Tewder
Senior Member
Tewder:
Then you better be ready to debate the specifics of how multicultural policy is operationalized in Canada, and demonstrate exactly what negative effects are the direct result of such operationalized policies, rather than coming up with generic slogans like "Down with multiculturalism". Down with what kind of multiculturalism?
Oh come now, in the context of a casual discussion forum I hardly think I need to "debate the specifics". How about you though? If that's what you are insisting on then where is your quantifiable non-anecdotal proof that Multiculturalism has any benefit *whatsoever* for Canada? Platitudes about 'unity through diversity' do not cut it either!
Can you genuinely say you understand (much less practice) the mindset, values and motives of the Fathers of Confederation, for example; and that they are the same mindset, values and motives of say the Canadians 50, 100 years later? Has these characteristics ever been universal in nature? Can you argue some combination of all of the above is more valid than others as being Canadian?
Of couse I cannot understand and practise the mindset of the Fathers of Confederation. I'm not arguing for that. If you look at my earlier response to Syn you will see that I'm not talking about rolling back the notion of Canadian identity to any particular socio-historic time or context in the past. That would be ridiculous of course, and hardly representative of Canada today. Rather, I'm talking about the ongoing understanding and appreciation of an evolving Canadian identity that is the 'sum' of our history, the overall trajectory of the underlaying themes and ideas that shape our history and who we are. We are diverse today, for example, but that embracing of diversity was the result of underlaying currents. What are those currents? How are they legitimate hallmarks of being Canadian? This is just one example. Another might be about tolerance? Where did Canadian tolerance come from, and how did it progress in ways different than in other places in the world?
There are many other facettes to identity that we could discuss in a similar fashion in the understanding that there is a commonality of Canadian'ness that we share and that informs who we are, that is still in a process of evolving, and that will continue to inform future notions of what it is to be a Canadian. To me, this understanding is important for both people who live here and people who newly come here, and is far more important than the rote, dismissive Multicultural stance that there is simply 'nothing' worth discussing that is Canadian except being Multicultural.
I didn't say our laws exists a-priori - what I am arguing is that you can't find a universal set of values that define us, without excluding others who rightly claim to be Canadian, and that the most accurate, most inclusive definition of what Canadian means is citizenship and expectations of behaviour consistent with Canadian law.
Those laws have evolved to reflect Canadian society and continue to do so. For instance, in Canada we can unequivically reject an embracing of the principles of Sharia law because they do not reflect Canadian values. We don't say they are bad or wrong, only that they are not 'Canadian', which underscores the fact that you cannot have a discussion about law without talking about the values of the society those laws represent.
That said, if you are a born Canadian or Canadian citizen then of course you have the right to question and dispute what being a Canadian is. This is only right, but it doesn't imply that there is no such notion to start with. This is an ongoing discussion, as it has already been ongoing for hundreds of years, and it is an important discussion. The dismissing of this in favour of Multiculturalism aborts this discussion.
In Canada we have arrived at a place where it is not 'Canadian' to discriminate based on gender/sexuality. Did we arrive at this overnight or did past historic trends and events lead us here? My feeling is that it is the very trajectory of our history/evolution that has brought us to this value, and that it is an appreciation and understanding of this evolution that will help to preserve it. Future Canadians or Canadian citizens may disagree or challenge this, as is their want, and it will be future Canadians that will decide if this is a legitimate value. In the meantime these values stand a better chance if they are embraced by Canadians, and if newcomers are assimilated to them.
If you throw words like "disrespectful" around, I am fairly certain you already have expectations and parameters on what Canadians should be. No?
Actually, come to think of it, one of the most destablizing aspects of the Canadian Confederation isn't multiculturalism - it's provincial politics - and that's actually enshrined in our Constitution.
AoD
You cannot make a claim that Canadians have no value-system or pre-Multicultural identity, or that any such identity is simply unworthy and obsolete, without understanding that such a claim is offensive to many. You would only need to travel outside of the relatively unique context of Toronto to truly understand this.
I've already discussed some of the parameters of what I think being Canadian is, and much to your surprise, I'm sure, it's not about colour of skin or ancestry, ethnic background or religious affiliation etc. That said, being Canadian is of course about excluding, and how could it not be? We are not Jamaican or English or Saudi, or a religion-based nation state, or a totalitarian regime, or any number of other things that may define other countries... and it is not simply our citizenship or passport or lawbook or the coincidence of geographic location that differentiates us. Like it or not Canada is a belief system too, and it is the one that we have created, and that we continue to create through the rule of law and democracy etc. (which in turn is part of our belief system). As a country we should do more to acknowledge this, to celebrate it, and to teach it to those who come here. This is what adds value to that passport or that citizenship. Multiculturalism does none of this. Once again I say, with all due respect, 'Down with Multiculturalism' and long live diversity!!