micheal_can
Senior Member
Could they dig under and make a new level?
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- Thread starter ehlow
- Start date
Could they dig under and make a new level?
roger1818
Senior Member
Not true. $71 million was awarded for the JPO, which is appropriate given the complexity and scope this project involves. It's natural that a detailed study is needed before any government for any project commits the full amount and launches a RFP process.
CIB working on the High Frequency Rail project | Canada Infrastructure Bank (CIB)
The Government of Canada and CIB are committing a total of $71.1M to further explore VIA Rail Canada’s proposal for High Frequency Rail in the Quebec City-Toronto Corridor.cib-bic.ca
I beleive this has been mentioned before, but given some of the comments here it is worth repeating. If you you click on the "READ MORE" button on the link you provided, it says (among other things):
So VIA will be able to use the tunnel in Montreal. Also, the "and Toronto" comment implies that they are have money to preserve access to Union Station from the Havelock Sub. This isn't a guarantee that HFR will happen, but it does indicates that current local development won't block HFR.
roger1818
Senior Member
I don't know, but with the Orange line right there and Mary, Queen of the World Cathedral right beside Central Station, it would be a tight squeeze.
2transpo
New Member
I think we are getting a bit ahead of ourselves on this thread. HFR is the furthest thing from a done deal. It seems that a lot of the preliminary work has been done to keep everyone distracted and happy in order to make them think it is coming.
The upcoming election/budget is the perfect place to sink the project. Even worse, if a Conservative government wins, HFR is guaranteed to be cancelled.
robmausser
Senior Member
At this point it would probably be best to just make a new station downtown with a connection to the Metro or REM. Especially since it would also solve the issue of continuing trains through to Quebec.
Allandale25
Senior Member
In my view, it will be easier to evaluate whether the JPO work is preliminary or extensive once they release any work. Once it's released, we can compare it to other big projects, like GO Electrification/OnCorr/Expansion and its material.
roger1818
Senior Member
I agree that HFR is not a done deal, but it is the best shot VIA has.
As I said earlier, I wouldn't say a Conservative government would guarantee the cancelation of HFR. Sure it would be a harder road, but if VIA can prove that HFR will result in reduced subsidies, that would be attractive to the Conservatives. The other key is that it can't be bad for either the airlines or the freight railways.
roger1818
Senior Member
Where would you place a new "station downtown" that solves "the issue of continuing trains through to Quebec?"
robmausser
Senior Member
Personally I would choose buying up the CN spur in the east, upgrading it and making a nice attractive 2 or 3 platform station on the waterfront of Old Montreal. Then continuing along that spur to the St.Jerome Line. From then St. Jerome Line east to Quebec City
All the rail would have to be purchased and upgraded various connections made etc, but thats exactly what HFR is all about.
It could connect to the REM 2 East plan at a station, as they are elevating through that area.
Attachments
Urban Sky
Senior Member
If you check 10 weeks or 82* pages back:
Not to mention that sending anything else than infrequent freight trains travelling at basically walking speed through the highly touristy Old Port area is a non-starter and that it is close to impossible to construct a connection into Gare Centrale:
*Guys, we really need to stop the spamming here! More than one page per day is an insane average over such a long period...
robmausser
Senior Member
Thats if the current tracks and alignment were used. Im proposing a complete rebuild through the area, and no connection to Gare Centrale. Its own station.
As an alternative to the above post that mentioned tunneling a new level under Gare Centrale, if we are using the costs of that as a starting point to what kind of funding would be available to do this.
Especially now that the REM East is proposed through the area
Urban Sky
Senior Member
Building a new station which is completely disjointed from existing rail networks (exo, VIA, REM, Metro) is a complete non-starter. It’s already bad enough with the distance between Gare Centrale and both Metro stations (Bonaventure on the orange line and McGill on the green light), but at least if is accessible...
Underneath the Gare Centrale are streets (Rue Saint-Antoine, Saint-Jacques, Notre Dame) and then the various arms of the Ville-Marie Highway tunnel, which make the construction of an underground station an insanely expensive fantasy. if you refer to my post from August 2019 (to which you even reacted):
So what about going above or below the current ROW? Above, forget it, as there are buildings on top of Gare Centrale and the green line above the existing Mont-Royal tunnel (refer to the picture of McGill station further above).
As for going below the current ROW, there is the slight problem that the Autoroute Ville-Marie (think of the Gradiner Highway, but well hidden in a tunnel) happens to be the most complex just at the eastern end of Gare Centrale:
Adapted from: World Road Association
Just to give you an idea of how deep you would have to dig to avoid the Ville-Marie and Viger tunnel complex, it reaches until 42 meters under street level only 200 meters north of where VIA passengers leaving Gare Centrale view the daylight for the first time (exact location here):
Source: World Road Association
And we haven't even touched the question of where and how you want to build a full-size intercity terminal railway station anywhere underground and near Gare Centrale...
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robmausser
Senior Member
But I am proposing connecting it to REM East...
Urban Sky
Senior Member
Just that your proposed station location might connect with the REM East (what do we actually know about its exact routing and station locations at this point?) doesn’t change the fact that it wouldn’t connect with all the other rail networks I listed (including the core REM network currently under construction)...
2transpo
New Member
It's concerning because we were supposed to have more details by the end of 2020, but there was silence. It seems the government has been humouring VIA and never had any intention to build it.
HFR as a concept isn't going to survive past the next budget. If there is an election in 2021, HFR is going to be buried even deeper.