[kEiThZ]

Apart from mandate issues, how many VIA stations do they actually own in places where they could overcome planning issues as well as make some serious cash because of metro size and station location? Ottawa (post-LRT) maybe?

Yep. People act as though it's easy. But most big city VIA stations have old CN/CP Hotels across the street. Or they are in small towns where a hotel at the train station isn't going to the revenue generator people think it is. Even Ottawa's station, while convenient to downtown, would be a very crappy spot for a hotel. And has a large Marriott down the street.

 

[jje1000]

The other thing to keep in mind about Brightline is that it is partially a real estate play.

Every smart rail company is.

Agreed- on an aside, most North American rail lines and privately-owned transit companies were historically also real estate plays as well- probably in part due to the need to actually create ridership and business from scratch.

 

[sche]

Agreed- on an aside, most North American rail lines and privately-owned transit companies were historically also real estate plays as well- probably in part due to the need to actually create ridership and business from scratch.

Every profitable transit agency I know of anywhere in the world, do real estate (Hong Kong MTR and Tokyo Metro, there’s probably a few others I don’t know about). They’re also super high ridership Asian metros, so that makes them have good farebox recovery, but I’’m pretty sure they would not be profitable without real estate.

 

[Streety McCarface]

Every profitable transit agency I know of anywhere in the world, do real estate (Hong Kong MTR and Tokyo Metro, there’s probably a few others I don’t know about). They’re also super high ridership Asian metros, so that makes them have good farebox recovery, but I’’m pretty sure they would not be profitable without real estate.

Some would still be profitable (ie JR East), but they'd have to get rid of half their assets.

 

[cplchanb]

Every profitable transit agency I know of anywhere in the world, do real estate (Hong Kong MTR and Tokyo Metro, there’s probably a few others I don’t know about). They’re also super high ridership Asian metros, so that makes them have good farebox recovery, but I’’m pretty sure they would not be profitable without real estate.

I think the major issue for VIA is that they are over reliant on the govt's wallet and are at the whim of the political red tape. They need to find a way to lessen their dependence on the feds and more for themselves, whether itd be affiliations with other companies or reentering the real estate market etc. At any time they could fall back into the dark decade like the 90s.

 

[asher__jo]

1) This is beyond VIA's mandate and the lobbying from competitors would probably kill VIA's rail plans too.

2) Most VIA stations already have hotels nearby. There's a reason the Royal York is across from Union Station, and the Queen Elizabeth is across from Gare Centrale in Montreal. They were formerly CN Hotel properties, then CP Hotels and Fairmont after CP Hotels merged into that company. Delta Hotels is the other successor of CP Hotels. This is why there's a Fairmont or Delta near virtually every existing or old train station in the country.

Does Via have a partner hotel?

 

[Allandale25]

HFR update below. HT http://forum.skyscraperpage.com/showpost.php?p=8814989&postcount=1852

https://www.newswire.ca/news-release...858078227.html

High Frequency Rail: AECOM and Arup consortium selected as Owner's Engineers


NEWS PROVIDED BY
VIA Rail Canada Inc.
Jan 28, 2020, 18:33 ET


MONTRÉAL, Jan. 28, 2020 /CNW Telbec/ - The Joint Project Office (JPO) between VIA Rail Canada (VIA Rail) and the Canada Infrastructure Bank (CIB) announced the hiring of a joint venture formed by AECOM and Arup, that will act as the Owner's Engineers for the analysis of the High Frequency Rail (HFR) project in the Québec City - Montréal - Ottawa - Toronto corridor.

"We are pleased to have secured the expertise of these renowned firms. This is an important step of our mandate to complete the de-risking engineering and technical analysis; which are components required for a final recommendation on High Frequency Rail", said Vernon Barker, Project Director of the JPO.

The owner's engineers (OE) role during the pre-procurement due diligence phase is to support the Joint Project Office with all technical and engineering matters and form an integral part of the JPO team.

The OE's scope of work includes general technical and engineering support for all of the JPO workstreams and specific planning and engineering activities. The OE will also support the JPO in obtaining an environmental assessment and undertaking site investigation studies, including geotechnical studies.

The decision to contract this consortium was made after a rigorous competitive procurement process and a thorough evaluation of the proposals.

In 2019, the Canada Infrastructure Bank committed $55 million in funding for planning and pre-procurement work and working with VIA Rail to further explore VIA Rail's proposal for the High-Frequency Rail project. The Government of Canada added $16.1 million in funding for Transport Canada and VIA Rail to support VIA Rail's contributions to the important work of the JPO.

About the High Frequency Rail Project
High Frequency Rail (HFR) is VIA Rail Canada's proposal to transform passenger rail service in Canada. It would create new trains on dedicated tracks between major centres (Québec City-Montréal-Ottawa-Toronto). New routes would be established on discontinued and lower density rail infrastructure between Toronto-Peterborough-Ottawa, Ottawa-Dorion-Montréal and Montréal-Trois-Rivières-Québec City. The High Frequency Rail project involves separating passenger and freight rail operations, creating more capacity for sustainable transportation for both people and goods, as well as the opportunity to optimize current services along Lake Ontario and the St. Lawrence Seaway.

