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The question is whether fares are that strong a determinant of ridership in Toronto for all but short-distance hops. I suspect not - but there might be more of a social case for it given the demographics of transit riders. No one should be unable to use the transit system because they truly couldn't afford to do so.

AoD

I think there are some prices that are determinant.

1) Long distance GO fares are quite pricey and affect people's choice of mode when traveling across the region.

To pick an example on a line with 1/2 decent service, I selected Aldershot to Pt. Credit, that fare (Presto) is $9.51 one-way, or $19.02 round trip. If you already own a car, and your destination provides free or cheap parking, I think that's a large dis-incentive to ride.

Of course, a fare reduction significant enough to move the ridership needle in that scenario would need to come with additional service to handle the growth. I don't think the question would be one of .50c per ride, but if you get get the fare down to a 1.5x a typical local transit trip (no greater than $5 I think you put some bums in seats.

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2) For regular TTC users, I think the absence of fare-capping is an issue, the TTC regular fare is line with global norms in larger centres. But its pass costs are not.

A current TTC pass is $156. But 40 Presto Rides is $132

Students/Seniors get hit harder with a Seniors Pass at $128.15, but 40 Presto Rides (Senior) is $90

Eliminating passes and replacing them with a 40-ride cap would result in considerable savings for frequent transit users, but it would also allow a simpler fare structure to administer, including getting rid of 'low-income passes' which are priced at $123.23 per month. They would no longer be necessary and neither would the post-secondary pass.

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I don't think further reducing discount fares (Seniors/Students) at the individual fare level would induce any material amount of ridership as these fares are quite low.

While reducing the TTC general, adult fare could produce some gain, its an expensive choice to get to the point where you start to induce meaningful new ridership and when you do, you have to spend on service as well.

To save an adult rider $10 a week would mean a $1 fare reduction to $2.30, that's a give back in the low hundreds of millions before the cost of service.

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We've seen studies already that show the correlation between service level and ridership volume is higher than the correlation to price. That's likely where the priority should lie, but with some effort to reduce fare disincentives where they are greatest.
 
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TTC 2025 Service Plan consultations are rolling out.

Yeah, yeah, I know, they rarely implement most of what they talk about doing the last few years........but just in case this time is different.......

You can start w/the landing page here:


Which includes these in-person consultations:

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Or you can mosey on over the survey here:


From the above:

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I didn't look at the Community Bus section as I have no useful input to deliver.

Looking at the One Fare Section:

Largely just asks if you've used it, with what other systems, and were there any issues (ie. poorly timed connections) and what would improve the experience (fill in the blank)

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Blue Night Network, proposed changes:

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I'm out of space here, so will do a second post for the remainder of the survey plans.
 
TTC 2025 Service Plan consultations are rolling out.

Yeah, yeah, I know, they rarely implement most of what they talk about doing the last few years........but just in case this time is different.......

You can start w/the landing page here:


Which includes these in-person consultations:

View attachment 586839

Or you can mosey on over the survey here:


From the above:

View attachment 586842

I didn't look at the Community Bus section as I have no useful input to deliver.

Looking at the One Fare Section:

Largely just asks if you've used it, with what other systems, and were there any issues (ie. poorly timed connections) and what would improve the experience (fill in the blank)

****

Blue Night Network, proposed changes:

View attachment 586849

View attachment 586850

View attachment 586851

View attachment 586852

View attachment 586856

View attachment 586862

View attachment 586867

View attachment 586868

View attachment 586869

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View attachment 586871

I'm out of space here, so will do a second post for the remainder of the survey plans.
As usual Steve Munro has lots of details and useful comments. https://stevemunro.ca/
 
@Towered, you know the rules, angry faces require explanatory posts.
For purely selfish reasons - the all night Islington bus being axed for either (or both) Kipling and Royal York/Weston instead would impact me negatively in the future should I be in a situation where I need to use the blue night service.
 
For purely selfish reasons - the all night Islington bus being axed for either (or both) Kipling and Royal York/Weston instead would impact me negatively in the future should I be in a situation where I need to use the blue night service.

Fill out the survey, it lets you skip stuff you aren't interested in, so you can just go rlght to the Blue Night Etobicoke section and you can tell them which of the two options you prefer, or neither, and present another.

I suggested that adding Kipling was good, but removing Islington was suspect and to proceed w/caution. I noted that its removal also adversely affected connections from Lakeshore to Bloor (overnight) east of Kipling.
 
Can't just read and expect everything on the internet to be true. No bus lane has been approved on Dufferin and no plans are made public yet either.

The is the approved queue lane on Dufferin southbound at Lawrence. They also built one on Lawrence westbound approaching Dufferin a few years back.
Queue jump lane is open and operational. Nice to see this little improvement near my home.

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https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/tt...cle_65bf2b82-5410-11ef-a236-ef2f21a3031d.html

TTC ordered to pay $60 million over construction delays, public art display at subway station

The decision by an Ontario Superior Court judge caps a seven-year legal battle over construction problems that afflicted Pioneer Village station.


😂😂😂

Before you laugh too hard, remember who funds the TTC!

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Then lets add........both the TTC and Walsh have appealed the ruling...............so this ain't done..............and neither are the legal bills.
 
Before you laugh too hard, remember who funds the TTC!

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Then let’s add........both the TTC and Walsh have appealed the ruling...............so this ain't done..............and neither are the legal bills.
Personally, I think we should have more architectural designs engineered onto the passenger interaction level. Whether that be seating, concrete patterned walls, platforms etc. Like how European system do or even Montreal. Instead of hiring artists to design individual art pieces for installation.
 
https://www.thestar.com/news/gta/tt...cle_65bf2b82-5410-11ef-a236-ef2f21a3031d.html

TTC ordered to pay $60 million over construction delays, public art display at subway station

The decision by an Ontario Superior Court judge caps a seven-year legal battle over construction problems that afflicted Pioneer Village station.


😂😂😂
I'm looking forward to the hefty fare increase we're going to have next year to offset this and the nice hefty pay increase that operators will be getting over the next 3 years.
 
I'm looking forward to the hefty fare increase we're going to have next year to offset this and the nice hefty pay increase that operators will be getting over the next 3 years.

Be thankful this isn't London UK.

The one way fare is between £2.80 and £7.90 depending on where you go. That's $4.90 and $13.80 respectively.

Larger system with zones yes but could you imagine paying $10 each way to ride the subway?
 
Be thankful this isn't London UK.

The one way fare is between £2.80 and £7.90 depending on where you go. That's $4.90 and $13.80 respectively.

Larger system with zones yes but could you imagine paying $10 each way to ride the subway?
My friends without cars often pay $60+ to "ride the subway" due to the constant service suspensions when you factor in the uber
 
I'm looking forward to the hefty fare increase we're going to have next year to offset this and the nice hefty pay increase that operators will be getting over the next 3 years.
The project has a contingency fund set aside for problem like this. I'm not sure if they used it up since the project was already overrun. Since this is a border station and York Region was suppose to pay a portion of overrun cost, they might be forced to chip in too.
 

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