[David A]

$3.50 x 10 = $35
$2.75 x 10 = $27.50 + $6 = $33.50

The breakeven where the arc card is cheaper than paper tickets is fast.

I gather if you buy them individually it is 3.50, but you don't pay $3.50/ea. for the 10 tickets, which perhaps confusingly are also paper.

 

[quit]

I gather if you buy them individually it is 3.50, but you don't pay $3.50/ea. for the 10 tickets, which perhaps confusingly are also paper.

I'm guessing they will be phasing out the old tickets eventually. Has anyone been able to confirm? They still sell them on the ETS online store. The ARC FAQs aren't super helpful in that regard. Are you implying that 10 Arc Tickets will also be $27.75? Doesn't say anything on the website on the ticket page.

 

[Gronk!]

Edmonton transit goes to full-time Arc fares starting Wednesday, decommissions older machines

Tuesday is the last day for the Edmonton Transit Service's old-style cash-only vending machines.

edmonton.ctvnews.ca

 

[Rebourn]

Thought I’d go and get my first ever arc card at one of the new stations which are now all open…..but NYET!!

 

[Gronk!]

ETS revenue from Arc fares reaches 63%

As the Edmonton Transit Service decommissions older fare machines, the adoption rate of its new smart-fare system is nearing two-thirds of riders, exceeding expectations.

edmonton.taproot.news

Arc will eventually phase out the plastic cards, which cost $6, for a more convenient payment method. Hotton-MacDonald said part of the reason for the card fee is to discourage users from throwing them away and thereby generating waste.

“Once all of the user groups have transitioned, we’ll be looking at how we consider using the open-payment method, which is really exciting,” she said. “That would be using credit or debit cards, potentially, or smartphones, depending on the design.”

Calgary Transit debuted its smartphone-payment system in June 2020, partly as a way to reduce physical contact in response to the COVID-19 pandemic. Hotton-MacDonald said ETS’s system was in development before the pandemic began and is complicated by the need to ensure its compatibility with regional operators.

“It was always intended to be a regional solution … Having that regional fare capping — we’re the first in Canada to offer it — is a really key feature of regional Arc implementation,” she said. “One of the positive aspects of making sure we’re giving everybody the time to adjust and adapt to the change is that we’re preparing them properly and providing the amount of support they need to change their behaviours.”

Looking further ahead, Hotton-MacDonald said ETS will explore whether new kinds of fares are needed.

“We’re also considering whether there are other offerings related to Arc that people are looking for, in terms of the types of fare media and how people are travelling,” she said. “Do we need a multi-day Arc pass, as an example?”

 

[SarcasticMarmot]

“We’re also considering whether there are other offerings related to Arc that people are looking for, in terms of the types of fare media and how people are travelling,”

They really need to look into pay for distance. Short trips for irregular users are discouraged under the current fare structure.

For example, my wife and I live by stadium station. It would make a ton of sense for us to take the train 1-2 stops downtown for an event. But that ends up costing $14 between the two of us. Much cheaper to drive in and park. When we lived in Asia a decade ago fares were done by distance. One train stop: 50 cents, two stops: 75 cents, etc until the cap. That would open up a whole new market of use for the trains and is completely doable with the ARC system.

 

[dkazzed]

Maybe a multi-use Arc ticket to replace the 10 ticket pack for those who are adamant on buying things retail and not being tracked. The ticket validators need to go.

Without fare gates, I don't know if paper monthly passes need to go. The advantage of moving away from it in favour of Arc is that it makes it easy for police and security to observe who's tapping in.

 

[dkazzed]

They really need to look into pay for distance. Short trips for irregular users are discouraged under the current fare structure.

For example, my wife and I live by stadium station. It would make a ton of sense for us to take the train 1-2 stops downtown for an event. But that ends up costing $14 between the two of us. Much cheaper to drive in and park. When we lived in Asia a decade ago fares were done by distance. One train stop: 50 cents, two stops: 75 cents, etc until the cap. That would open up a whole new market of use for the trains and is completely doable with the ARC system.

