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What do you believe should be done about the SRT?

  • Total voters
    190
You won't hear a peep from the pro-LRT crowd about this mess of a project. No stops at Markham and Milner. Brilliant. Building the extension in 2 phases so that they can expropriate good commercial land for a bus terminal that'll be useless in Phase 1 and even more useless in Phase 2. Even if you favoured LRT, why would you build it like this?
 
kEiThZ said:
You won't hear a peep from the pro-LRT crowd about this mess of a project. No stops at Markham and Milner. Brilliant. Building the extension in 2 phases so that they can expropriate good commercial land for a bus terminal that'll be useless in Phase 1 and even more useless in Phase 2. Even if you favoured LRT, why would you build it like this?
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This projects many failings have nothing to do with LRT, It was designed as a ICTS line that they have only now decided to string overhead catenary on. The project would be much better off if the TTC had not stupidly insisted in ICTS from the begenning.

They would build it all in phase one except there is not enough funding to go all the way, which is because the extension is designed as a expensive grade separated ICTS line
 
Of the refurbishment and extension I mean, I am aware of what happened when the SRT was first built, but even back then the TTC was not entirely innocent.
 
Voltz said:
The project would be much better off if the TTC had not stupidly insisted in ICTS from the begenning.
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The SRT line was designed for a variation of the CLRV in the beginning, but the province insisted on ICTS, not the TTC. Today, the TTC is redesigning it for the low-floor light rail vehicles. Since the CLRV was also designed to handle the tight curves of downtown, the original design of the SRT had those curves in mind. With the new LFLRV for the revised SRT being more off the shelf than the downtown streetcars, the curves also have to be more wider. Lastly, the LFLRV are low-floor, so either the platforms have to be lowered or the tracks have to be raised.
 
Voltz said:
Of the refurbishment and extension I mean, I am aware of what happened when the SRT was first built, but even back then the TTC was not entirely innocent.
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The Municipal Act in Ontario can be summed up like this:

"When the province says "jump" the city says 'How high?' and 'What time would you like your breakfast, master?'"

The city could have taken the province to court to try and stop the original SRT from being built and they would have lost. There is northing they could have done to change any of it. Any power they have is the power of persuasion, and that power is limited by how willing the premier is willing to compromise.
 
^ I am sure that if the City Council produces a strong majority vote in support of one technology against another, or against a certain project altogether, the provincial government will heed that vote, even though the Municipal Act does not compel it to do so.

The Province may deny the City's request for more money. But if the City wants to use already allocated funds in a certain way, it would be stupid for the provincial government to spend the money and still alienate the City's residents. They happen to be provincial voters as well, even though the riding sizes are somewhat skewed in favor of rural voters.
 
Rainforest said:
^ I am sure that if the City Council produces a strong majority vote in support of one technology against another, or against a certain project altogether, the provincial government will heed that vote, even though the Municipal Act does not compel it to do so.

The Province may deny the City's request for more money. But if the City wants to use already allocated funds in a certain way, it would be stupid for the provincial government to spend the money and still alienate the City's residents. They happen to be provincial voters as well, even though the riding sizes are somewhat skewed in favor of rural voters.
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Amalgamation is the best example of how, in practise, reality is far from ideal.
 
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The SRT is the best example of technology choice run amok. The next best example is Metrolinx's decision to use standard gauge on all Transit City lines making the legacy system and TC completely incompatible from the outset. Especially after a great deal of the legacy system was just replaced with new trackage.
 
So someone from STC will not be able to travel to sheppard via LRT going west bound.... That to me doesnt seem to make much sense.. I would have thought that once the SRT/LRT went to STC it would immediately turn north on MCcowan and connect to SHEPpard there. Guess that wouldnt make any sense....
 
Coruscanti Cognoscente said:
The SRT is the best example of technology choice run amok. The next best example is Metrolinx's decision to use standard gauge on all Transit City lines making the legacy system and TC completely incompatible from the outset. Especially after a great deal of the legacy system was just replaced with new trackage.
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As I recall, the TTC decided to use "off the shelf" vehicles for Transit City (which would be incompatible with downtown) long before Metrolinx decided it would be standard gauge.
 
RedRocket191 said:
As I recall, the TTC decided to use "off the shelf" vehicles for Transit City (which would be incompatible with downtown) long before Metrolinx decided it would be standard gauge.
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Last I checked, no LRV has been chosen for TC yet. We have new streetcars ordered, with an OPTION for double-ended versions for TC. How would those be incompatible with the legacy network?
 
RedRocket191 said:
As I recall, the TTC decided to use "off the shelf" vehicles for Transit City (which would be incompatible with downtown) long before Metrolinx decided it would be standard gauge.
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Last I checked, no LRV has been chosen for TC yet. We have new streetcars ordered, with an OPTION for double-ended versions for TC. How would those be incompatible with the legacy network?
 
Coruscanti Cognoscente said:
Last I checked, no LRV has been chosen for TC yet. We have new streetcars ordered, with an OPTION for double-ended versions for TC. How would those be incompatible with the legacy network?
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I defer to sources more knowledgeable than I:

http://lrt.daxack.ca/blog/?p=88

and

http://stevemunro.ca/?p=1047&cpage=1#comment-34798

In a nutshell, the downtown streetcars have to be able to handle sharp curves and have to be able to push a fully-loaded disabled car up an 8% grade. Adding this capability increases the cost. Suburban cars won't need this requirement, so money can be saved by making them less powerful and less nimble - but this prevents them from operating downtown.
 
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