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It wasn't operational at the time, but that it was planned was clearly documented in the publicly released contract between TTC and Metrolinx two years earlier. The comment at the time, simply showed that Region of Waterloo staff had not done their homework.

That they are still repeating this mistruth five years later demonstrates gross ignorance!

If the RoW put out a RFP with certain requirements, isn't it incumbent on the organizations bidding on the contract to demonstrate that they can meet the requirements? If Presto failed to do that, or didn't bid, I'm pretty sure that disqualifies them from consideration.
 
If the RoW put out a RFP with certain requirements, isn't it incumbent on the organizations bidding on the contract to demonstrate that they can meet the requirements? If Presto failed to do that, or didn't bid, I'm pretty sure that disqualifies them from consideration.
They didn't respond to the bid.

However, if you request bids on providing you cars, and Chrysler doesn't reply - it's fine to say Chrysler didn't bid. But I don't think you can say that also Chrysler cars don't have tires or headlights.
 
^ it is crazy how those trains (streetcars) running empty for months...

1. Light rail vehicles.

2. Each vehicle needs 600+ kilometres of run in time to be accepted.

3. Each operator needs training on an accepted vehicle.

4. The track needs to be accepted.

5. The signal system needs to be accepted.
 
I have read old news stories about streetcars. Often, the track was completed on Friday and service began on Monday. We have made these systems so sophisticated that it requires several months of testing to make sure that all the complexity is in working order. Have we gained that much in 100+ years of streetcar evolution?
 
I have read old news stories about streetcars. Often, the track was completed on Friday and service began on Monday.
You still see that in Toronto when they rebuild lines. Though more normally finish on Saturday and start Sunday ...

There's a big difference between restoring or even extending service, and having an entire city that has never had service before. You don't want to get that wrong.
 
I have read old news stories about streetcars. Often, the track was completed on Friday and service began on Monday. We have made these systems so sophisticated that it requires several months of testing to make sure that all the complexity is in working order. Have we gained that much in 100+ years of streetcar evolution?

70% of the complexity is related to safety in one way or another.

The other 30% is stuff like tracking, GPS, automation.

But the majority is safety related. Both for people on the LRT and the cars/pedestrians around it.

100 years ago, people would die all the time from streetcar related injuries. falling off the streetcar because doors opened while it was moving, collisions with other vehicles, running over pedestrians. etc etc. Just bury the bodies next to the others who died from polio, etc.

We've decided as a society that this kind of thing is not acceptable and we accept delays and long time lines in order to make sure that they are safe.
 
70% of the complexity is related to safety in one way or another.

The other 30% is stuff like tracking, GPS, automation.

But the majority is safety related. Both for people on the LRT and the cars/pedestrians around it.

100 years ago, people would die all the time from streetcar related injuries. falling off the streetcar because doors opened while it was moving, collisions with other vehicles, running over pedestrians. etc etc. Just bury the bodies next to the others who died from polio, etc.

We've decided as a society that this kind of thing is not acceptable and we accept delays and long time lines in order to make sure that they are safe.
so no inefficiency?
 
Latest update on the WR LRT. I've pulled the relevant report from the upcoming Council agenda package. See attached.
 

Attachments

  • WR LRT Report - February 28, 2019.pdf
    89.5 KB · Views: 474
You still see that in Toronto when they rebuild lines. Though more normally finish on Saturday and start Sunday ...

There's a big difference between restoring or even extending service, and having an entire city that has never had service before. You don't want to get that wrong.

Did Kitchener/Waterloo not have streetcars 100 years ago? I thought every notable city in Ontario did.
 
Did Kitchener/Waterloo not have streetcars 100 years ago? I thought every notable city in Ontario did.
Yes, in fact they found old tracks when digging up the main thoroughfare for the new ones. I was living in Guelph at the time, it was quite the cause celebre. K/W folks can add more detail on that, (edit:
Century-old streetcar line found under LRT construction | TheRecord )
but meantime:
[...]
A BRIEF HISTORY OF ELECTRIC TRANSIT IN WATERLOO REGION
While Waterloo Region’s ION LRT may be an ambitious project, the region has had a long history with electric public transit. Even before Waterloo County was established in 1857, the area was known for its industry. Served by the Grand River and associated tributaries like the Nith and the Conestogo, the county was the site of many mills, and the settlement of a significant community of Mennonites. The Grand Trunk Railway and the Canadian Pacific Railways came through the area in the middle of the 19th century, and industries soon set up in the growing towns of Berlin (today’s Kitchener) and Galt (located in today’s southern Cambridge).

Streetcar service in Waterloo County dates to 1886 with the incorporation of the Berlin and Waterloo Street Railway. Horsecar service was operating between the two towns along King Street by 1888 and, by 1889, the line boasted a bustling operation of eight open cars, eight closed cars and three large covered sleighs. The service initially ran from Cedar Street in Waterloo (today known as Bridgeport Road) to Scott Street in Kitchener. A branch line was also built from King Street to the Grand Trunk Railway station (later CN) at the intersection of Victoria and Weber Streets.

Electric streetcar operation arrived in Waterloo County on July 26, 1894 in the form of the Galt and Preston Street Railway, operating along King Street in what is today Cambridge. This was followed by an extension from Preston to Hespeler, and the launch of the Preston and Berlin Railway on October 6, 1904. The latter brought tracks into the City of Berlin (today known as Kitchener). These railways were amalgamated on January 1, 1908 into the Berlin, Waterloo, Wellesley and Lake Huron Railway. In 1914, the company was leased to Canadian Pacific Railway, who changed the name to the Grand River Railway Company.

The Berlin and Waterloo Street Railway, meanwhile, upgraded its tracks and launched electric service on May 18, 1895. It soon laid double tracks on King Street from Water Street to Albert Street. Further streetcar expansion occurred in the form of the Berlin and Bridgeport Electric Street Railway. Incorporated on January 7, 1901, it launched the construction of a five-mile line from downtown Kitchener towards the village of Bridgeport, opening to a sugar beet factory on July 14, 1902, and finally reaching Bridgeport on August 1, the same year. The company had plans to build to Elora and Fergus, and changed its name to the Berlin and Northern Railway in 1912, but the extension never took place. This was the poorest performing street railway in the county and, in 1923, it was taken over by the City of Kitchener and merged with the former Berlin and Waterloo Street Railway (known as the Kitchener and Waterloo Street Railway after Berlin was renamed Kitchener in 1916).
[...]
 
Did Kitchener/Waterloo not have streetcars 100 years ago? I thought every notable city in Ontario did.
How does the knowledge from that operation get transferred to the current employees?

Surely there's no difference between starting service now in a city that never had any service, to that that removed it some 70 years ago!
 

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