[TheTigerMaster]

Transit City people (looking at Goldsbie and the like) need to start organizing against these cuts or the city will no longer have a functional transit system. After all, rising transit fares and deteriorating service hurts minorities disproportionately.

The "Transit City people" (whoever they are) need to start organizing to toss Tory out of office. Eight years of Rob Ford is enough.

 

[Amare]

Tory and his two-faced ways continue. He's a very clever man; announce the intent to create a 21-Acre park that wont be built for many years, if not a decade so that it can capture all the headlines, while simultaneously burying the TTC budget situation so no one notices.

The TTC can barely function the way it is today; there are consistent delays on the subway system, buses have to be pulled from routes and shuffled around due to maintenance issues, A/C systems are failing on subway cars, buses and streetcars are packed, streetcars are crumbling apart, the RT is crumbling apart, etc... And yet this man comes out with demands for them to cut their budget?

This is the most idiotic thought process I have seen in a long time.

 

[TheTigerMaster]

John Tory is the quintessential politician.

 

[Steve X]

So 1100 fines per month x 12 months x $235 = $3.1M
Say the average worker earns $60k + $40k (benefits + pension). 51-69 staff so $5 to 7M expenses.
A loss which needs to be reversed. Either via higher revenue (more fines per employee or better targeted inspection) or lower costs (fewer staff/cheaper wages).

Have they identified which routes/times create the most fare evasion? Or just focusing on 9-5?

A 3% inspection rate means the commuter (twice a day, 22 days a month) should have the fare checked 1.3 times a month. I know it's a random check but I have not been checked in 2016 (yet) and statistically I should have been checked about 10 times. Of course I arrive at work at 8 am and leave after 6 pm so either I have a four leaf clover or they don't target these times/routes/don't have staff on at this time. Has anyone here been checked more than a couple of times in 2016 (or anywhere close to 10 times)?

They must have stats as to which routes/times have the largest evasions (and where they don't have stats yet). Would be interesting to see.

You do realize that TTC gets $0 from all the fines issue. The city profits while expenses increase for the TTC. That money is apparently not going back into the system as Tory is looking for more cuts towards the TTC budget. Ideally its better to hire less inspectors while maintaining ridership.

The TTC isn't really inspecting people on the 510. Most of the time they are found at the two stations forming a checkpoint. People can easily evade the 510 ride but can't if they want to rider further on the subway. They have indeed stepped up on inspection as inspectors are still checking fares at midnight. I have also seen a pair chill on the back of an empty 501 CLRV streetcar that following an ALRV closely. They watch the whole 6 riders paid their fare at the front. Not very productive work if you ask me. So they appeared in my presences 4 times for me last month. One time at Spadina they were too busy writing tickets.

 

[muller877]

You do realize that TTC gets $0 from all the fines issue. The city profits while expenses increase for the TTC. That money is apparently not going back into the system as Tory is looking for more cuts towards the TTC budget. Ideally its better to hire less inspectors while maintaining ridership.

The TTC isn't really inspecting people on the 510. Most of the time they are found at the two stations forming a checkpoint. People can easily evade the 510 ride but can't if they want to rider further on the subway. They have indeed stepped up on inspection as inspectors are still checking fares at midnight. I have also seen a pair chill on the back of an empty 501 CLRV streetcar that following an ALRV closely. They watch the whole 6 riders paid their fare at the front. Not very productive work if you ask me. So they appeared in my presences 4 times for me last month. One time at Spadina they were too busy writing tickets.

Great news about late night inspections. I would expect that there would be an increase as it gets darker.

I wonder if the presto reader that the enforcement agents have track the number of scans per hour and the total per day. Just like a CSR in a call center who is monitored on the number of calls they make I hope these agents also are monitored on the number of scans.

 

[dowlingm]

The "transit city people" have no leverage over John Tory. The Board of Trade and the like, maybe.

 

[salsa]

Tory Threatens Fiscal Chaos At TTC, Misrepresents Auditor General’s Findings

https://stevemunro.ca/2016/08/04/to...-ttc-misrepresents-auditor-generals-findings/

 

[muller877]

Ben Spurr@BenSpurr
2 mins ago
Tory is raising the prospect of calling in a task force to cut the TTC's budget if management will not find more savings.

The TTC is just like the police where most of the expenses are people (excluding capital and amortization for the TTC its 73% of expenses are salaries in 2014). The Auditor looked at non-people costs in 2014 and 2012 and they have been slowly whittling away at these costs. However, the main issue is this large expense line that no one looks at (salaries and benefits).

So Tory needs a way to privatize the delivery (just like garbage in the west end) mainly to reduce the salaries paid. He can't do it directly so the task force will be the political front.

And TTC management won't do it because we would then need less TTC management (and the CEO won't be earning $350,000 once it's done).

For those who say privatization won't save money...that's what studies are for (but not done by unionized city staff who have a conflict of interest). And a competitive bidding process that can include the existing union.

