[EtoV]

Braid: After huge meeting, social conservatives completely control Danielle Smith's party

Don Braid: A general meeting that focused almost entirely on social-cultural issues shows social conservatives in complete control of UCP.

calgaryherald.com

 

[kcantor]

^
i thought we put this past us starting with lougheed and confirming it when we had a jewish mayor in one of our largest cities and a muslim mayor in the other and lgbtq2s albertans were starting to be comfortable being themselves in public…

i hope I’m wrong but this sure seems like another big step backwards for all of us including those of us who still consider ourselves “small c” progressive conservatives.

I guess rachelle notley should be pretty happy because she’s probably going to be loaned even more non-ndp votes than she got last time.

 

[Glenco]

^This is inevitable there was always going to be blowback from the status quo The more progress one makes in a short period of time the bigger the reaction. We just can’t let them win.

 

[TravellingChris]

^
I guess rachelle notley should be pretty happy because she’s probably going to be loaned even more non-ndp votes than she got last time.

Did she win?

For all the small-C conservative voters supposedly voting NDP, Notley picked up one seat in Edmonton, her candidates lost to a bunch of subpar UCP MLAs in the ring and she failed to pick up enough seats in Calgary to make up for the fact that the NDP was utterly blown out in rural Alberta. More people voting for her in Edmonton is hardly what she needs.

 

[TravellingChris]

Heard a rumour that the UCP government wants to explore public auto insurance. I think the thought of using the public pension plan to invest in oil and gas got the Premier thinking of other ways to put money into oil and gas, even if it means decimating another industry. Although many of the employees will probably find work in the public entity.

I'm all ears for anything that might put the brakes on rising auto insurance rates.

But ICBC next door lost a pile of money last year. B.C. has had public insurance for decades.

ICBC projected to lose $298 million

This is "another reminder of the cost of [its] monopoly," says bureau

www.insurancebusinessmag.com

Under a private system, insurers take on the costs and risks of doing business in a given province and if they can't make money here, they leave--just like any other business, from Target to Nordstrom to Suzuki. By contrast, a public system has nowhere to retreat and has to rely on the taxpayer for any shortfall.

 

[Kosy123]

^
i thought we put this past us starting with lougheed and confirming it when we had a jewish mayor in one of our largest cities and a muslim mayor in the other and lgbtq2s albertans were starting to be comfortable being themselves in public…

i hope I’m wrong but this sure seems like another big step backwards for all of us including those of us who still consider ourselves “small c” progressive conservatives.

I guess rachelle notley should be pretty happy because she’s probably going to be loaned even more non-ndp votes than she got last time.

Rachel Notley is probably going to resign from leadership early next year from what some rumours have been circling around.

 

[Airboy]

Talked with a devout PCr on the weekend. He didn't go to the UCP convection this year because he felt he didn't belong anymore. I wonder if we are going to see a startup conservative group come along. A new PC party. Hell if I had the energy Id start one.

 

[kcantor]

sooo…

who knew that stephan pastis was now writing his cartoon from Alberta?

 

[TravellingChris]

Talked with a devout PCr on the weekend. He didn't go to the UCP convection this year because he felt he didn't belong anymore. I wonder if we are going to see a startup conservative group come along. A new PC party. Hell if I had the energy Id start one.

Wasn't that what the Alberta Party was supposed to be? A home for former PC supporters who didn't feel aligned with the UCP? It was even led by a former PC cabinet minister for years...and went absolutely nowhere.

 

[Airboy]

Wasn't that what the Alberta Party was supposed to be? A home for former PC supporters who didn't feel aligned with the UCP? It was even led by a former PC cabinet minister for years...and went absolutely nowhere.

it was more or less a group of PC and Liberals. I found that they started ok But Mandel had no energy left and was the wrong person. Need a young energetic person with a strong vision. Yes you can be a Lougheed PC again.

 

[quit]

it was more or less a group of PC and Liberals. I found that they started ok But Mandel had no energy left and was the wrong person. Need a young energetic person with a strong vision. Yes you can be a Lougheed PC again.

