[Ansem]

It'd be nice if Metrolinx did a BCA for extending Sheppard to Downsview and STC, and extending Danforth to STC and saw what that did for transit in Scarborough and economic activity.

I really think that public transit will be a huge election issue next year.

Miller's vision vs the candidate's vision...

 

[kEiThZ]

I can accept LRT as a poor man's consolation prize simply because of the ability to inter-line. And they better build that in. The inter-lining options makes LRT palatable. Consider some of the options: STC-zoo via Sheppard, STC-U of T Scarborough via Sheppard and Morningside, Malvern-Don Mills via Sheppard. Those would all be valuable options to any traveller.

 

[nfitz]

Consider some of the options: STC-zoo via Sheppard, STC-U of T Scarborough via Sheppard and Morningside, Malvern-Don Mills via Sheppard. Those would all be valuable options to any traveller.

And of course it's crying out for some link from Sheppard to Midland, so that you can run from Don Mills to STC partly down the existing alignment.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

...STC-U of T Scarborough via Sheppard and Morningside...Those would all be valuable options to any traveller.

More valuable than the bus that already goes straight there?

 

[kEiThZ]

More valuable than the bus that already goes straight there?

I didn't say it was the best option. I said it was a valuable option. The subway looks like it won't happen. I honestly think there's a better shot at getting them to budge on Sheppard before they move on a Bloor-Danforth extension.

If that's the case, then LRT is better ART mk IIs. At least they can add a few more stops. Maybe one at McLevin, one at Markham, and one at Brimley? They could also save on costs by building most of the extension at grade on Progress. Any tunneling they have to do can be cut-and-cover if they have to save money. And then there's the interlining potential of course. For all those reasons I don't think LRT is all that bad a consolation prize.

I would have preferred a subway to support the development potential of SC and to reduce transfers. But if that's not going to happen, at least we can avoid another orphan fleet. In the mean time, it just means that it'll take another 30 years for the Bloor-Danforth extension to happen!

 

[kEiThZ]

And of course it's crying out for some link from Sheppard to Midland, so that you can run from Don Mills to STC partly down the existing alignment.

I always though that was to be built on McCowan. I don't think they'd use Midland or Brimley or the SRT extension corridor. The last one is too far to the east for them. The others are too far west of STC.

 

[Second_in_pie]

If that's the case, then LRT is better ART mk IIs. At least they can add a few more stops. Maybe one at McLevin, one at Markham, and one at Brimley? They could also save on costs by building most of the extension at grade on Progress. Any tunneling they have to do can be cut-and-cover if they have to save money. And then there's the interlining potential of course. For all those reasons I don't think LRT is all that bad a consolation prize.

That's odd, cause I would have thought that smaller stops would have favored ART instead of LRT. Quick acceleration times means stations/stops have less of an impact on the overall speed of the system.

I still think that this is the absolute perfect time to build a subway. The RT has a couple years left to live. Extending to STC wouldn't disrupt the dying RT and it's passengers, and when the extension opens, the RT can just be shut down for good. Quick, painless, and great for the people of Scarborough.

 

[kEiThZ]

I agree that it's the perfect time and the perfect solution for the existing SRT corridor (I think the extension should be built with at-grade LRT). However, the powers that be believe that 100k people should be transferring everyday in 2031. If I can't win on this, at least I can sulk less if the ride's a little shorter for somebody.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

I didn't say it was the best option. I said it was a valuable option.

The bus that goes straight there will continue to go straight there.

 

[CodeMonkey]

I agree that it's the perfect time and the perfect solution for the existing SRT corridor (I think the extension should be built with at-grade LRT). However, the powers that be believe that 100k people should be transferring everyday in 2031. If I can't win on this, at least I can sulk less if the ride's a little shorter for somebody.

The problem running at grade is that commuters expects transit to avoid traffic of the road altogether, if we have a system that has to obey stop lights with cars at points on the line people will feel less incline to take transit and stick with their cars that have to follow the same stop lights. Even with very few red lights LRTs will face; the average commuter is expecting no red lights or traffic jams in intersections to slow them down.

 

[nfitz]

I always though that was to be built on McCowan. I don't think they'd use Midland or Brimley or the SRT extension corridor. The last one is too far to the east for them. The others are too far west of STC.

McCowan makes sense when the SRT was a different technology. But I'd think if the SRT is the same technology, then you'd want to take as much of it as possible. If they went from Scaborough Centre to Midland, and then angled up north along that easement (is it usable?) across Progress and down William Kitchen to Kennedy and up Kennedy to Sheppard ... or just up the side of the CN tracks to Agincourt GO (all they'd need to take over are some parking lots), they'd not be that far off the proposed Sheppard subway alignment.

 

[kEiThZ]

McCowan makes sense when the SRT was a different technology. But I'd think if the SRT is the same technology, then you'd want to take as much of it as possible. If they went from Scaborough Centre to Midland, and then angled up north along that easement (is it usable?) across Progress and down William Kitchen to Kennedy and up Kennedy to Sheppard ... or just up the side of the CN tracks to Agincourt GO (all they'd need to take over are some parking lots), they'd not be that far off the proposed Sheppard subway alignment.

That would defeat that whole "avenuization" goal of Transit City. And it'd be really completed and expensive compared to just building another branch that goes up McCowan to Sheppard...and McCowan North could use whatever relief it gets.

 

[kEiThZ]

The problem running at grade is that commuters expects transit to avoid traffic of the road altogether, if we have a system that has to obey stop lights with cars at points on the line people will feel less incline to take transit and stick with their cars that have to follow the same stop lights. Even with very few red lights LRTs will face; the average commuter is expecting no red lights or traffic jams in intersections to slow them down.

Except that this is a huge upgrade compared to take a bus from anywhere in Malvern. Also, a lot of it would be in exclusive ROW (like the Hydro corridor) or not have a lot of lights (like going down Progress), so it's not that bad. Really, anything is better than the bus in this situation.

 

[CodeMonkey]

Except that this is a huge upgrade compared to take a bus from anywhere in Malvern. Also, a lot of it would be in exclusive ROW (like the Hydro corridor) or not have a lot of lights (like going down Progress), so it's not that bad. Really, anything is better than the bus in this situation.

True, but there something just bugging me about this whole LRT idea for the city. Maybe its the fact that nothing City Council or the TTC has come up in the past ever work properly. Or if it did, they just neglected it and it became a problem. I dunno; I just have this strong distrust feeling when it comes to the TTC and "good" ideas, they normally don't go together in a sentence.

 

[nfitz]

That would defeat that whole "avenuization" goal of Transit City. And it'd be really completed and expensive compared to just building another branch that goes up McCowan to Sheppard...and McCowan North could use whatever relief it gets.

Well go up Kennedy then ... but how does this eliminate avenueization? You'd still have the Sheppard LRT.