You also divide up the city so that there is not a monopoly on the delivery in case one private operator does not preform to standards agreed to or tries to increase rates.

 

[cplchanb]

The TTC is just like the police where most of the expenses are people (excluding capital and amortization for the TTC its 73% of expenses are salaries in 2014). The Auditor looked at non-people costs in 2014 and 2012 and they have been slowly whittling away at these costs. However, the main issue is this large expense line that no one looks at (salaries and benefits).

So Tory needs a way to privatize the delivery (just like garbage in the west end) mainly to reduce the salaries paid. He can't do it directly so the task force will be the political front.

And TTC management won't do it because we would then need less TTC management (and the CEO won't be earning $350,000 once it's done).

For those who say privatization won't save money...that's what studies are for (but not done by unionized city staff who have a conflict of interest). And a competitive bidding process that can include the existing union.

You also divide up the city so that there is not a monopoly on the delivery in case one private operator does not preform to standards agreed to or tries to increase rates.

You can reference Hong Kong's privatised transit if you need an example of how privatisation works. I dont think theve had a red year for decades and the service quality is one of the best in the world

 

[muller877]

Tory Threatens Fiscal Chaos At TTC, Misrepresents Auditor General’s Findings

https://stevemunro.ca/2016/08/04/to...-ttc-misrepresents-auditor-generals-findings/


View attachment 82676

Interesting they are still trying to fix all the issues with Wheeltrans. Too bad the city hasn't asked for quotes from Bridj or RideWithVia or another similar app to get rid of our antiquated delivery model.

Think of the money wasted having the call center. Instead use an app and then track when it is expected to arrive (vs now where it could arrive 15 minutes early or 30 minutes late every day and you are just sitting there waiting).

 

[muller877]

You can reference Hong Kong's privatised transit if you need an example of how privatisation works. I dont think theve had a red year for decades and the service quality is one of the best in the world

Not like Hong Kong or New Orleans where it is all privatized. More like London or Austin where the delivery is private but the fare collection and the management is public. London had some growing pains but we can learn from them and the more recent privatizations went fairly smoothly. When you get on a bus in London you don't really know which company is running it and it meets the service level requirements agreed to at the beginning of the contract.

 

[W. K. Lis]

...
And TTC management won't do it because we would then need less TTC management (and the CEO won't be earning $350,000 once it's done).

For those who say privatization won't save money...that's what studies are for (but not done by unionized city staff who have a conflict of interest). And a competitive bidding process that can include the existing union.
...

To come up with the general term that management in private companies earn less, is wrong.

See link to the list for 100 highest paid CEO's. Mostly privately owned companies. Highest was the CEO for Valeant Pharmaceutical International at $143,077,442, lowest was the CEO for Mylan N.V. at $18,931,068.

See link to the list for 100 highest paid CEO's in Canada. The highest CEO is the one for Blackberry, at $89,715,019. The lowest CEO is Ritchie Bros Auctioneers, at $4,280,586 (base salary of $387,455).

 

[W. K. Lis]

Not like Hong Kong or New Orleans where it is all privatized. More like London or Austin where the delivery is private but the fare collection and the management is public. London had some growing pains but we can learn from them and the more recent privatizations went fairly smoothly. When you get on a bus in London you don't really know which company is running it and it meets the service level requirements agreed to at the beginning of the contract.

Hong Kong has a higher density than Toronto. Give Toronto the same population as Hong Kong, would mean having to bypass the NIMBYs in all the neighourhoods.

 

[rbt]

So Tory needs a way to privatize the delivery [of TTC services]

Ford and council demanded the province make that illegal; and the province implemented that request. In return for giving the Union whatever they want (by provincial law via an arbitrator), we get the benefit of no transit strikes.

That was a bad deal when Ford demanded it and it would be extremely hard to reverse now.

Self-driving buses is the first opportunity you'll get.

More like London or Austin where the delivery is private but the fare collection and the management is public.

GO Transit and York Region services are also delivered this way in the GTA. York Region might be a cautionary tale on what not to do (high fare, low fare-box cost recovery).

 

[muller877]

Ford and council demanded the province make that illegal; and the province implemented that request. In return for giving the Union whatever they want (by provincial law via an arbitrator), we get the benefit of no transit strikes.

That was a bad deal when Ford demanded it and it would be extremely hard to reverse now.
.

Section 32 permits contracting out under the following process:
1. Management explains reason to Union
2. Union can suggest alternatives but must include efficiency, cost, etc in the suggestion
3. If Union alternative is satisfactory Management will reconsider
4. TTC will give preference to own workers if they are satisfied that factors above are met
However, no workers will be laid off for this agreement (March 2018) and the subsequent agreement regardless of the duration

So this does not prohibit a gradual transition like they did with garbage starting today.

And with the fairly high average age (i'm guessing via visual clues) over 5-10 years you can transition well over 1/2 of Toronto to privatized service. (it also gives a more humane way to transition work)