[urbandreamer]

Because he quoted himself leaving it out without noticing it having been left out.

Ultimately, it's to grammar what EIFS quoins are to architecture.

Ironically, isn't EIFS precisely what Miller's tower renewal project proposes to use?

 

[nfitz]

(Aside from the fun of guessing which banned user Hairy Yeti is. Dugmor, right?)

Yes, I was wondering that. New users gravitates directly to an anti-Ford post to start making pro-Ford comments and calling people out on things they may or may not have said long before they joined the forum.

Clearly not a new member here.

 

[archanfel]

That has to be one of the biggest pile of tea-party inspired bunk I have ever read on this forum. The commoners vs. the elitists? Give me a break. Elections, like any elections, revolve around themes and ideas. Ford is no more in touch with the common people than any other politician, perhaps more so.

Ford's problem is that he talks in vague concepts. He has no concept of how his real decisions will impact real people. It's not unusual in politics to think that way, but occasionally in politics we do get a politician who understands the old adage that all politics is local.

This is an urban forum. We talk about transportation, architecture, pedestrian traffic, social services. Or as you would call it, elitism. This forum is all about ideas. Don't you dare reduce people who want to clearly understand an issue to being elitists.

And Smitherman's problem is that he lost.

Either the people were deceived, or Ford represents their views. You choose.

Elitism has nothing to do with the subject, it's the belief that you know better, thus you can make decisions for people without consulting them. Did nifitz ask Asian people whether they were offended by the "Oriental" remark? He didn't. I asked him, he said none of his Asian friends were even aware of the comment IIRC. Yet he was sure that it was offensive.

Another thing about elitists is that they usually have grand "visions". There was an article in the newspaper saying that if you told David Miller that your water pressure is low. He would give you a 10 year plan and how green it would be. Ford would come to your home and find out what's wrong. People are tired of "visions", they want results, now.

I am not passing judgement on elitists. I am simply saying elitists lost. This city elected Ford with 47% of the vote. The poll on this forum gave Smitherman a 65% victory. What does that tell you? Maybe you are right, maybe you do know better than the people of Toronto. Maybe adam's view is more valid than the home owners'. Maybe Asians should be offended by the "Oriental" remark. My point was simply that the commoners won over the elitists in this election. They may very well regret their decision in the future, they may realize that we do need a 10 year plan, but that's beside the point. Right or wrong, the people made their choice.

 

[archanfel]

I'd assume that society is more accepting of refugees than immigrants. Immigrants had a choice, they didn't have to come. Refugees had to leave their homeland.

What can I say? You assumed wrong.

As I've pointed out before; I am an immigrant.

So? Ford is a Torontonian. Does that mean he would know what people of Toronto think without doing some research?

I'm not sure why you continue to defend a lying drunken bigot like Rob Ford. Is he paying you off as well?

I am not defending anybody. I am telling you a fact. If you don't believe me, you can go do some consultation and report back. If Ford is so anti-immigrants, why do immigrants support him?

And please don't use this kind of petty attacks. You might as well say Ford paid 47% of the voters to get elected.

 

[nfitz]

And please don't use this kind of petty attacks.

How is stating the fact that Ford is a lying drunken bigot a petty attack? I'm not attacking the man - there is no reason to. I was simply stating fact.

We know his is a liar - he has done so frequently. One example was when he was asked if he'd ever been charged with drunk driving, and he said that he hadn't. Later on he admitted to not only being charged, but also to being convicted.

We know he is a drunk ... the DUI previously mentioned, and the incident where he got tossed out of the ACC a couple of years ago prove that.

And we know his is a bigot, as demonstrated by his anti-gay comments. He has clearly stated that he opposed gay marriage. Anyone who speaks out against gay marriage is a bigot.

I'm not sure why you keep trying to twist this into immigration; I'm not raising that issue, and I'm not raising his habit of making ethnic stereotypes.

 

[adma]

This is a pretty boring conversation. (Aside from the fun of guessing which banned user Hairy Yeti is. Dugmor, right?)

The Parkwoods origin should be a giveaway re the HYPB=Dugmor argument.

 

[adma]

I am not passing judgement on elitists. I am simply saying elitists lost. This city elected Ford with 47% of the vote. The poll on this forum gave Smitherman a 65% victory. What does that tell you? Maybe you are right, maybe you do know better than the people of Toronto. Maybe adam's view is more valid than the home owners'. Maybe Asians should be offended by the "Oriental" remark. My point was simply that the commoners won over the elitists in this election. They may very well regret their decision in the future, they may realize that we do need a 10 year plan, but that's beside the point. Right or wrong, the people made their choice.

And--big freaking deal. Ed Keenan made the same fundamental point in his Eye cover piece. So what's your objection--that it's too sniffy at the unwashed "commoners"? Er, that's a sign of good analytical journalism, not of elitism--he certainly comes across a whole lot more balanced than nfitz barking about "bigots". It's like he makes your same points with more craft--but you feel threatened by the craft...

