[dt_toronto_geek]

sorry to kill all the optimism but there was a high profile murder in that area just a couple off days ago

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/cri...laying-of-woman-near-wellesley-and-sherbourne

I wouldn't call it a high profile murder, it's just another unfortunate murder. The poverty rate in this area is fairly high but it's not as crime ridden as one might expect, though drugs are more of a problem in the area. All that said it's not somewhere you can't or shouldn't walk through by day or night. If your not dealing/buying drugs or part of a gang your fine. It's not a great area to live but it doesn't deserve the bad rap that it sometimes gets. The area by or on the site of the former Wellesley hospital is where it begins to get a little sketchy but the area is changing.

 

[Roy G Biv]

The area is up-and-coming and offers tremendous value for your dollar. And the last couple of posts are bang-on. There is a drug-trade, but if you don't mix with this crowd, you'll be fine. I live in the area and have never felt unsafe.

Which building were you targeting? 500 Sherbourne or Verve?

This whole area has undergone quite the transformation over the last few years:- - Library/community centre
- Old folk's home
- Long-term-care building
- Steam Plant Lofts
- 500 Sherbourne
- Verve
- Star of Downtown
- Cooper Mansions

 

[UserNameToronto]

If you avoid any all places with high profile murders, you're never going to be able to live anywhere.

And if you're not involved in gangs or drugs, the odds of being the victim of a high-profile murder are incredibly small.

I'd add another comment, but the above poster nailed it.

 

[harsh]

I'd add another comment, but the above poster nailed it.

To each his/her own. Safety is a relative term anyways. Personally when it comes to safety I ask myself this: "would I be ok with my kids playing outside unsupervised?" in this area(and many other areas but we are discussing wellesley & sherourne), no.

You don't have to be in a gang or sell/use drugs to fall victim to crime. Just being in the vicinity increases your chances. Many innocent ppl have lost their lives being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Generally speaking I don't want to live in an area where I can't walk down a certain street, be out past a certain time, or can't associate with certain people.

Esp when I'm spending $200k+ on property

 

[cdr108]

To each his/her own. Safety is a relative term anyways. Personally when it comes to safety I ask myself this: "would I be ok with my kids playing outside unsupervised?" in this area(and many other areas but we are discussing wellesley & sherourne), no.

You don't have to be in a gang or sell/use drugs to fall victim to crime. Just being in the vicinity increases your chances. Many innocent ppl have lost their lives being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Generally speaking I don't want to live in an area where I can't walk down a certain street, be out past a certain time, or can't associate with certain people.

Esp when I'm spending $200k+ on property

i'm surprised with the prices for the condos around the area ... verve, 500 sherbourne, the star of downtown.

 

[Roy G Biv]

To each his/her own. Safety is a relative term anyways. Personally when it comes to safety I ask myself this: "would I be ok with my kids playing outside unsupervised?" in this area(and many other areas but we are discussing wellesley & sherourne), no.

You don't have to be in a gang or sell/use drugs to fall victim to crime. Just being in the vicinity increases your chances. Many innocent ppl have lost their lives being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Generally speaking I don't want to live in an area where I can't walk down a certain street, be out past a certain time, or can't associate with certain people.

Esp when I'm spending $200k+ on property

You're being paranoid, so enjoy Georgetown.

 

[dt_toronto_geek]

To each his/her own. Safety is a relative term anyways. Personally when it comes to safety I ask myself this: "would I be ok with my kids playing outside unsupervised?" in this area(and many other areas but we are discussing wellesley & sherourne), no.

You don't have to be in a gang or sell/use drugs to fall victim to crime. Just being in the vicinity increases your chances. Many innocent ppl have lost their lives being in the wrong place at the wrong time.

Generally speaking I don't want to live in an area where I can't walk down a certain street, be out past a certain time, or can't associate with certain people.

Esp when I'm spending $200k+ on property

Very few innocent people lose their lives to crime in Toronto being in the wrong place at the wrong time. It happens, but it's very uncommon.

As for the analogy of whether you would leave your children alone to play unsupervised, would you do this anywhere?

 

[taal]

What makes a murder high profile? Someone is losing their life in each and every murder.


Going by what I think your implying is high profile how can this possibly be one? This was targeted, they knew each other ...

Random / accidental i.e. Jane Creba ... and a few more since then is a different story.

 

[hwy7]

I'm moving to the Wellesley & Sherbourne area in a few months, so I read this thread with great interest.

I'm in the "you're fine if you're not engaging in illegal activities" camp. I lived in Rexdale during the "summer of the gun" or whatever they called it, and not a darn thing happened to me.

 

[Kenny]

What makes a murder high profile? Someone is losing their life in each and every murder.

There was an interesting bit in the book "Freakonomics" where he discusses the types of deaths that catch people's attention. Houses with swimming pools are several orders more dangerous than houses with guns, but people get freaked out when there's a gun in the house.

It has to do with the perception of control. You fear what you do not understand or you do not have control over. Hence, terrorism is scary even though the number of deaths due to terrorism is extremely low. We don't have control over the terrorists! Drugs are scary because they're illegal! People dying from poor diet choices and lack of exercise is not scary.

Back to your point. Homicides which seem random (gang violence that kills innocents) is high profile. Rich white people getting killed is high profile - you'd think if anybody would be safe, it would be them! Domestic homicides involving poor minorities is low profile.

 

[harsh]

What makes a murder high profile? Someone is losing their life in each and every murder.


Going by what I think your implying is high profile how can this possibly be one? This was targeted, they knew each other ...