About VIA Rail
As Canada's national rail passenger service, VIA Rail (viarail.ca) and all its employees are mandated to provide safe, efficient and economical passenger transportation service, in both official languages of our country. VIA Rail operates intercity, regional and transcontinental trains linking over 400 communities across Canada, and about 180 more communities through intermodal partnerships, and safely transported over 5 million passengers in 2019. The Corporation has been awarded five Safety Awards and three Environment Awards by the Railway Association of Canada since 2007. Visit the "About VIA Rail" section at https://www.viarail.ca/en/about-via-rail.

About Canada Infrastructure Bank
The Canada Infrastructure Bank (CIB) has a mandate to invest $35 billion in complex infrastructure transactions via innovative financial tools over the course of 11 years. The CIB is attracting investment from private sector investors and institutional investors, in infrastructure projects in Canada or partly in Canada that generate revenue and that are in the public interest. The CIB has a unique expertise in infrastructure financing and provides advisory services on transformational projects.

SOURCE VIA Rail Canada Inc.


For further information: Félix Corriveau, Canada Infrastructure Bank, fcorriveau@cib-bic.ca, 416-550-0900; Marie-Anna Murat, VIA Rail Canada, medias@viarail.ca, 1-877-393-8787

 

[kEiThZ]

https://www.newswire.ca/news-release...858078227.html

I am happy there's progress. I am disappointed that they are probably a year or more away from even starting the EA. Which means there is the risk of an election before there's actually a shovel in the ground, with a high risk that Trudeau loses next time. Every time I read one of these pressers I am reminded of how much Trudeau f'd this up by not standing this JPO up earlier. Even in the absolute best case scenario, nobody is riding this before 2027. That is so disappointing.

 

[kEiThZ]

Does Via have a partner hotel?

Not that I know of. And I don't really know who would bother partnering with VIA. Unfortunately for them, the only CN hotels are Fairmonts. And the type of folks who would stay at a Fairmont, aren't likely to ride the train.

I think the major issue for VIA is that they are over reliant on the govt's wallet and are at the whim of the political red tape. They need to find a way to lessen their dependence on the feds and more for themselves, whether itd be affiliations with other companies or reentering the real estate market etc. At any time they could fall back into the dark decade like the 90s.

Real estate is out for the reasons mentioned above. I would argue the best (may be only) path forward at this stage is to build a profitable business around HFR first. And then eventually try and take on scenic routes on a profitable basis. Like the Rocky Mountaineer. The first step though has to be HFR. And then build a feeder bus service to their HFR stations that steal from Greyhound, Coach Canada, Megabus, etc.

 

[lenaitch]

Would a government, through one of its agencies, be willing to go into direct competition with the private sector?

As a comparator, does Amtrak own hotels?

 

[ShonTron]

Would a government, through one of its agencies, be willing to go into direct competition with the private sector?

As a comparator, does Amtrak own hotels?

No. The one important thing that Amtrak has that VIA Rail doesn't is more autonomy and the ability to enter funding agreements with states to fund regional rail services. For example, all the short-distance trains serving Chicago Union Station are funded by the surrounding states (Illinois, Michigan, Wisconsin, Missouri) - only the long distance trains are funded entirely by federal grants. In California, most Amtrak trains are funded and operated by the state.

Had VIA had similar arrangements, I would expect that Peterborough would still have rail service, and that Calgary-Edmonton would likely still be going.

 

[kEiThZ]

Had VIA had similar arrangements, I would expect that Peterborough would still have rail service, and that Calgary-Edmonton would likely still be going.

If VIA was genuinely this empowered, GO might never have been created and those services would all be part of VIA.

 

[kEiThZ]

Would a government, through one of its agencies, be willing to go into direct competition with the private sector?

Probably not. A few months back it came out that infrastructure bank was contemplating entering the telecom market to compete with the Big 3. There executive who drafted that business plan seems to have moved on....

I fully believe that the reason HSR hasn't happened in this country is because of the threat it would be to the cash cow routes for the airlines and the federal government. That alone should tell you something. It's a start with HFR. It's just slow enough to threaten Porter and not AC or WestJet too much.

 

[Urban Sky]

No. The one important thing that Amtrak has that VIA Rail doesn't is more autonomy and the ability to enter funding agreements with states to fund regional rail services. For example, all the short-distance trains serving Chicago Union Station are funded by the surrounding states (Illinois, Michigan, Wisconsin, Missouri) - only the long distance trains are funded entirely by federal grants. In California, most Amtrak trains are funded and operated by the state.

Had VIA had similar arrangements, I would expect that Peterborough would still have rail service, and that Calgary-Edmonton would likely still be going.