Branding matters in politics. It is primarily why the NDP doesn't do as well as they could in Alberta if they had a different name. They can fit wherever they want to on the political spectrum, but to most of the electorate, they are still the NDP, along with all the connotations that come with it. Liberals in Alberta are still attached to senior Trudeau - it is why the Alberta Liberals never took off. In my opinion, the Alberta Liberal Party wastes time and money in Alberta.

Most people I talked to never identified with the Alberta Party and couldn't be bothered to look into it much. The public is ignorant, lazy and largely apathetic regarding politics - most politicians realize that. There is a reason politicians say one thing publicly and do another thing behind closed doors.

Maybe someone will start a party with Progressive and Conservative in the name again and run with it. The PCs of old are why we have strong regulatory bodies in the province for environmental, etc. Those days are behind us with the UCP.

 

[TravellingChris]

Branding matters in politics. It is primarily why the NDP doesn't do as well as they could in Alberta if they had a different name. They can fit wherever they want to on the political spectrum, but to most of the electorate, they are still the NDP, along with all the connotations that come with it. Liberals in Alberta are still attached to senior Trudeau - it is why the Alberta Liberals never took off. In my opinion, the Alberta Liberal Party wastes time and money in Alberta.

Most people I talked to never identified with the Alberta Party and couldn't be bothered to look into it much. The public is ignorant, lazy and largely apathetic regarding politics - most politicians realize that. There is a reason politicians say one thing publicly and do another thing behind closed doors.

Maybe someone will start a party with Progressive and Conservative in the name again and run with it. The PCs of old are why we have strong regulatory bodies in the province for environmental, etc. Those days are behind us with the UCP.

In some ways, I take a similar view of politics as I do of business. Before investing money and opening a restaurant or store or service, I would challenge the potential business owner: What are you going to provide that nobody else in that industry does currently? Will your business be sufficiently different from others in that field that it is crystal clear to the public? And is there a sufficient quantity of potential consumers to support your business alongside competitors which have the advantage of being already established? If the answer to any of those questions is no, then you're probably wasting your (and others') time and resources. We've seen this process countless times, particularly with American companies entering Canada thinking that there is a groundswell of demand for their particular operation, only to discover that existing businesses do the job perfectly well.

Is there a sufficiently large group of voters who are looking for both fiscal conservatism and social justice in the same package? Certainly, there ARE voters out there who want a one-stop shop, but are there enough of them? And if there aren't enough of them in the same place at the same time in order to actually affect the results in a given constituency, let alone fifty-plus, then trying to cater to such a group is an exercise in futility.

Look at the federal scene. Claiming that the Conservative Party had lost its way, Maxime Bernier started the People's Party of Canada. He insisted that there was a large, untapped vein of right-wing voters who were unrepresented and crying out for a new party. (Those of us following along at home correctly recognize that the PPC is merely a vanity project started as a "screw you" by Bernier when he lost the CPC leadership.) Yet over successive elections, the PPC has elected exactly zero Members of Parliament. There was supposedly this big chunk of unrepresented voters, but even in Alberta there aren't enough of them to move the needle even slightly.

And we have seen the same with the Alberta Party provincially. There was supposedly a big mass of voters who felt alienated by the UCP and yet didn't see themselves in the NDP. But again, in successive elections exactly zero Alberta Party MLAs were elected.

So is there really this need for an "alternative"? Or would a revived PC Party just be a vanity project for somebody? Certainly, a whole lot of people like what the UCP has to offer because they keep, you know, winning elections. And those who absolutely, positively want the UCP out have basically coalesced around the NDP as the best vehicle to do that. (This is one of the reasons why Alberta Liberal support has fallen through the floor.)

 

[David A]

Did she win?

