[Mr.Tang]

I feel like there is a risk of splitting the vote on the left currently - but as noted, others may drop out - so we'll see. I also agree that Olivia Chow is not the most dynamic politician so she struggle to grow out of her base. She does have a lot of name recognition which in municipal politics seems really key - but I am not sure it is all good branding in that she is going to be perceived as NDP/Left wing. She has her core group of followers on the left - but how to the John Tory (boring but steady pair of hands) in the centre think of her and can she win them over?

 

[Jonny5]

Olivia Chow is the Hillary Rodham Clinton of Toronto politics. Although she is loved by a small coterie of followers, she is not a great politician. Flat speaker. No discernible vision. Lest we forget, she came in a pretty poor third place in 2014 after Doug Ford, when Fordism was at its lowest point.

I don't think that comparison is accurate.

Clinton was the perfect Senator for New York State and probably could have had that job for life and accumulated significant power (a possible Senate majority leader some day), but she gave that up for what was a true and legitimate chance to move up, and way up. The timing was off, but she still made the most of what came next being Secretary of State for eight years, which is probably the fourth or fifth most powerful political job in the US.

Chow gave up being an City Councilor for life to be a backbench MP nobody in a third ranked party. She really should have gone the provincial route with an eye on the NDP leadership when it opened up. She probably would have it now too.

 

[SJD_Toronto]

Chow gave up being an City Councilor for life to be a backbench MP nobody in a third ranked party. She really should have gone the provincial route with an eye on the NDP leadership when it opened up. She probably would have it now too.

Bingo. I completely agree with this. Olivia Chow should have gone the provincial route. Today, she could be Ontario NDP Leader Olivia Chow instead of Marit Stiles.

 

[adma]

Frankly, if the election boils down to Ontario Place/Ontario Science Centre--if there's an outcry, I wonder about the possibility of Bailao's OSC-move endorsement backfiring on her. Sort of like, she put the lightbulb in DoFo's head, DoFo got out his Trump sharpie and made it happen in an instant, and now "she and her big mouth", etc...

 

[picard102]

I doubt this survives the rest of the week as being a municipal election issue.

 

[adma]

I doubt this survives the rest of the week as being a municipal election issue.

Not even as yet another layer plopped onto the whole Ontario Place/Doug Ford psychodrama?

 

[picard102]

It didn't impact the 2022 Provincial election, where the power actually lays to change it, and it had no impact on the last Municipal election, where the power is non existent.
Most people don't care enough about it to move their votes, the rest are smart enough to know the Mayor has zero power here.

 

[adma]

It didn't impact the 2022 Provincial election, where the power actually lays to change it, and it had no impact on the last Municipal election, where the power is non existent.
Most people don't care enough about it to move their votes, the rest are smart enough to know the Mayor has zero power here.

It wasn't as immediate an issue then, nor were the forces as mobilized then. IOW there's something in the air ***now***, more so than 6 or 12 months ago--the advanced stage of it all, the "gee this cr@p is real" element to it all--that'd make the gravity of all loom as an exploitable electoral cause celebre--not unlike David Miller and the Island Airport in '03 (which *itself* was, on the face of it, an issue most people weren't positioned to care enough about to move their vote--maybe even more so than Ontario Place/OSC now).

 

[lead82]

I agree. The Ontario Place and Science Centre moves are non issues and shouldn’t affect Mayor outcome. In my opinion, the OSC move to Ontario place is Fords justification of keeping the pods and cinesphere. I hope they don’t demolish OSC and instead use it as a community centre for the new development there. Ontario Place development while not ideal is a step in the right direction. The Spa is a wrong attraction but the improvements to the public realm and other investments in the site will make it attractive.

Back to mayors race - I’m not liking any candidates as none have a realistic platform on what’s doable given Ford and the fact city has no money and isn’t being bailed out. All these promises of new spending are hollow. Fix the budget. One suggestion is to raise revenue by hacking up parking rates. Given inflation we could easily double the parking rates across the city, especially downtown. It’s still way too cheap to drive downtown for sporting or entertainment events. Make parking prohibitively expensive to force more transit use.

As for housing, use more city properties like GreenP and TTC stations to build more housing. Offer free land for subsidized housing to be built.

 

[RGB_11]

I agree. The Ontario Place and Science Centre moves are non issues and shouldn’t affect Mayor outcome. In my opinion, the OSC move to Ontario place is Fords justification of keeping the pods and cinesphere. I hope they don’t demolish OSC and instead use it as a community centre for the new development there. Ontario Place development while not ideal is a step in the right direction. The Spa is a wrong attraction but the improvements to the public realm and other investments in the site will make it attractive.