Just to be clear, "ability to enter funding agreements with states to fund regional rail services" means that the federal government has entirely delegated the funding responsibility of any non-NEC routes of less than 750 miles to the states:

State-Supported Intercity Passenger Rail (IPR) Services are Amtrak routes 750 miles or less outside the Northeast Corridor (which runs from Boston to Washington). Per federal statute, states are responsible for funding the costs of each state-supported route. Altogether, the 28 State-Supported IPR Services carry approximately one-half of all Amtrak riders nationwide and represent an important and growing part of the Amtrak national network. States contribute approximately $750 million in ticket revenue and direct payments to Amtrak. Over ten years, ridership on the State-Supported IPR Services has grown by 25%.

Source (also for quote provided above): State-Amtrak Intercity Passenger Rail Committee (SAIPRC)

A comparable arrangement for VIA would be that the federal government only retains funding responsibility for its transcontinental and remote mandates and offloads the Corridor onto the respective provinces, which would have saved the federal taxpayer $116.4 million (or 43% of VIA's total operational funding), to be compensated by the taxpayers of Ontario and Quebec (e.g. $94.7 vs. $21.7 million, if the burden is split according to the Corridor train mileage which falls onto the provinces' respective territories). This would indeed force the provincial governments to take their money where their mouth is rather than bitching about the lack of action by whatever federal government happens to be in power at the moment...

If VIA was genuinely this empowered, GO might never have been created and those services would all be part of VIA.

Wikipedia lists 31 commuter rail systems in the United States, of which all major metropolitan areas (e.g. NYC, Chicago, Philadelphia, Boston, SF, LA, DC) have their commuter rail network operated through their own transit agencies. In fact, only 3 routes operated by Amtrak (Capitol Corridor, Keystone Service and Downeaster) appear in that list and especially the classification of the latter is rather debatable...

 

[AHK]

Today - January 30:

VIA Rail Issues Request for Qualifications to Modernize its Montréal and Toronto Maintenance Centres

MONTREAL, Jan. 30, 2020 /CNW Telbec/ - As part of its Québec City – Windsor Corridor Fleet Replacement Program, VIA Rail Canada (VIA Rail) launches the first phase of a procurement process to construct new buildings and make upgrades to its maintenance centres in Montréal and Toronto, ahead of the arrival of its new fleet expected in 2022. This process follows the contract granted to Siemens to build and supply 32 train sets to replace the current fleet.
The scope of work for the project includes:

• A combination of constructing new buildings and making upgrades at both centres, including the yard, civil engineering systems, structural, architectural, mechanical and electrical systems, communication systems, and refuelling equipment; and
• Supplying and installing vehicle maintenance equipments

This modernization project will be funded with the money allocated to the Fleet Replacement Program in the Federal government's 2018 budget.
"Upgrading our Montréal and Toronto maintenance centres is one of the core projects of our organisation. It is an integral part of VIA Rail's transformation plan." said Cynthia Garneau, President and Chief Executive Officer. "In preparation for the introduction of our new fleet of trains, the modernization and upgrade of our facilities will also allow for the maintenance of the current fleet. Starting in 2022, our passengers will enjoy a renewed travel experience with a significantly lower environmental footprint, which also meets universal accessibility standards."
Phases of the procurement process
In preparation for the procurement process of this modernisation project of maintenance centres, VIA Rail conducted a market sounding exercise in December 2019 with general contractors interested in the project. This exercise not only gathered useful information from potential bidders but also aimed to promote VIA Rail's maintenance centres upgrade project to ensure participation from the private sector and encourage competition. The goal of this request for qualifications is to pre-qualify firms for work on the Montréal and Toronto maintenance centres. The following criteria will be used when selecting the firms during the procurement process: price, relevant experience and delivery capacity.
A Fairness Monitor was chosen to ensure the procurement process is open and transparent.
Phase 1 – Request for qualifications (RFQ), dates are approximate

• RFQ release: January 30, 2020
• RFQ submission deadline: March 31, 2020
• Deadline for the evaluation of submissions and shortlist release: May 2020

Phase 2 – Request for proposals (RFP)

• RFP release to shortlisted proponents: Summer 2020
• Proposal submission deadline: Fall 2020
• Awarding of the contract: Winter 2020–2021

Useful links

• Request for qualifications on MERX.
• VIA Rail launches RFQ to replace its Québec City – Windsor Corridor fleet
• VIA Rail selects Siemens Canada to replace its Québec City – Windsor Corridor fleet

About VIA Rail
As Canada's national rail passenger service, VIA Rail (viarail.ca) and all its employees are mandated to provide safe, efficient and economical passenger transportation service, in both official languages of our country. VIA Rail operates intercity, regional and transcontinental trains linking over 400 communities across Canada, and about 180 more communities through intermodal partnerships, and safely transported over 5 million passengers in 2019. The Corporation has been awarded five Safety Awards and three Environment Awards by the Railway Association of Canada since 2007. Visit the "About VIA Rail" section at https://www.viarail.ca/en/about-via-rail.