Random / accidental i.e. Jane Creba ... and a few more since then is a different story.

IMO its high profile when the victim's or accuser's picture is displayed on news sites or broadcasts.

for example recently 2 people were lost their lives in an ajax parking lot. Their names were given but their pictures were never displayed. Not taking anything away from their value of life but thats was low profile.

What made us remember Jane Creba was her face being plastered on television on every news station.

Very few innocent people lose their lives to crime in Toronto being in the wrong place at the wrong time. It happens, but it's very uncommon.

maybe so but that alone doesn't help me sleep at night if I move into a high crime area.

As for the analogy of whether you would leave your children alone to play unsupervised, would you do this anywhere?

as a kid you never played basketball/baseball/soccer at the local park w/o your parents? I'm not talking about a 7 yr old kid here. Normally it's ok to let my son play ball hockey down the street until 7pm with his friends, but in this area I wouldn't.

FYI I live in Scaborough so I'm not hiding in Georgetown away from the city. I'm well aware crime can happen anywhere. But growing up in the east end you learn why crime happens and what you can do to prevent becoming a victim other than ignoring it exists.

I'm moving to the Wellesley & Sherbourne area in a few months, so I read this thread with great interest.

I'm in the "you're fine if you're not engaging in illegal activities" camp. I lived in Rexdale during the "summer of the gun" or whatever they called it, and not a darn thing happened to me.

By all means this is just a debate ultimately it depends on the individual. However I am surprised with the level of indifference in this thread. I don't see how you can be comfortable living beside criminal activity simply b/c you don't dabble in it. believe me you will be effected by the environment whether you like it or not. Then you'll realize the only choice you have is to leave or make a positive difference in the area you live. Ask yourself are you up for that challenge if it comes?

 

[Roy G Biv]

FYI I live in Scaborough so

LOL

I read a lot more about shootings in Scarborough than I do about shootings at Wellesley and Sherbourne.

And your kids won't be playing road hockey on any downtown streets, so no need to worry about that issue.

 

[dt_toronto_geek]

IMO its high profile when the victim's or accuser's picture is displayed on news sites or broadcasts.

for example recently 2 people were lost their lives in an ajax parking lot. Their names were given but their pictures were never displayed. Not taking anything away from their value of life but thats was low profile.

What made us remember Jane Creba was her face being plastered on television on every news station.



maybe so but that alone doesn't help me sleep at night if I move into a high crime area.



as a kid you never played basketball/baseball/soccer at the local park w/o your parents? I'm not talking about a 7 yr old kid here. Normally it's ok to let my son play ball hockey down the street until 7pm with his friends, but in this area I wouldn't.

FYI I live in Scaborough so I'm not hiding in Georgetown away from the city. I'm well aware crime can happen anywhere. But growing up in the east end you learn why crime happens and what you can do to prevent becoming a victim other than ignoring it exists.




By all means this is just a debate ultimately it depends on the individual. However I am surprised with the level of indifference in this thread. I don't see how you can be comfortable living beside criminal activity simply b/c you don't dabble in it. believe me you will be effected by the environment whether you like it or not. Then you'll realize the only choice you have is to leave or make a positive difference in the area you live. Ask yourself are you up for that challenge if it comes?

Crime of some sort is everywhere in the city, The Bridle Path, Bay Street corridor, Cabbagetown, Rexdale, Scarborough etc. One shouldn't allow crime statistics to affect the quality of life or where they live, life is too short as it is without worrying about that. Parent's do however have an obligation to protect their children until they are old enough to take care of themselves and make informed decisions.

I also grew up in Scarborough in the Warden & Ellesmere area which was, and still is a nice suburban area with post war homes as far as the eye can see. I only played baseball as a kid and there were always several adults involved plus I don't remember going anywhere unsupervised without one of my parents, an aunt, uncle or trusted adult to take us to where we were going. I didn't start to wander off on my own until I was 12 or 13 and I remember vividly my dad giving me long talks which essentially amounted to street proofing me of the potential dangers to watch out for when I'd travel downtown alone. I was 14 when Emanuel Jaques (the shoeshine boy) was killed, now that was a high profile murder. I wasn't allowed to go downtown alone for about a year after that event.

 

[harsh]

LOL

I read a lot more about shootings in Scarborough than I do about shootings at Wellesley and Sherbourne.

are you really comparing crime stats of an intersection and a couple of side streets where maybe 3000 people reside to a whole city of approx 600, 000???? LOL are you kidding me?

And your kids won't be playing road hockey on any downtown streets, so no need to worry about that issue.

really? even more reason why I wouldn't live in this area if there's no place for kids to play. I'm not a fan of downtown, in general the condos and facilities are not family-friendly as pointed out in another thread.

I also grew up in Scarborough in the Warden & Ellesmere area which was, and still is a nice suburban area with post war homes as far as the eye can see...I didn't start to wander off on my own until I was 12 or 13 and I remember vividly my dad giving me long talks which essentially amounted to street proofing me of the potential dangers to watch out for when I'd travel downtown alone.

I don't recall the shoeshine boy incident, but I agree with your comment. Around 12-17yrs was the age range I was referring to. In scarborough there's a lot of side streets where kids can play away from heavy traffic and people actually sleep at night. Downtown there's no place for kids to do anything productive outside and people are out all hours of the night making noise I hate that. What the hell are you doing outside at 2:30am.....oh yeah that's right...

 

[GraphicMatt]

17,000 people live at Yonge & Wellsley, not 3,000.