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Richard White

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Yorkville is more high end now than ever. Yorkdale attracted new names/brands.

As someone who walks through Yorkville almost daily and has frequented it for decades it is not as high end as ever.

I remember the days where at the mere mention of the name Yorkville you expected to drop at least $500. Now I can walk into Roots and buy a $75 shirt just like I could at the STC or Eaton Centre.

I recall years ago when Roots, H&M and Winners didn't exist there. Back then I shopped at Holts and Tiffanys.

The area has changed and in my honest opinion it has become alot cheaper since 2009.
 

zang

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Yorkville is more high end now than ever. Yorkdale attracted new names/brands.
And Yorkville has had numerous long-term vacancies, many even pre-pandemic. Some have lasted years.

The former University Theatre at 100 Bloor Street West has been vacant for what, about 7 years now?

Retailers aren't rushing to be there, and I can't imagine that landlords are somehow pricing luxury brand retailers out of the market.
 

Richard White

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Retailers aren't rushing to be there, and I can't imagine that landlords are somehow pricing luxury brand retailers out of the market.

Actually this happened to Remenyi House of Music at Bloor and Avenue.

They couldn't afford the increasing costs in Yorkville and decided to move elsewhere.

They had been there for decades and wanted to stay but the costs were insane from what I remember reading.

They owned the building and sold to a condo developer.

Part of it was bike lanes but the other part was the changing demographics of the area.
 

vatche

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I agree that it has more mixed brands both high end and lower end. However, also don’t forget yorkville ave has attracted some new brands. Not to forget caudalie, Webster etc. Chanel, Gucci, Prada, Cartier are bigger. Rolex is expanding. Kiton Dior Versace Brunello louboutin did not even have presence. Holts has gone high end as well. But yes yorkdale has stolen yorkville’s thunder. let’s see how it plays out.
 

zang

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I agree that it has more mixed brands both high end and lower end. However, also don’t forget yorkville ave has attracted some new brands. Not to forget caudalie, Webster etc. Chanel, Gucci, Prada, Cartier are bigger. Rolex is expanding. Kiton Dior Versace Brunello louboutin did not even have presence. Holts has gone high end as well. But yes yorkdale has stolen yorkville’s thunder. let’s see how it plays out.

Brands that were once elite have moved downmarket over the years. Aspirational luxury brands have moved to entry-level accessible luxury. I'm pretty sure that's what you're interpreting as moving upscale.

I mean, if it's a brand name you can find on a product for sale at Nordstrom Rack, it's fair to say it's no longer the crème-de-la-crème of luxury.
 

gabe

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Yorkdale has taken the biggest bite out of Bloor- Yorkville. Alexander McQueen skipped Bloor-Yorkville for Yorkdale, for it's first Canadian store. Hugo Boss moved it's Canadian flagship to Yorkdale a few years ago.Valentino also has it's flagshship at Yorkdale.

I remember when Yorkville was the only place to go for high-end goods. Sherway, Yorkdale, Eaton Centre, Square One, were all mid level retail. Now you don't have to travel far to buy high-end goods.
 

vatche

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Totally. Certain brands might have 2 stores in the city, just like they do in nyc or LA. yorkville Should’ve kept an eye on yorkdale and done something to stop it. But they didn’t. They’re not competing in any way with them. Parking and accessibility is a major factor. Also don’t forget there s a lot of money in the suburbs. But as more condos go up I think therenwill be more demand and they will look for presence in yorkville. I’m surprised this did not happen in Chicago. Michigan ave is still the premier shopping destination along with oak street.
 

vatche

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Brands that were once elite have moved downmarket over the years. Aspirational luxury brands have moved to entry-level accessible luxury. I'm pretty sure that's what you're interpreting as moving upscale.

I mean, if it's a brand name you can find on a product for sale at Nordstrom Rack, it's fair to say it's no longer the crème-de-la-crème of luxury.
You don’t see Chanel Hermès Dior Brunello LV kiton at nordstrom rack do you?
 

pw20

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Some of this is a LITTLE bit revisionist history.

