. Lis said:
Philadelphia's streetcar track guage is 5 ft 2 1⁄2 in (1,588 mm).
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AIUI, the gauge is not important. You can simply extend or shorten the wheel track or axles to suit the gauge. It’s the turning radius and hill climbing that’s important.
 
Admiral Beez said:
AIUI, the gauge is not important. You can simply extend or shorten the wheel track or axles to suit the gauge. It’s the turning radius and hill climbing that’s important.
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There are still those who consider the TTC track gauge a BIG PROBLEM, when it isn't. Ditto anywhere where they have different track gauges.
 
Admiral Beez said:
AIUI, the gauge is not important. You can simply extend or shorten the wheel track or axles to suit the gauge. It’s the turning radius and hill climbing that’s important.
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That's not specifically true - the track gauge can be a big issue with certain types of equipment. You are certainly correct that turning radius and "gradeability" are very important, however.

With a vehicle where the trucks are mounted underneath everything - a high-floor car, such as a PCC - the gauge is of little relevance. The trucks will have ample room to rotate, and can even be made to rotate 360 degrees if necessary.

On low-floor vehicle, however, things get far more dicey. Lengthening or shortening the axles will have knock-on effects on the truck sideframes and their overall dimensions. If the car is of a design where the trucks rotate - such as the Flexities - care must be taken to ensure that there is enough clearance on all sides to allow for enough rotation to handle whatever curves the system is designed to handle. Even though the Toronto gauge is only 2 and a bit inches wider than standard gauge, that additional distance can prevent a degree of rotation that may be necessary in the trucks to handle the trackwork.

Dan
 
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smallspy said:
On low-floor vehicle, however, things get far more dicey. Lengthening or shortening the axles will have knock-on effects on the truck sideframes and their overall dimensions. If the car is of a design where the trucks rotate - such as the Flexities - care must be taken to ensure that there is enough clearance on all sides to allow for enough rotation to handle whatever curves the system is designed to handle. Even though the Toronto gauge is only 2 and a bit inches wider than standard gauge, that additional distance can prevent a degree of rotation that may be necessary in the trucks to handle the trackwork.

Dan
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Yes, but is there any streetcar system in North America that would have a tighter turning radius than Toronto? If anything, the narrower "standard" gauge should make Bombardier's cars turn even sharper? Bombardier should be winning contracts on radius.
 
AIUI, the gauge is not important. You can simply extend or shorten the wheel track or axles to suit the gauge. It’s the turning radius and hill climbing that’s important.
Click to expand...

W. K. Lis said:
There are still those who consider the TTC track gauge a BIG PROBLEM, when it isn't. Ditto anywhere where they have different track gauges.
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I mean, to a point. Small variations in track gauge are relatively easy.

Try putting a narrow gauge swiss train onto an Indian railway, and youre gonna have a bad time.
 
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