Vancouver promised distanced-based fares when it was released in 2015 but hasn't delivered yet. Edmonton hasn't promised anything at all.

Remember the days of the fare free downtown zone?

 

[thommyjo]

They really need to look into pay for distance. Short trips for irregular users are discouraged under the current fare structure.

For example, my wife and I live by stadium station. It would make a ton of sense for us to take the train 1-2 stops downtown for an event. But that ends up costing $14 between the two of us. Much cheaper to drive in and park. When we lived in Asia a decade ago fares were done by distance. One train stop: 50 cents, two stops: 75 cents, etc until the cap. That would open up a whole new market of use for the trains and is completely doable with the ARC system.

Agreed. When the new west line opens, I’ll have grocery stores 1 stop away. Hopping on the train vs a 17 min walk would be nice. But the cost being equal to Lewis farms to downtown is frustrating.

Could also work well as a solution for “downtown free zone” concerns about loitering and such. Still have to pay. But 1 dollar to get to brewery district from central business district makes a lot more sense than $3.50-7 potentially.

 

[SarcasticMarmot]

Vancouver promised distanced-based fares when it was released in 2015 but hasn't delivered yet. Edmonton hasn't promised anything at all.

Remember the days of the fare free downtown zone?

Which is so frustrating, its not exactly a novel system that hasn't been used around the world for decades!

I'm not such a fan of a downtown zone, people still need to get downtown before it helps. And if you live nearish downtown the cost/benefit for irregular users just isn't there.

Both cases are the result of a system designed by office commuters that only makes sense for office commuters. Not a transit system designed for people to use as an alternative to driving.

 

[occidentalcapital]

If you take a lot of short trips I think ARC is actually a big improvement because of the fare capping over the month.

 

[dkazzed]

Just using it as an example that City of Edmonton at one point was willing to sacrifice a bit of fare revenue to increase ridership in the system, albeit a limited part of it. With distance-based fares, they wouldn't sacrifice it completely and may attract new ridership. Busier transit vehicles in turn leads to safer transit, which will attract more people to transit who were on the fence due to safety.

 

[soupcrate]

They really need to look into pay for distance. Short trips for irregular users are discouraged under the current fare structure.

For example, my wife and I live by stadium station. It would make a ton of sense for us to take the train 1-2 stops downtown for an event. But that ends up costing $14 between the two of us. Much cheaper to drive in and park. When we lived in Asia a decade ago fares were done by distance. One train stop: 50 cents, two stops: 75 cents, etc until the cap. That would open up a whole new market of use for the trains and is completely doable with the ARC system.

$2.75 x 2 trips x 2 people = $11.
Still a fair point, but the last thing ETS needs is less revenue.

 

[erudyk_29]

When it comes to pay for distance, without fare gates on the LRT, you're essentially working on the honors system. (Which the LRT basically runs on anyways most of the time since there's usually nothing and no one stopping you from just getting on the train). If a pay for distance system was implemented, I would like to see a system similar to the Bangkok MRT where it gives you a reusable/rechargeable token for the stop you are supposed to end up getting off at. You tap to get on and then return the token into a slot to get off. This would reduce waste from having to print a new card or ticket every time you get on the train.

 

[David A]

They really need to look into pay for distance. Short trips for irregular users are discouraged under the current fare structure.

For example, my wife and I live by stadium station. It would make a ton of sense for us to take the train 1-2 stops downtown for an event. But that ends up costing $14 between the two of us. Much cheaper to drive in and park. When we lived in Asia a decade ago fares were done by distance. One train stop: 50 cents, two stops: 75 cents, etc until the cap. That would open up a whole new market of use for the trains and is completely doable with the ARC system.

Interesting idea. Sadly, our transit bureaucracy seems remarkable resistant to user ideas. They want to make it more difficult and costly for us to use it and then they wonder why more people don't.