[drum118]

Annoying that some of the routes will go from 30 to 35 minute service at certain times, though I suspect that's a problem of keeping to schedule and not true cut in service. The good news is that the city budget, once approved, will allow for major service improvements this year -- provided they have enough drivers trained and ready, of course.

Until the budget is approved and the drivers are ready, I suspect BT will continue to make changes like this -- address the crowding first -- before it makes proactive service improvements and expansions.

Some cut in service or lack of it may have to do with lack of drivers and buses. At the same time, traffic has an impact on scheduling that it could require another bus being added to the route while reducing the cost ratio and having less riders on buses for an already low ridership route. You can only throw out so many buses for routes cause by traffic that its not worth it in the end to do so.

Brampton has gone from what bus system to running circles around Mississauga and York Region.

It would be nice to know what the model split is today compare to 10 years ago as well in 2019.

A great number of systems in NA still haven't recovery 75% of 2019 numbers and some of that has to due to lack of drivers and staff.

Once Brampton gets a few true BRT routes, ridership will climb more

 

[stevensontransit]

Good news for both Airport and Torbram buses. At a 8 min AM frequency, they stand alongside Kennedy, Steeles, and Chinguacousy as among the most frequent local corridors in the city, even if its only at that time. Also great to see 58 Financial make a return after so long. This is nowhere near fixing close to half the issues of the current state that BT is in right now. For example, who still thinks its a good idea to not run 501A/C buses at least mid day to fill in the gaps, and to still run 501 on Sundays at a… *30 min frequency* on the entire route.

Rode the 501 Zum on Sundays and it was very busy.

 

[drum118]

As a note on lack of drivers and buses, the US currently is 21% short of drivers to the point various routes are canceled, headway increase, no service on the weekend or after X hour at night

I expect various systems in the GTA are lacking drivers to maintain service that was in place back in 2019 or to put new service on the road.

Been a year since I last rode BT.

 

[ShonTron]

Here's Brampton Transit's presentation to City Council today:

https://pub-brampton.escribemeetings.com/filestream.ashx?DocumentId=75728

Projecting 35,600,000 riders in 2023, a 12% increase from 2019. (2022 had 99% of 2019's ridership), going up to 43,178,000 in 2027. This year will see an 8% increase in operating hours over 2019, with routes 1, 4, 5, 18, and 30 seeing the biggest growth. The next Züm corridors are set for Chinguacousy Road and Bramalea Road, with a potential extension of the 505 east to Highway 50, with the Airport Road Züm becoming a stand-alone service.

They're also planning the third garage, on Highway 50, as well as overnight services, on-demand services, and more service into Caledon.

Some highlighted slides:

 

[anb]

Glad to see that Bovaird and Airport might have separate Zum routes. 505 isn't the worst when its combined, but if there's a delay on one of the roads it obviously affects the other corridor and it happens a lot more often than not. The Castlemore/Hwy 50 routing is a really interesting proposal, hopefully it goes all the way down to Queen or even Steeles and maybe loop around Signal Hill so it can connect with the Steeles West TTC buses.

 

[tylerbell]

Once the HuLRT is complete, I assume the 2/502 will stop going to square one, and stop at Steeles? I'd also assume these extra Zum busses would be used for Ching and Bramalea Zum services.

Would've been nice to see Dixie Zum and extension of the 502 up to Mayfield, but still good to see more Zum overall.

 

[ShonTron]

Once the HuLRT is complete, I assume the 2/502 will stop going to square one, and stop at Steeles? I'd also assume these extra Zum busses would be used for Ching and Bramalea Zum services.

Would've been nice to see Dixie Zum and extension of the 502 up to Mayfield, but still good to see more Zum overall.

I’d like to see the extension of the 502 northward as well, especially if Brampton Transit plans more service penetration into Caledon. The only problem is there isn’t a good loop in the Snelgrove area; the MTO hasn’t yet built the carpool lot and bus loop at the 410/10/Hurontario interchange.

 

[drum118]

Once the HuLRT is complete, I assume the 2/502 will stop going to square one, and stop at Steeles? I'd also assume these extra Zum busses would be used for Ching and Bramalea Zum services.

Would've been nice to see Dixie Zum and extension of the 502 up to Mayfield, but still good to see more Zum overall.

That is an unknown item at this time just like MT, but I would expect both routes will stop at Steeles. Since 502 only services major stops in Mississauga that will be match by the LRT, I see no need to run the 502 in Mississauga. I do agree running 502 north as call for.