 

[Tewder]

How is stating the fact that Ford is a lying drunken bigot a petty attack? I'm not attacking the man - there is no reason to. I was simply stating fact.

You are determined to drag the rhetoric into a mud-slinging match, which smacks of the dirty brand of personality politics that gets played south of the border, to the detriment of discussing real issues. This constant debate of who has the moral high ground or who doesn't is pointeless and distracting. I mean, who knows if Ford lies more than Smitherman, or if Smitherman is more corrupt than somebody else, or if Giambrone's personal failings are worse than Ford's or bla, bla, bla... and more to the point, who cares? Grow up. People say and do the wrong thing all the time. We all do. It's okay. Most of us don't mean harm and understand that others don't mean harm either. It is a completely different matter if somebody comes out and blatantly says that no immigrants are welcome, or gay people don't deserve funding for health care issues, or women shouldn't be allowed to hold jobs or positions of authority, or whatever, obviously.

 

[Torontovibe]

You're missing the point. He didn't want to support the AIDS committee because of who it serves.

GAYS! Gay people can pay taxes but their health issues and lives are of no concern to Ford. It tells you what Ford thinks of the gay community.

 

[Torontovibe]

Even if he is anti gay, that's his right. I don't truly think he hates gay people, he just thinks certain ones should be more careful. If people protected themselves during sex or didn't have multiple partners there wouldn't be an epidemic. The same goes for straight people that lead promiscuous lives. If you're monogamous you'll most likely avoid any such troubles.

If Ford just wanted gays to be more careful, wouldn't he support an organization that informs gays how to be more careful and actually saves lives? The whole point of the AIDS committee, is to give the public, especially youth, the knowledge to protect themselves from getting AIDS.

Ford's comment was just saying, hey, it's only gay lives at stake, so who gives a shit. That's not only bigoted but also pretty hateful. Remember, he is the mayor of ALL the people, not only heterosexuals!

Being anti gay may be his right but is that the kind of person we want running Toronto, one of the most gay-friendly cities in the world? (and soon to be hosting World Pride) Being a homophobe is no better than being a misogynist or a racist.

Hate is hate!

 

[Tewder]

Ford's comment was just saying, hey, it's only gay lives at stake, so who gives a shit. That's not only bigoted but also pretty hateful. Remember, he is the mayor of ALL the people, not only heterosexuals!

Hate is hate!

Is that really what he was saying? I mean, you're actually going to claim that Ford hates gay people to the extent that he would willingly see them die. Really?? To my thinking that's a pretty serious accusation and not one that I would entertain lightly... yet you jump to it pretty fast, doing a more than generous amount of extrapolating in doing so.

Ford's perspective, as misinformed or naive as it may be, is that AIDS is preventable, whether you like the prevention or not, and should not be high the list for funding giving many other things that are not. Now I get that you may be completely against this logic, and I would agree with you, but given the context of Ford's platform is the message here that he hates gays and wants them dead or simply a hard-line position on spending? I understand that sensibilities are bruised but lets try and keep a little perspective.

 

[W. K. Lis]

From CFRB:

Ford Campaign Staffers May Have Been Underpaid
Posted By: Newstalk 1010 · 11/8/2010 12:27:00 PM

Election campaigns are known to have long hours, but the mayor-elect's team has seemingly admitted to potentially underpaying staff during the lead-up to this year's municipal election.

Last week, Rob Ford's deputy campaign manager and newly appointed chief off staff Nick Kouvalis admitted during a speech that they paid younger campaign staffers $500 and expected 60-70 hours of work.

Newstalk 1010 crunched the numbers and the long work week means these employees were potentially paid anywhere from $7.14 to $8.33 an hour. That's well under the general minimum wage at $10.25 and even the student minimum wage at $9.60 outlined in the Ontario Employment Standards Act.

It has one Toronto employment lawyer up in arms. Andrew Langille calls the admission by Kouvalis probelmatic and unfortunate.

Langille says there have been increasing cases of people being underpaid as companies and organizations try to deal with the after-effects of the recession.

Calls to Kouvalis were not returned.

 

[Torontovibe]

How do you prevent it without getting the information out to the people who need it? Are you going to tell teens to take a virginity pledge and wear their purity rings? We know how well that is working in the USA. Their teen pregnancy rate is more than double ours. The point is, AIDS can only be stopped if people understand the consequences, and obviously, some people still don't. SO yes, my statement above is how I interpret Fords comments. From what he said, I don't know how you can get any other meaning out of that.

 

[Torontovibe]

From CFRB:

Wait, how can a multi-millionaire pay people below minimum wage? If it isn't one thing, it's another. If this is any indication of the next 4 years, fasten your seat belts, it's gonna be a bumpy ride. lol

 

[Tewder]

So you're actually claiming that Ford hates gays and wants them to die. Wow.