[Northern Light]

Any estimation of what percent or length of the 25-27 cycle plan does not require a lane removed for traffic.

This is the to-do list:

https://www.toronto.ca/wp-content/uploads/2024/07/96eb-2025-2027-Cycling-Program-Table.pdf

You can see the classifications (ie. New/Upgrade, Bikeway/Multi-use Trail, Neighbourhood route.

That gives you some starting math.

Several projects are already approved (the implementing by-laws are passed, and there is no reason to believe, at this time, that these will be affected.)

ie. Scarborough Golf Club Road, or items under 'Eglinton Connects, in the central section.

I am going to assume any that will require a lane of traffic removed will not be built.

I would not draw this conclusion.

Even if the law is passed, I would expect those changes which Toronto has already approved will likely move forward; I think most stuff under the 'Neighbourhoods Plan' designation will likely be safe as well, as its mostly on minor streets.

A quick glance shows several pending projects that would introduce a cycle track for the first time, for which the enabling by-laws are not yet passed.

ie. Danforth east of VP, Dupont and Wellington would be on the vulnerable list.

 

[PL1]

When youre booing the fire chief because you dont like the facts he is giving you...

Was the fire chief relaying that jammed streets delay responses? I don't see why TFS can't introduce smaller fire vehicles. (Yes, I know there are crewing issues, more vehicles types to train on, etc. But theoretically, smaller fire vehicles would be easier to use in the city)

 

[afransen]

It is worth considering that this legislation is merely signalling that won't pass before an election, will serve its purpose to motivate the base, and won't be reintroduced after the election?

 

[generalcanada]

Was the fire chief relaying that jammed streets delay responses? I don't see why TFS can't introduce smaller fire vehicles. (Yes, I know there are crewing issues, more vehicles types to train on, etc. But theoretically, smaller fire vehicles would be easier to use in the city)

The fire chief literally said straight up response times have improved since before installation.
To quote despicable people "facts dont care about your feelings" LOL

 

[TheGrimSweeper]

Was the fire chief relaying that jammed streets delay responses? I don't see why TFS can't introduce smaller fire vehicles. (Yes, I know there are crewing issues, more vehicles types to train on, etc. But theoretically, smaller fire vehicles would be easier to use in the city)

The opposite. Fire chief was saying response times actually improved.

It was the anti bike lane ppl then booing the fire cheif.

In short all the real world data showed no or negligible impacts, but those anti bike lane ppl I feel are like the Trump cult. Facts don't matter.

 

[PL1]

The fire chief literally said straight up response times have improved since before installation.

The opposite. Fire chief was saying response times actually improved.

It was the anti bike lane ppl then booing the fire cheif.

Thank you both! That's a surprising side benefit of the lanes, I guess.

 

[Northern Light]

Thank you both! That's a surprising side benefit of the lanes, I guess.

More complex than that.

Response times are impacted by number of calls (if your nearest fire hall is already out on a call, the response goes to the next closest facility, which is further away, increasing response time).

They are also impacted when those calls occur (traffic overnight is generally a non-issue)

They are also impacted by staffing levels (is all equipment staffed/in service).

etc etc.

 

[crs1026]

I have to concede that the statistics the Deputy Fire Chief was using were largely aggregates - likely across Ward 3, or perhaps even some broader area. This is consistent with the way TFS reports to City Council.

What critics were pointing to is the restricted movement of emergency vehicles along Bloor between Old Mill and Montgomery Road, which any observer will note is especially painful, especially where the center-of-road planters box in vehicles generally. Anyone who uses Bloor will see fire trucks having difficulty getting through that zone.

The Chief's point was that when a fire response is measured as the amalgam of units responding from several stations (eg 445 on Burnhamthorpe, 433 on Royal York, 422 and 425 from east of the Humber) - the delay to one or two units (especially 431 on Prince Edward) is not material.

All the same, the Chief was pretty convincing that TFS watches its response times and events pretty carefully, and if the problem were causing them concern, they would be the first to speak up. I haven't seen fire trucks taking the back roads around Bloor, but this is a pretty obvious solution if the problem was unmanageable. That much local infiltration, I would be happy to see.

The room simply wasn't interesting in hearing facts.... another very rational explanation provided by City staff was that vehicle throughput is influenced more by how intersections are managed than by how many lanes there are. That was met with silence.

- Paul

 

[TheGrimSweeper]

That to do list is pretty long. Hard to see most of that getting blocked.

One thing the city could do is if it becomes to challenging for anything new, just improve what already exists.

So many bike lanes are just painted lines on the street. Make them properly separated with barriers.

 

[turbanplanner]

I must imagine that in the eyes of the current crowd running this plan, a lane that is parking 22 hours/day but live traffic at rush hour counts as a traffic lane and not a parking lane.

Which lanes in the city only ban parking for 1 hour a day? (per peak period)

 

[evandyk]

Which lanes in the city only ban parking for 1 hour a day? (per peak period)

Most rush hour restrictions only take effect for two hours a day. I don't think I've ever seen one that is only one hour. Are there lanes that restrict parking during both rush hours? I'm not a close observer of this as I don't drive at rush hour, either into or out of downtown.

 

[afransen]

The room simply wasn't interesting in hearing facts.... another very rational explanation provided by City staff was that vehicle throughput is influenced more by how intersections are managed than by how many lanes there are. That was met with silence.

I feel like every public consultation should start with a 5-10 minute YouTube video explainer of why it is the intersections that determine throughput, not number of lanes between intersections.

 

[J Bacon]

For Parkside Drive, I would do two things. One, I would push this wall further into the park to widen the sidewalk and install a separate bidirectional bike lane between the sidewalk and wall.

That's the way it should be done, properly.
Not removing travel lanes on the road because it was the cheapest way possible. ie) paint.

 

[TheGrimSweeper]

That's the way it should be done, properly.
Not removing travel lanes on the road because it was the cheapest way possible. ie) paint.

Have you actually looked at this though? It would involve the removal of likely lots of mature trees, possibly relocating power lines / utility polls. From a cost perspective it would go way up.

Look at this view: https://maps.app.goo.gl/i1XUFko64bngxEqN8

 

[J Bacon]

Have you actually looked at this though? It would involve the removal of likely lots of mature trees, possibly relocating power lines / utility polls. From a cost perspective it would go way up.

Look at this view: https://maps.app.goo.gl/i1XUFko64bngxEqN8

From that view it looks like you could move the wall back up to 5 feet and not impact the very mature trees.

Doing things properly involves spending money.