MT on the other hand has too many stops that are too far apart for the LRT that a bus is needed to service some of those stops, but will see longer headway for that bus. From my point of view, it needs to stay 100% on Hurontario to bypass CCTT do to the 15 minute travel time to enter and leave the station. If you have riders living in the plan developments for over 20,000 residents at Eglinton and should use transit to Cooksville GO Station, this extra 15 minute travel time will keep people in the car. More so if the loop is built, but more so if the line get split like the 19 did with a longer travel time.

For Brampton, road planning was thought a lot better than Mississauga as there is a grid system that benefit transit. Mississauga is made up of many towns that lack real grid work for transit.

 

[anb]

It's pretty certain that the MiWay 2 and 17 routes (formely 19) will still be in service when the LRT is done. It was only said for obvious reasons to just replace the 103 and 502 Zum buses that run between Steeles and CCTT/Port Credit. Since the spacing will have some stations skipped and won't be 1:1 with the current express bus stops, thus making some stations farther apart from each other, this is most likely where the local buses will come in to fill these gaps.

I doubt that they would still run the 103 if its pretty much the same route as the LRT. They could already be planning to use those extra resources to likely create another express bus route on another corridor such as Mavis, Burnamthorpe, or additional service on any of the current express routes.

 

[drum118]

It's pretty certain that the MiWay 2 and 17 routes (formely 19) will still be in service when the LRT is done. It was only said for obvious reasons to just replace the 103 and 502 Zum buses that run between Steeles and CCTT/Port Credit. Since the spacing will have some stations skipped and won't be 1:1 with the current express bus stops, thus making some stations farther apart from each other, this is most likely where the local buses will come in to fill these gaps.

I doubt that they would still run the 103 if its pretty much the same route as the LRT. They could already be planning to use those extra resources to likely create another express bus route on another corridor such as Mavis, Burnamthorpe, or additional service on any of the current express routes.

At this time there is no plan in place as to what may take place on Hurontario, but from my point of view, it will not be an 103 running on it. The 103 doesn't go to PC anymore and only to the Queensway with that section having low ridership for an 103 in the first place. Its strange the can cut back on the 103 that had more ridership than the 110 has every had from day one to Clarkson, but refused to cut the 110 service at UTM like it should been when first proposed.

If you want riders to get out of the car and use GO, the current setup nor the LRT is going to do it for those who live north of the 403 with the lost of 10-15 extra travel time going to CCTT first and will be longer if and when the loop gets built.

The 502 is currently an Light BRT other than not running in an ROW and is a few minutes slower than the LRT at about 5 minute due to traffic and traffic lights. It make sense the cut the 502 at Steeles as that is where the LRT ends in the first place for the next decade or two.

The current vehicles on Hurontario for both systems will be allocated to routes to the point they become expansions buses to beef up routes that need better service in the first place while not ordering extra buses for expansion. The same is plan for TTC Line 5 & 6 as well.

 

[ShonTron]

Fares are going up big time.

A regular Presto ride will go up by 30 cents, from $3.10 to $3.40. The adult cash fare will go from $4.00 to $4.50.

Ouch. Meanwhile seniors living in Brampton ride for free.

https://pub-brampton.escribemeetings.com/filestream.ashx?DocumentId=76540

 

[Northern Light]

Fares are going up big time.

A regular Presto ride will go up by 30 cents, from $3.10 to $3.40. The adult cash fare will go from $4.00 to $4.50.

Ouch. Meanwhile seniors living in Brampton ride for free.

https://pub-brampton.escribemeetings.com/filestream.ashx?DocumentId=76540

An extreme example for why I don't favour most 'concessions' in fare systems.

I do get the arguments around famlies with young kids and expensive travel; and I might humour that; but overall, the problem with concession fares is that they drive up administrative costs, they reduce effective fare compliance/enforcement and they drive up the fare for everyone not covered by a concession, creating more people who need the concession.

One fare for everyone 13+ allows for a much lower adult fare and fare-capping.

Why we are still allowing 'cash' fares in terms of paper money and coins is beyond me; but I would then add, I see no reason we should penalize anyone using open payment with a higher fare, as the take from Interac and VISA are both lower than Presto's.

 

[smallspy]

but I would then add, I see no reason we should penalize anyone using open payment with a higher fare, as the take from Interac and VISA are both lower than Presto's.

So, thinking about this......

While nominally, yes, that is true that Interac/VISA/MC are cheaper than Presto. However, with Presto doing the processing........is that still the case that they are cheaper?

Dan

 

[Northern Light]

So, thinking about this......

While nominally, yes, that is true that Interac/VISA/MC are cheaper than Presto. However, with Presto doing the processing........is that still the case that they are cheaper?

Dan

Fair question, to which I do not have the answer.

 

[Tristen]

Brampton Transit Feb 2023 ridership is out.