Bikes are traffic, so they aren’t invading space when they “take over” a lane.
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- Thread starter rp07
- Start date
rbt
Senior Member
Legally true but I'm not sure that matches popular opinion.
Yes, we need a culture shift.
ShonTron
Moderator
I usually ride on Cherry Street itself - the Martin Goodman trail is too narrow in this section. I then don't also have to dismount to cross the lift bridges.
I've never dismounted to cross the bridge, I just ride across. Are we supposed to dismount?
Skeezix
Senior Member
You seem to have completely missed the point of the original post. And then your false analogy makes things worse.
Skeezix
Senior Member
Not sure unfamiliarity with the law, or unwillingness to follow the law, is "popular opinion', otherwise popular opinion seemingly dictates that it's okay to ride bikes on sidewalks, for cars to turn right on red without first coming to a complete stop, for cars to roll through stop signs, etc. etc.
If a motorist is upset when a bike takes over a lane, let's call it what it is. It's ignorance, not popular opinion.
ShonTron
Moderator
The trail leads into the sidewalk on the bridges, so if you use the MGT, you're supposed to. There are signs.
Some cyclists might not want to ride on the steel gratings that many lift bridges have. They're rough and not designed for bicycles. There are signs at every crossing of the Welland Canal and at the Hamilton Harbour Canal too to dismount and use the sidewalks. I do that at the Hamilton bridge because of the fast traffic on Eastport Drive, but otherwise ignore the signs and ride in the roadway. I haven't had a problem but I ride with wider hybrid Marathon tires.
I've honestly never noticed the signs at Cherry St! I definitely walk across the Hamilton lift bridge though.
Filip
Senior Member
Well we're being told bikes are vehicles so they must be treated as such (fair), but then bikes have 'special' rules like blowing through red lights and not stopping at stop signs because they're bikes.. God forbid you find yourself in front of one, anywhere.
I complained about this earlier, but it's getting pretty amusing now that Adelaide cycle traffic is really peaking. The bikes will. not. stop. for the buses or passengers disembarking. Drivers have given up trying to 'get into' the bike lane to drop off passengers so they let us off into the lane. You think cyclists stop? My driver is basically leaning on his horn from Spadina to Bay (when I get off).
I'm also not interested in the excuse that it takes a lot of energy to get back to moving speeds on a bike (a line of reasoning used to accommodate bikes not respecting the rules of the road) - but quite frankly LOL. You made a choice to exercise so don't complain when you have to stop and start again.
Please. Plenty of cars blow stop signs and even red lights. Glass houses and all that. That said, whether I'm personally riding or driving, I stop.
I do agree that everyone whether on a bike or in a car needs to stop for TTC passengers embarking/debarking. Again, this isn't just people on bikes. I've been on plenty of streetcars where the horn has been blared at a car driver who ignores the law to stop.
Those who ride do it for more than just the exercise, by the way.
I do agree that everyone whether on a bike or in a car needs to stop for TTC passengers embarking/debarking. Again, this isn't just people on bikes. I've been on plenty of streetcars where the horn has been blared at a car driver who ignores the law to stop.
Those who ride do it for more than just the exercise, by the way.
Filip
Senior Member
And we universally pan car drivers who do the above.
But we look for excuses when cyclists do it.. See the point I'm making?
Skeezix
Senior Member
As someone who often walks to the Financial District to work from the Danforth, and therefore sees a lot of downtown traffic close-up from the perspective of the most vulnerable road user, I can assure you bikes are by no stretch of the imagination not the only ones not stopping as required by law at stop signs or red lights. Actually, I find cyclists do mostly stop at red lights, and are less likely to run a red than motorists, but cyclists are more likely to enter the intersection early in anticipation of the green.
I'm okay with cyclists not stopping at stop signs - the so-called Portland Stop. As long as they treat it as a yield sign, which some do not. Many stop signs exist mainly to control, and slow, motor vehicles, so their usefulness in applying to cyclists is debatable. In any event, I can testify that most car drivers do not come to a complete stop at stop signs - the majority motorists seem to think rolling through a stop is okay. So, motorists are the last people on earth to be criticizing cyclists' behaviour at stop signs. Motorists "made a choice", so they shouldn't be complaining that stop signs stop their momentum.
I agree with you on cyclists with passengers disembarking from streetcars. Most motorists stop (most, not all, and some speed thru to try and beat the passengers), but many cyclists seem to think the rule doesn't apply to them. Not surprised by your observations with the buses. Same with signalized pedestrian crossings, where I routinely see close calls between pedestrians crossing and cyclists speeding through illegally. There is some real need for public education.
Also, most pedestrians need a better understanding of how pedestrian signals work. Mind you, most pedestrian signals are timed to favour motorists, so I understand why so many pedestrians can be frustrated.
Motorists, cyclists and pedestrians could all use a bit of schooling on the rules of the road. Mind you, only one of those groups uses metal contraptions weighing on average 4000+ lbs, which routinely gravely injure and kill people from the other two groups, so maybe we should keep this all in proper context.
But we don’t. Read any comments section where car drivers diss cyclists for the same behaviour they exhibit while driving multi-ton vehicles.
I have twice reported TTC buses for running red lights, once almost hitting me while I was crossing the road with a walk signal. Crickets.
Filip
Senior Member
There are shitty people on all sides, but I don't think I've ever seen dozens and dozens of cars at once rushing a bus that is in the midst of letting off 20-30 people at Bay. When a car does it, it's one car. When bikes do it it's about the whole gaggle of bikes doing it at once. The chaos is amusing unless you're in it.