Back to mayors race - I’m not liking any candidates as none have a realistic platform on what’s doable given Ford and the fact city has no money and isn’t being bailed out. All these promises of new spending are hollow. Fix the budget. One suggestion is to raise revenue by hacking up parking rates. Given inflation we could easily double the parking rates across the city, especially downtown. It’s still way too cheap to drive downtown for sporting or entertainment events. Make parking prohibitively expensive to force more transit use.

As for housing, use more city properties like GreenP and TTC stations to build more housing. Offer free land for subsidized housing to be built.

Bring back the $60 sticker fee that Rob Ford got rid of. It was a mistake to do so in the first place. This is why Toronto is in this mess today.
There is room for a $3.50 cash fare on TTC, but I say lower the Presto card fare to $3.00.
We're supposed to be encouraging people NOT to use cash to pay, remember?
Currently, people are going "Big wooop! 5 cents!!" It's only a nickel difference? Really? Why bother buying a presto card?
What happened to the days of saving at least 15 cents per ride? Why not MORE?

 

[adma]

I agree. The Ontario Place and Science Centre moves are non issues and shouldn’t affect Mayor outcome. In my opinion, the OSC move to Ontario place is Fords justification of keeping the pods and cinesphere. I hope they don’t demolish OSC and instead use it as a community centre for the new development there. Ontario Place development while not ideal is a step in the right direction. The Spa is a wrong attraction but the improvements to the public realm and other investments in the site will make it attractive.

Actually, if you want something that *would* be a non-issue in the way you're suggesting, it'd be the Ontario Line in general and the en-route fooferaws over Osgoode Hall and Moss Park and Jimmie Simpson trees and whatnot (or satellite phenomena like the Dominion Foundry demolitions). *That* is more the kind of community-group/vested-interest marginalia without enough heft to sway an election in much the same way that the protests over the 413/Bradford bypass had no impact on the provincial election last year (though one *might* have argued the same about the Island Airport expansion & crossing in '03; but, still)--plus, it's more genuinely "too far advanced"; whereas the specific OP/OSC thing literally materialized *right now*, and what's more with Doug's ham-handed back-of-a-napkin/Trump-sharpie approach poisoning the well in the "oh, cr@p" way that Bailao's initial, seemingly benign and well-intentioned announcement couldn't.

And it's really about the emotional place OP *and* OSC occupy in *masses* of Torontonians, well beyond said community-groups/vested-interests (as borne out in such things as major-media person-on-the-street interviews)--and what's more, about how said "emotional place" is eminently exploitable on the campaign trail.

Meanwhile, if you want to taut the "improvements to the public realm and other investments in the site", you might not be seeing the forest for the, uh, Ontario Place trees here. That is, in the sense of UT being (necessarily, mind you) a forum for those invested in "making such things happen"--which, paradoxically, renders *its* concerns little different from said "community-group/vested-interest marginalia" in the bigger picture. (Sort of like how had UT existed half a century ago, there'd be a matter-of-fact thread on Metro Centre as an ongoing project.)

 

[adma]

And remember that it isn't just about Doug Ford touting the move, it's about his practically stating out loud that the Ontario Science Centre is going to be demolished. (Oh, but for a so-called good cause: "housing". Even though you can't *build* his promised housing upon where most of the OSG facilities stand on environmental grounds.)

If you don't think that's the kind of thing that could be marshalled into an byelection hot potato, well... (and yes, I know Bailao is calling for its retention as "community facilities"; but, still)

 

[Rufus8]

Do you know anything about what you talk about? She’s an immigrant from Hong Kong, long before the 1997 handover. Older waves of Chinese-Canadian immigrants – the ones who built Chinatowns across North America – are generally very wary of PRC influence. This is her neighbourhood and her background. And it made for a great photo backdrop.

Yeah I know what I'm talking about. I know people who came from Hong Kong before the hand over - $300000 in cash and a photo op at the citizenship ceremony. It's called a business exchange. Nice name what's your agenda? Signed a St Mike's baby.

 

[Rufus8]

Chow is a nobody. It's all hype. She can't/won't stand up for Toronto, she will do what is convenient/easy/agreeable. Saunders is a ford tool. The others are unknown to me. I really resent these red herrings, we are in a serious situation - under attack from the feds and province, our population is rising but democratic representation is in free fall. We don't manage our development or economic planning, we have our city cut up as it serves others.

 

[picard102]

It wasn't as immediate an issue then, nor were the forces as mobilized then. IOW there's something in the air ***now***, more so than 6 or 12 months ago--the advanced stage of it all, the "gee this cr@p is real" element to it all--that'd make the gravity of all loom as an exploitable electoral cause celebre--not unlike David Miller and the Island Airport in '03 (which *itself* was, on the face of it, an issue most people weren't positioned to care enough about to move their vote--maybe even more so than Ontario Place/OSC now).

Unlike the Island Airport, the next Mayor will have no power to do anything about the Provinces plans.