[nfitz]

It's the same equipment but the streetcar detectors are located on the streetcar tracks. In that video there were no vehicles on the streetcar tracks.

I always assumed it was a receiver on the pole at the intersection. At stops before the lights it seems easy enough to detect and extend the green if the streetcar is on top. But I'm scratching my head how that works on intersections where the stop is after intersection; perhaps the detector is set far back to predict when it will need the green?

 

[Monarch Butterfly]

Don't the streetcars (and buses) have GPS in them? Wouldn't the GPS give the position to be able to trigger the transit signal, when needed? If our smartphone transit applications can get the transit vehicle location, so can the transit signals.

 

[bearcat]

Maybe the streetcar drivers should have a button to manually request a green extension.

 

[zang]

Don't the streetcars (and buses) have GPS in them? Wouldn't the GPS give the position to be able to trigger the transit signal, when needed? If our smartphone transit applications can get the transit vehicle location, so can the transit signals.

GPS can be terribly inconsistent around tall towers.

 

[reaperexpress]

Maybe the streetcar drivers should have a button to manually request a green extension.

It takes a different amount of time to provide a green light at each intersection depending on the flashing don't Walk duration. Failing to request TSP at the exact right moment will cause it to work ineffectively.

Using buttons to trigger TSP would make the system even less effective.

I always assumed it was a receiver on the pole at the intersection.

No. That has never been the case in Toronto.

At stops before the lights it seems easy enough to detect and extend the green if the streetcar is on top. But I'm scratching my head how that works on intersections where the stop is after intersection; perhaps the detector is set far back to predict when it will need the green?

It's actually the opposite. It's way easier to predict when a streetcar will arrive when it's driving towards the intersection. If it's at a stop you don't know how long it will sit there and therefore don't know when you should aim to have a green light.

Requesting priority when the operator presses the door close button can help in some cases but in most cases it wouldn't help since you need to request priority 14 to 40 seconds before you want a green, and it only takes about 7 seconds to close the door and start moving. If the stop is 7 seconds from the stop line, that would be a perfect moment to request TSP at an intersection that needs 14 seconds of advance notice. But if the stop is right at the stop line, requesting TSP 7 seconds in advance means you can only benefit from 7 seconds of green extension. The City policy currently allows up to 30.

 

[nfitz]

I always assumed it was a receiver on the pole at the intersection

No. That has never been the case in Toronto.

Is it the same equipment that gives (gave) Toronto Fire override? Surely they have "a button to press" or something.

 

[daptive]

Is it the same equipment that gives (gave) Toronto Fire override? Surely they have "a button to press" or something.

I think emergency vehicles have a special IR light that flashes at the intersection, I also assume dispatch can do something to clear routes.

 

[reaperexpress]

Is it the same equipment that gives (gave) Toronto Fire override? Surely they have "a button to press" or something.

https://www.toronto.ca/services-pay...nal-operations/traffic-signal-prioritization/

You can use a button for fire preemption because it leaves the light green for several minutes, which provides a large enough margin of error.

 

[reaperexpress]

I think emergency vehicles have a special IR light that flashes at the intersection, I also assume dispatch can do something to clear routes.

Not in Toronto. York and Peel regions use systems like that

 

[zang]

I think emergency vehicles have a special IR light that flashes at the intersection, I also assume dispatch can do something to clear routes.

Plus, y'know, the flashing red (and blue) lights to warn people not to cross-enter the intersection.

 

[nfitz]

Not in Toronto. York and Peel regions use systems like that

Toronto certainly used to use something like that. I was crossing Don Mills Road once, and the siren started ... and the pedestrian white, that had just turned white, went back to red with no countdown. Stranding me and others on the narrow non-pedestrianized median.

 

[zang]

Toronto certainly used to use something like that. I was crossing Don Mills Road once, and the siren started ... and the pedestrian white, that had just turned white, went back to red with no countdown. Stranding me and others on the narrow non-pedestrianized median.

You sure that just isn't a messed up crosswalk? Got plenty of ill-programmed ones around the city. My favourite are the signals that go from countdown back to walk.

 

[smallspy]

Toronto certainly used to use something like that. I was crossing Don Mills Road once, and the siren started ... and the pedestrian white, that had just turned white, went back to red with no countdown. Stranding me and others on the narrow non-pedestrianized median.

No, they didn't.

A lot of stations near intersections have their door opening tied to the signals of the nearby intersections. That's why you got caught.

Dan

 

[reaperexpress]

Toronto certainly used to use something like that. I was crossing Don Mills Road once, and the siren started ... and the pedestrian white, that had just turned white, went back to red with no countdown. Stranding me and others on the narrow non-pedestrianized median.

In what way does this prove that they are using "a special IR light that flashes at the intersection"? The City website I linked in my previous response to your post explains how emergency vehicle pre-emption is triggered, and it's not an Opticom sensor.

 

[nfitz]

You sure that just isn't a messed up crosswalk? Got plenty of ill-programmed ones around the city. My favourite are the signals that go from countdown back to walk.

I used it twice a day for years, and it was the only time it ever did that. And you could hear the siren when it went red, with fire trucks going through on the green a few seconds later. I suppose the pre-emption programming could have been messed up by not keeping the pedestrian phase going.

A lot of stations near intersections have their door opening tied to the signals of the nearby intersections. That's why you got caught.

Yeah, I've seen that right in front of the firehouse on Woodbine. But Don Mills and Duncan Mills is over a mile from the nearest fire station. Though only the second traffic light from Station 115 at Sheppard and the 404.

In what way does this prove that they are using "a special IR light that flashes at the intersection"?

I didn't say that it did; just that they used something. Digging back to posts from that time period, it was a switch at the Firehall or a switch at the intersection control box itself - which obviously is not the case in this time (I don't see a point of that other than for testing ... though I guess in theory police could use it when escorting a paramedic emergency run ... but that seems very unlikely ... they use their cars to block crossing traffic when I've seen this happen).

The City website I linked in my previous response to your post explains how emergency vehicle pre-emption is triggered, and it's not an Opticom sensor.

Ah, sorry I missed that; you had two posts close together, and I only saw the second. I find putting both responses in the same post helps readability.