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JSF-1 said:
so any extension of the Sheppard Line must terminate at STC.
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Must is a strong word. I don't think you laid out an argument strong enough to justify the word must. I'm sure those on Sheppard would feel that they too deserve a subway. Just like I'm guessing when this is all done finch will feel the same way.
 
JSF-1 said:
I don't see any benefit to terminating the Sheppard line at Sheppard and McCowan. STC is the main hub for Scarborough for both transit and business so any extension of the Sheppard Line must terminate at STC.
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Line 2 and 4 are both subways, so there could be an arrangement to have a turn at McCowan/Sheppard so that both line 2 and 4 stop at STC, or have some sort of through running every X trains.

Of course, this would require the foresight of Metrolinx planners to build the station in a location where the future Line 4 trains could actually make the turn around the intersection, and I don't think they have that.
 
mdu said:
Line 2 and 4 are both subways, so there could be an arrangement to have a turn at McCowan/Sheppard so that both line 2 and 4 stop at STC, or have some sort of through running every X trains.

Of course, this would require the foresight of Metrolinx planners to build the station in a location where the future Line 4 trains could actually make the turn around the intersection, and I don't think they have that.
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IMO, if Line 4 needs to connect with STC, then have the line turn south at McCowan and terminate at STC while interlining with Line 2. So you can travel on Line 2 all the way to Sheppard/McCowan and you can travel on Line 4 to STC. Whether or not Line 4 at Sheppard/McCowan has two branches, one that stops and terminates and another that doesn't stop and continues to STC, is up for debate. This way riders can transfer between Line 2 and Line 4 at two locations.
 
JSF-1 said:
I don't see any benefit to terminating the Sheppard line at Sheppard and McCowan. STC is the main hub for Scarborough for both transit and business so any extension of the Sheppard Line must terminate at STC.
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The hub for local transit is moving to Sheppard/McCowan. They already said there isn't a lot of development opportunities at STC so I don't see why they can shift the hub north. It's like MiWay is moving to Kipling while the business centre is still at Islington.

Leo_Chan said:
IMO, if Line 4 needs to connect with STC, then have the line turn south at McCowan and terminate at STC while interlining with Line 2. So you can travel on Line 2 all the way to Sheppard/McCowan and you can travel on Line 4 to STC. Whether or not Line 4 at Sheppard/McCowan has two branches, one that stops and terminates and another that doesn't stop and continues to STC, is up for debate. This way riders can transfer between Line 2 and Line 4 at two locations.
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That's not going to happen. Sheppard runs too infrequently to have 2 branches. To make the interlining proposal more cost effective, it'll make more sense to run shorter 4 car trains from Sheppard-Yonge to McCowan and utilize the entire Scarborough subway extension solely for Line 4 and terminating at Kennedy. In peak hours, maybe extend Line 2 to McCowan otherwise terminate at Kennedy.
 
Steve X said:
The hub for local transit is moving to Sheppard/McCowan. They already said there isn't a lot of development opportunities at STC so I don't see why they can shift the hub north. It's like MiWay is moving to Kipling while the business centre is still at Islington.
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Let's be realistic here, any development at McCowan and Sheppard is going to be minimal. STC is the primary destination in Scarborough and that's not going to change anytime soon. Plus remember the City is planning a massive intensification of the Scarborough Centre district that we know will far outstrip any development that occurs elsewhere on the extension. On top of that STC will be home to not only the mall and a massive amount of residential and commercial development but will also be have connections to the GO bus network, Ellemsere BRT (if that gets built), and Intercity bus connections, and then ofcourse a connection to Line 2. STC is the primary hub for Scarborough and has been for over 30 years, there is no reason the Sheppard Line should by-pass STC. Doing so will only reduce the usefulness of an already dubious subway line.
 
Steve X said:
The hub for local transit is moving to Sheppard/McCowan. They already said there isn't a lot of development opportunities at STC so I don't see why they can shift the hub north. It's like MiWay is moving to Kipling while the business centre is still at Islington.
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Wait this is news to me. When did they say this, and who's they.
 
44 North said:
Wait this is news to me. When did they say this, and who's they.
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Currently there is a 19 bus bay terminal for TTC planned at Sheppard and 16 TTC + 7 GO/DRT terminal planned at STC. All local service feeding in from McCowan northwards would move to Sheppard. This includes the busy 939 and 985 express routes as well as most Malvern routes. All that's left at STC would be service for Ellesmere (room for 95/995, 38, 133), 134/913 for Centennial College and southwards routes (9, 16, 43B).

As for development opportunities, the city already determine there's not much benefits from the single stop express subway but still pushed forward with it a few years back.

So do they really need to keep STC as "the hub"? Most TTC riders that go through STC today use it has a transfer station, not the mall or commercial buildings. Presto does make it easier for a quick mall visit but the new STC station would be located further away like Yorkdale station connecting through a walkway to the mall. STC would be a regional hub and connection to Centennial/UTSC but the only busy local transit hub when most of the busy routes moved to Sheppard.
 
Steve X said:
Currently there is a 19 bus bay terminal for TTC planned at Sheppard and 16 TTC + 7 GO/DRT terminal planned at STC. All local service feeding in from McCowan northwards would move to Sheppard. This includes the busy 939 and 985 express routes as well as most Malvern routes. All that's left at STC would be service for Ellesmere (room for 95/995, 38, 133), 134/913 for Centennial College and southwards routes (9, 16, 43B).

As for development opportunities, the city already determine there's not much benefits from the single stop express subway but still pushed forward with it a few years back.

So do they really need to keep STC as "the hub"? Most TTC riders that go through STC today use it has a transfer station, not the mall or commercial buildings. Presto does make it easier for a quick mall visit but the new STC station would be located further away like Yorkdale station connecting through a walkway to the mall. STC would be a regional hub and connection to Centennial/UTSC but the only busy local transit hub when most of the busy routes moved to Sheppard.
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When did they say there's not a lot of development opportunities at SC?
 
44 North said:
When did they say there's not a lot of development opportunities at SC?
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Back in 2016. It's been a few years so it's harder to find news articles about it.

Steve Munro has reviewed this city report: https://torontoist.com/2016/01/does-the-tory-compromise-provide-better-transit-for-scarborough/

The city knows it's crap and pushed for it claiming subway is better. They ranked "Encouraging development and jobs" as fair.
 
This Scarborough subway extension would have stops located where exactly. ??

I thought it was from Kennedy Station to STC to Sheppard and Mccowan ?? There's a stop at Lawrence and Mccowan now ?
 
Sheppard East subway would be the worst line yet. NYC to STC movement should to be proven before they even consider it. That means they need to make more jobs near STC. Unlike Eg West in which it would attract riders from Line 2, Finch express 939 and Steeles Express 953 would likely still commute to Yonge oppose to Sheppard to Line 4. The reason is east-west routes from Central Etobicoke to Line 1 sucks and takes an hour and are much better in Scabrorough.

I rather see money go towards EELRT or building a LRT network east of Scarbrough subway. The subway lovers of Scarborough can wait longer as they don't deserve 2 subways before the much needed LRTs.
 
The Sheppard East extension would not work due to the capacity constraints on the Yonge Line. With the Ontario Line effectively killing any opportunity to relieve Yonge Line congestion north of Bloor in the Long term, I don't anticipate we'll ever see an extension of the Sheppard subway.

Had the Ontario Line been planned with long term effectiveness in mind, we'd be able to explore this extension.
 
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