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How many non-incumbent winners will there be on council?

  • Total voters
    22
  • Poll closed .
Note to Urbantoronto.ca, we need other options than just "like" on comments. We need maybe "unlike", "acknowledge", and others.
 
Bayer said:
Great, but if they really wanted to further limit the use of Section 33, they should have made that explicit. How extremely naive of them to think it would always be invoked appropriately!
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They did make it explicit. Section 33 says a province "may expressly declare ... that the Act or a provision thereof shall operate notwithstanding a provision included in section 2 or sections 7 to 15."

That's singular. A provision. Bill 31 doesn't list a section, but lists 9 sections. Which was never what the framers of the constitution intended - or they'd have used a plural form. One one hand, it seems trivial, but it's well known what the intent was, and the words do bear this out. I'd assume then, that any court would toss out Bill 31's S.33 protection, as it's outside what is required. Courts frequently refer to the intent of the framers of legislation, in absence of other precedent.
 
Miscreant said:
I too am highly skeptical of there being any chance that Ford will lose caucus support anytime soon. For evidence, consider the Republican ingrates who are supporting Trump through his fiasco of a presidency just because he hovers around 90% support in the Republican base.

Since Ford too plays to a quasi-religious base, I'm not sure there's too great of a chance he'll lose hold of caucus anytime soon.
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Let's take that as a given...but then what? How far can Ford possibly travel? Even the wild nationalists in Alberta and Quebec would despise him. If Ford isn't stopped in the next few weeks, the boil he creates will fester so deeply that the host has to expel him to survive.

Conservative Schism? It's not if, but when...
 
nfitz said:
They did make it explicit. Section 33 says a province "may expressly declare ... that the Act or a provision thereof shall operate notwithstanding a provision included in section 2 or sections 7 to 15."

That's singular. A provision. Bill 31 doesn't list a section, but lists 9 sections. Which was never what the framers of the constitution intended - or they'd have used a plural form. One one hand, it seems trivial, but it's well known what the intent was, and the words do bear this out. I'd assume then, that any court would toss out Bill 31's S.33 protection, as it's outside what is required. Courts frequently refer to the intent of the framers of legislation, in absence of other precedent.
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That's an excellent technicality...there must be more. I'm still leaning towards the L-G not granting assent until she has a court ruling ascertaining that it complies with the Constitution.

Because at the end of the day, like it or not, the Crown is sill Sovereign in this nation. And protector of the Constitution.
 
vic said:
For
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sixrings said:
Do you support Premier Doug Ford’s decision to use the notwithstanding clause to push ahead with his plan to downsize city council?” was the poll question on torontosun.com.

As of deadline Tuesday a whopping 13,248 voted.

And 80.4% — or 10,651 voters — said yes. The number of those who voted no was 2,597 which adds up to 19.6%.

THIS IS THE PROBLEM!!!
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Wow, 80.4% derision-worthy tools. The shitty kind that someone forgot to oil a decade ago.

This is how the problem starts. Idiots giving away their rights to fulfill stupid ideological fantasies that may or may not be based in reason. Dirt.
 
Bayer said:
We have a choice between disallowing his coming bill or letting him (and future politicians) wipe himself with the Charter. Unfortunately, Trudeau, who is constantly going on about human rights, is nothing more than "disappointed". So am I.
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Why isn't the Ministry of Foreign Affairs tweeting their disappointment about this?
Shouldn't Chrystia Freeland be outraged and letting the whole world know that this is a no-go?

Trudeau lost all credibility after he lied about electoral reform. Him and Tory conferring yesterday was like putting together two slices of wet toast and hoping to make a sandwich.
 
steveintoronto said:
That's an excellent technicality...there must be more. I'm still leaning towards the L-G not granting assent until she has a court ruling ascertaining that it complies with the Constitution.

Because at the end of the day, like it or not, the Crown is sill Sovereign in this nation. And protector of the Constitution.
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I wish it might go this way, but he's already playing the bullshit "elected" vs "appointed" bollocks and there are people fool enough to go for it. How many people? No idea, but anything more than 5% of the population is a sad commentary on society.

Some people are more interested in having ideological fantasies based in rubbish come true than they are to have their rights and obligations under the constitution upheld!
Messed up, I know. Glue huffers? They can't all be.
 
MTown said:
I wish it might go this way, but he's already playing the bullshit "elected" vs "appointed" bollocks and there are people fool enough to go for it. How many people? No idea, but anything more than 5% of the population is a sad commentary on society.
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Indeed; meanwhile, people consider it perfectly normal that a majority government gets elected by a minority of the people. The judge had it right when he said that the bill was basically a fit of pique.
 
steveintoronto said:
Let's take that as a given...but then what? How far can Ford possibly travel? Even the wild nationalists in Alberta and Quebec would despise him. If Ford isn't stopped in the next few weeks, the boil he creates will fester so deeply that the host has to expel him to survive.

Conservative Schism? It's not if, but when...
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Look, I admire your optimism. I really do. I want to agree with you. But I'm just more pessimistic. His premiership hits me in the gut, and I just got back to Canada after living in the States for 7 years, and that was a wake up call in the realities of political cynicism.

I'm bitterly disappointed to return home to this fiasco. I'm utterly disgusted.
 
Bayer said:
Indeed; meanwhile, people consider it perfectly normal that a majority government gets elected by a minority of the people. The judge had it right when he said that the bill was basically a fit of pique.
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Well, that's part of the absurdity in all of this. Claiming that the government can override constitutional rights and obligations because they are elected, as if minority rule is a democratic form of governance and makes them the arbiters of constitutional rights and obligations.
 
Miscreant said:
Look, I admire your optimism. I really do. I want to agree with you. But I'm just more pessimistic. His premiership hits me in the gut, and I just got back to Canada after living in the States for 7 years, and that was a wake up call in the realities of political cynicism.

I'm bitterly disappointed to return home to this fiasco. I'm utterly disgusted.
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lol...I'm reminded of the adage:
"Have you ever heard of Houlihan's Law?"
"No"
"Well Houlihan thought Murphy was an optimist..."

I'd say the 'schism(s)' is (are) already starting.

Just watching the Slash n' All on CBC. I see a schism between Caroline and Brian. And she's completely misquoting him. It's beyond embarrassing. She's finished at this rate. I initially supported her as having substance. Her 'performance' in the Legislature today was less than amateurish. My God...maybe her CV never was what was claimed to begin with...

Here's pretty much the same footage from City:
https://toronto.citynews.ca/video/2018/09/12/attorney-general-defends-use-of-notwithstanding-clause/

It's painful to watch. Daddy's little girl kind of missed the right genes....She'd be better off hanging out with bikers. At least they'd have more morals. And she might even get some respect there...
 
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