For all the small-C conservative voters supposedly voting NDP, Notley picked up one seat in Edmonton, her candidates lost to a bunch of subpar UCP MLAs in the ring and she failed to pick up enough seats in Calgary to make up for the fact that the NDP was utterly blown out in rural Alberta. More people voting for her in Edmonton is hardly what she needs.

Well, there was only one seat in Edmonton that was not NDP already, so it actually wouldn't have been possible to pick up more.

Yes, the rural areas stayed with UCP this time, but the longer term problem for the UCP is the growth in the province is mostly in the major cities and they did not do as well there this time.

I really don't think having a more social conservative and reactionary party will help the UCP in the next election.

 

[Airboy]

In some ways, I take a similar view of politics as I do of business. Before investing money and opening a restaurant or store or service, I would challenge the potential business owner: What are you going to provide that nobody else in that industry does currently? Will your business be sufficiently different from others in that field that it is crystal clear to the public? And is there a sufficient quantity of potential consumers to support your business alongside competitors which have the advantage of being already established? If the answer to any of those questions is no, then you're probably wasting your (and others') time and resources. We've seen this process countless times, particularly with American companies entering Canada thinking that there is a groundswell of demand for their particular operation, only to discover that existing businesses do the job perfectly well.

Is there a sufficiently large group of voters who are looking for both fiscal conservatism and social justice in the same package? Certainly, there ARE voters out there who want a one-stop shop, but are there enough of them? And if there aren't enough of them in the same place at the same time in order to actually affect the results in a given constituency, let alone fifty-plus, then trying to cater to such a group is an exercise in futility.

Look at the federal scene. Claiming that the Conservative Party had lost its way, Maxime Bernier started the People's Party of Canada. He insisted that there was a large, untapped vein of right-wing voters who were unrepresented and crying out for a new party. (Those of us following along at home correctly recognize that the PPC is merely a vanity project started as a "screw you" by Bernier when he lost the CPC leadership.) Yet over successive elections, the PPC has elected exactly zero Members of Parliament. There was supposedly this big chunk of unrepresented voters, but even in Alberta there aren't enough of them to move the needle even slightly.

And we have seen the same with the Alberta Party provincially. There was supposedly a big mass of voters who felt alienated by the UCP and yet didn't see themselves in the NDP. But again, in successive elections exactly zero Alberta Party MLAs were elected.

So is there really this need for an "alternative"? Or would a revived PC Party just be a vanity project for somebody? Certainly, a whole lot of people like what the UCP has to offer because they keep, you know, winning elections. And those who absolutely, positively want the UCP out have basically coalesced around the NDP as the best vehicle to do that. (This is one of the reasons why Alberta Liberal support has fallen through the floor.)

Really it comes down to having the right person to lead a new party. Someone that can relight a fire. Yes there are a lot of people that if they vote check the box with Conservative in it. But there must be a lot of people that cannot stomach the current version of Republican conservatism but will not vote NDP and would vote otherwise if given the right person. .

 

[northlands]

Branding matters in politics. It is primarily why the NDP doesn't do as well as they could in Alberta if they had a different name. They can fit wherever they want to on the political spectrum, but to most of the electorate, they are still the NDP, along with all the connotations that come with it. Liberals in Alberta are still attached to senior Trudeau - it is why the Alberta Liberals never took off. In my opinion, the Alberta Liberal Party wastes time and money in Alberta.

Most people I talked to never identified with the Alberta Party and couldn't be bothered to look into it much. The public is ignorant, lazy and largely apathetic regarding politics - most politicians realize that. There is a reason politicians say one thing publicly and do another thing behind closed doors.

Maybe someone will start a party with Progressive and Conservative in the name again and run with it. The PCs of old are why we have strong regulatory bodies in the province for environmental, etc. Those days are behind us with the UCP.

A main sticking point I heard from a lot of folks with their refusal to vote NDP despite not liking UCP is the ties to the Federal NDP via their own constitution. Being in anyway associated with the federal party and their propping up of Trudeau was like treason in their eyes... regardless of the proof I showed where the ABNDP and Fed NDP butt heads multiple times.