A lot of the brands that closed recently have been very mid-market: Pottery Barn, Williams-Sonoma, Gap, HBC, J. Crew, even Banana and Brooks Brother's aren't exactly luxury. I mean - Winner's replaced Chapters; it's not like Winner's replaced Barney's.

For most of the past 40+ years, the primary mono luxury brands on Bloor were Channel, Hermes, and LV. Tiffany and Co was the first new mono brand to open in then 90s and since then it's been a drip of openings. After the failure of Bretton's, Creed's in the late 80's and early 90's, there was ALWAYS a lot of mid-market on Bloor and in Yorkville (think Nike, Benetton, Browns); if anything, Toronto didn't have much of a luxury retail strip especially when compared to similar, or even smaller, American cities.

Over the past 20 years we've seen way more global luxury brands open in Bloor / Yorkville, and we've also seen a similar number opt to open in Yorkdale, which as mentioned above has stolen a lot of Bloor+ Yorkville's thunder. We've also seen the rise of Yorkville Ave, which has 7 large luxury mono-brands, which was NOT a luxury hot-spot even 5 years ago.

To be clear, the pandemic was bad for Bloor and unlike Yorkdale, Bloor doesn't have a single landlord to market retail spaces too, but the demise of Bloor is a bit of a stretch, in my opinion.
 

zang

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You don’t see Chanel Hermès Dior Brunello LV kiton at nordstrom rack do you?
Not all of them (they sell Dior branded sunglasses), but they aren't the only brands you mentioned. Versace, Gucci, Prada are all over NR. But I suspect you checked anyway.

EDIT: It should be pointed out that Hermes, Vuitton and Kiton stuff can be found at Saks Off 5th.
 
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JasonParis

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In some ways, the Toronto Eaton Centre sucks in a lot of of the street-front retail from lining the likes of Queen and Yonge. And Yorkdale increasingly does the same thing for Bloor-Yorkville, despite the fairly vast distance. I'm not saying our shopping streets are doomed, just that they have some unique challenges, even beyond the pandemic.
 

Northern Light

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In some ways, the Toronto Eaton Centre sucks in a lot of of the street-front retail from lining the likes of Queen and Yonge.

Yes

And Yorkdale increasingly does the same thing for Bloor-Yorkville, despite the fairly vast distance. I'm not saying our shopping streets are doomed, just that they have some unique challenges, even beyond the pandemic.

Not really convinced of this........

Yes, Yorkdale draws away some customer base.....for those stores are that relatively exclusive, where Yorkdale has one, and/or the only..........

But I don't think it's a material marketshare of Bloor as a whole.

****

That said, worth noting Yorkdale is one of the most successful shopping mall in all of North America on a per ft2 basis.

(from 2019)

Source: https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/most-profitale-malls-canada-january-2019

1650940736672.png



Comparing that w/ U.S. numbers from 2018, I would see it ~ #3 in North America.

So it is rather formidable.
 

Richard White

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Yes



Not really convinced of this........

Yes, Yorkdale draws away some customer base.....for those stores are that relatively exclusive, where Yorkdale has one, and/or the only..........

But I don't think it's a material marketshare of Bloor as a whole.

****

That said, worth noting Yorkdale is one of the most successful shopping mall in all of North America on a per ft2 basis.

(from 2019)

Source: https://dailyhive.com/vancouver/most-profitale-malls-canada-january-2019

View attachment 395831


Comparing that w/ U.S. numbers from 2018, I would see it ~ #3 in North America.

So it is rather formidable.

I find Yorkdale does more of the boutique stores whereas Yorkville does balls to the wall luxury. If I want high end, I skip Yorkville now and go right to Yorkdale. I have better selection.
 

Bayer

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Not all of them (they sell Dior branded sunglasses), but they aren't the only brands you mentioned. Versace, Gucci, Prada are all over NR. But I suspect you checked anyway.

EDIT: It should be pointed out that Hermes, Vuitton and Kiton stuff can be found at Saks Off 5th.
I even bought Versace and Zegna shirts at Winners of all places. They had a bunch of Prada shoes one time.
 

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