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- Thread starter kkgg7
- Start date
kkgg7
Banned
Agree.
We have a downtown. Anything west of Bathurst is west end, east of DVP is east end, north of Eglinton Ave (or a bit north, Roselawn) is north end. All these "end" are pretty much suburban in nature, except for a few busier intersections.
Between Davenport and Eglington(Roselawn/Erksine), Bathurst and Bayview, well, let's use Chicago's term, it is the near north side.
We don't have an uptown. North York just a big suburb with a busier main commercial street.
Redroom Studios
Senior Member
I'm one who tends to have a very broad definition... I'd say east on Queen to Victoria Park, west on Bloor to Jane St or The Humber, North to Yonge and Lawrence (so generally the Old City of Toronto limits) Areas that have main streets composed of store fronts and sidewalks rather than strip malls and big box stores is one of the main differentiating factors between downtown and suburbs.
King of Kensington
Senior Member
These are the long-accepted boundaries:
Central Area: Bathurst to DVP, Dupont/Rosedale Valley
[Contains downtown within it - University/Jarvis/Davenport/Front]
North Toronto: Old City of Toronto north of Central Area, east of Bathurst, including Rosedale
West: Old City of Toronto west of Bathurst
East: Old City of Toronto east of Don River
Central Area: Bathurst to DVP, Dupont/Rosedale Valley
[Contains downtown within it - University/Jarvis/Davenport/Front]
North Toronto: Old City of Toronto north of Central Area, east of Bathurst, including Rosedale
West: Old City of Toronto west of Bathurst
East: Old City of Toronto east of Don River
King of Kensington
Senior Member
There's nothing in between "downtown" and "suburbs"?
There are certainly neighborhoods that are clearly "urban" but not "downtown" - such as Parkdale and South Riverdale.
Then there are the "streetcar suburbs" developed between 1910 and 1930 - the Beaches, Danforth, North Toronto and St. Clair West, etc.
Dan416
Senior Member
Your definitions seem to leave out everything outside of the "old City of Toronto" which is rather limiting.
King of Kensington
Senior Member
People still identify with Etobicoke, Scarborough and the like, so why not call them what they are?
RC8
Senior Member
I very rarely refer to Scarborough, North York, or Etobicoke as 'Toronto'. They are made up mostly of Toronto haters as far as I'm concerned.
GenerationW
Senior Member
Dan416
Senior Member
Scarborough, North York and Etobicoke are every bit as useable as other former municipalities to identify a specific area within a city, e.g. Streetsville, Port Credit, Cooksville, Malton.
But the former are still Toronto, and the latter are still Mississauga.
But the former are still Toronto, and the latter are still Mississauga.
RC8
Senior Member
You can see this in three ways:
1. All sprawl and satellite towns can be considered part of the mother city.
2. Sprawl and satellite towns can be considered part of the mother city so long as they have been officially absorbed for whatever reasons.
3. Sprawl and satellite towns should only be considered part of the mother city when their urban fabric is coherent with that found in the mother city.
All 3 are correct, hence the University of TORONTO campus in Mississauga, Etobicoke being part of the city of Toronto, and the clear social divide that exists between 'downtown' and the recently annexed suburbs.
For the purposes of someone who lives inside the boundaries of the old City of Toronto, and is used to all the amenities found in that area, the 3rd view makes most sense. I don't feel Scarborough City Centre any closer than Port Credit, for example. Au countraire, I feel like Port Credit is more of an extension of the urban area in which I live than SCC. Likewise, Yonge in North York is slowly becoming more 'Toronto' than other annexed areas, as it's beginning to provide people from the Old City with the amenities they rely on for their lifestyles.
If Canada annexed the city of Buffalo to save it from financial meltdown this wouldn't make it a Canadian city for most Canadians. Not until the values, culture, and assets that you expect to find in all Canadian cities are there. It's the same principle.
1. All sprawl and satellite towns can be considered part of the mother city.
2. Sprawl and satellite towns can be considered part of the mother city so long as they have been officially absorbed for whatever reasons.
3. Sprawl and satellite towns should only be considered part of the mother city when their urban fabric is coherent with that found in the mother city.
All 3 are correct, hence the University of TORONTO campus in Mississauga, Etobicoke being part of the city of Toronto, and the clear social divide that exists between 'downtown' and the recently annexed suburbs.
For the purposes of someone who lives inside the boundaries of the old City of Toronto, and is used to all the amenities found in that area, the 3rd view makes most sense. I don't feel Scarborough City Centre any closer than Port Credit, for example. Au countraire, I feel like Port Credit is more of an extension of the urban area in which I live than SCC. Likewise, Yonge in North York is slowly becoming more 'Toronto' than other annexed areas, as it's beginning to provide people from the Old City with the amenities they rely on for their lifestyles.
If Canada annexed the city of Buffalo to save it from financial meltdown this wouldn't make it a Canadian city for most Canadians. Not until the values, culture, and assets that you expect to find in all Canadian cities are there. It's the same principle.
ezpz
New Member
Yeah, as if a city's bureaucrats get to decide where the citizens consider downtown to be. They sure can try though...
js97
Senior Member
nfitz
Superstar
??? Most of the infrastructure the city seems to build these days isn't downtown. There hasn't been a subway station built downtown since the 1960s ... well 1978 if you count St. George to Eglinton West ... yet we still seem to be building those. Much of the road construction seems to be out in the suburbs. When was the last time Richmond/Adelaide got paved ... the 1960s judging by the streetcar tracks there that are based on a 2-way road system that hasn't been in place since the DVP opened ...
At the same time though, a disproportinate share of property taxes is collected downtown. I saw some numbers once that indicated that even though only about 25% of the population is in Toronto-East York, the area was contributing far more in terms of taxes. Anyone got a reference for that?
ToroTO
Active Member
As far as I'm concerned, downtown refers to the area bounded by Bathurst, Parliament, the lake and Davenport/Bloor. Yorkville, Annex are part of downtown, Cabbagetown, Parkdale, Rosedale, etc. are central but not downtown. I don't consider it to be limited by simply being a commercial/retail area, residential areas can be downtown too. The fact that there are single family homes mere blocks from office towers does not discount an area from being downtown.
I grew up in Scarborough and there was only "downtown" and then everything else, which was identified by either neighbourhood or intersection - "uptown" and "midtown" didn't exist. Never heard anyone use those other 2 terms in regards to this city until I started reading this or other similar message boards. Up/Midtown seem to be appropriated from descriptions of other cities, not Toronto and seem to be fairly meaningless in this city, since there is no accepted definition of their locations. I would never say to someone I live in "midtown", because they wouldn't have any idea where that is: could be Yonge and St. Clair, Mt. Pleasant and Eglinton or Yonge and Bloor! The fact that there is much disagreement in this topic just shows how they don't work for a city like Toronto so there isn't really any reason for trying to force them to fit.
I grew up in Scarborough and there was only "downtown" and then everything else, which was identified by either neighbourhood or intersection - "uptown" and "midtown" didn't exist. Never heard anyone use those other 2 terms in regards to this city until I started reading this or other similar message boards. Up/Midtown seem to be appropriated from descriptions of other cities, not Toronto and seem to be fairly meaningless in this city, since there is no accepted definition of their locations. I would never say to someone I live in "midtown", because they wouldn't have any idea where that is: could be Yonge and St. Clair, Mt. Pleasant and Eglinton or Yonge and Bloor! The fact that there is much disagreement in this topic just shows how they don't work for a city like Toronto so there isn't really any reason for trying to force them to fit.