[lordmandeep]

its not like Richmond Hill are cheap in any matter...

Brampton is rather cheap, but Richmond Hill houses are rather expensive.
Really I would bet downtown Toronto is mostly white and most of the people moving to downtown are white.... Agree or disagree???




Mississauga is one suburban community that is more mixed, I say...

 

[urbandreamer]

I'd agree with lordmandeep and chuck. Whites are moving downtown/buying downtown, with pockets of chinese etc around city place. Roncevalles/High Park/Junction/Swansea is probably 98% white.

Kitchener-Waterloo-Cambridge, although smaller than the GTA, is almost as diverse as the GTA yet all ethnicities are mixed throughout the 'burbs and even parts of the older cores. It was an interesting contrast to Toronto. (Yet many people I know in K-W are jealous of the GTA's enclaves--the South Asians wishing they could live in Brampton, the Chinese in Richmond Hill/Markham, etc. Human nature, I guess.

If I ever have time to tackle this issue properly, I'll write out my essay here.

 

[theman23]

The GTA is so un-multicultural nowadays. Go to Richmond Hill, and 90% of the people are Chinese. Go to Woodbridge and 90% of the people are Italian. Go to Brampton and 90% of the people are Indian I think? Over at Yonge and Eglinton, the locals are whiter than a fresh snowfall. Everyone gets along together which is fantastic, but different ethnic groups don't seem to want to live together.

20%, 44%, and 17% actually.

 

[Chuck]

Really I would bet downtown Toronto is mostly white and most of the people moving to downtown are white.... Agree or disagree???

In the 2001 census, the borough of Toronto was the second whitest community in the continuously urbanized part of the GTA, behind Vaughan. Remember though that white doesn't equal non immigrant - there are a lot of Russian, Italian, and eastern European immigrants in inner Toronto that are still new Canadians, but who would not be considered a visible minority.

 

[theman23]

Don't forget that many of the immigrants in Toronto are relatively recent, first or second generation. Immigrants always tend to live within their own little clusters, for a variety of reasons including shared access to housing and the job market. And with the atrophying of our Canadian social welfare system, I expect this trend to increase.

 

[lordmandeep]

20%, 44%, and 17% actually.
Reply With Quote

you have a point but you have whole sections of these communities where its is like 60-90%.

I know in Springdale the percentage of Indians easily goes to 60% (where I live) and almost 95% in places like The Gore Road and Highway 7.


Yes people in first and somewhat in the second generation live near their community.

Really, If i had to live in Suburbia I would pick a place like Willowdale or something like that. Nice area with nice houses but with easy access to transit and downtown.
... Not really a condo person, I was in apartment one time visiting someone when a fire broke out on the second level. Scared the crap out of me when I was 11.

 

[syn]

I'd agree with lordmandeep and chuck. Whites are moving downtown/buying downtown, with pockets of chinese etc around city place. Roncevalles/High Park/Junction/Swansea is probably 98% white.

Kitchener-Waterloo-Cambridge, although smaller than the GTA, is almost as diverse as the GTA yet all ethnicities are mixed throughout the 'burbs and even parts of the older cores. It was an interesting contrast to Toronto. (Yet many people I know in K-W are jealous of the GTA's enclaves--the South Asians wishing they could live in Brampton, the Chinese in Richmond Hill/Markham, etc. Human nature, I guess.

If I ever have time to tackle this issue properly, I'll write out my essay here.

Actually I've noticed some of these areas getting more diverse. It's slower, but it's happening.

 

[syn]

New immigrants can't really be blamed for not knowing. Most of them are all too happy to move out of their closet-sized apartments in Asia to their dream home in Toronto, and they will do anything to ensure that they will get that kind of lifestyle. Also, media outside of North America and Europe very rarely report on the problems of suburbanization... in fact, in places like China suburbanization is actually encouraged.

Maybe a booth should be set up at the Arrivals level of Pearson, complete with warning signs, brochures, and free DVDs, so that newcomers could be warned about the costs of living in the suburbs.

That's a good point. It's more probably more understandable for them than for people who've been living here for a while. That said, there are a lot of middle class-wealthy immigrants arriving too.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

I see that report has questionable maps just like the 'three cities' income maps from a while back. Most of the areas home to immigrants in the second map were uninhabited or farmland back in the 60s. This type of report always focuses on where immigrants want to live even while ignoring where everyone else wants to live...maybe if the old city of Toronto wasn't gentrifying, clans of Kazakhs or Somalis would be moving to Parkdale.

Both the absolute cheapest and the most expensive housing is in the 416, but much of the 905 has cheaper housing per square foot, so if an immigrant family can afford $400,000 or $500,000 to start, they may get a lot more house in the 905 than in the 416...perfect for in-laws and boarders! A great many of the immigrant families I know arrived in Canada financially comfortable, either from bringing money from abroad or having good jobs ready for them here or having endless friends and relatives here to help them...it's not like all immigrants are drifting into Canadian waters clinging to rafts without worldly possessions. $500,000 is nothing if you have multiple wage earners living together and contributing.

20%, 44%, and 17% actually.

That's right. One could say that most parts of Toronto are so multicultural that any group that can manage, say, 20% of the population in a local area can drown out other groups and make their presence disproportionately visible through stuff like restaurants, stores, institutions, etc., and then the area becomes known as a ___-ese or ___-ian area. One example I like to use is the Filipino community, which is tens of thousands of people strong but is, in some ways, virtually invisible.

 

[lordmandeep]

true Immigrants now come into the country with a lot more money and tend to live with relatives till they get on their own and some are already set. Really if your part of the big major communities you likely have a relative in the Toronto area. Plus, you can get a job at a place dominated by people of that community. So you learn some English and you slowly adapt to a new country.


However there are some that are really screwing themselves over. Many of the immigrants who are poorer tend to do everything possible to get the big prize of a new home so they don't get looked down upon by their family and friends. My uncles family lived in an older bungalow and we all moved into new homes. There house was older but a much nicer and more cozy house. A great place to hang out or chill out with a wooden fireplace and the place was smaller and more appealing. People tend to have houses much larger then they really need and it makes the house boring, open and depressing especially in the winter. However they then bought a crappy, cold, wide open new subdivision recently.

My aunt lived with us for 5 months before she got on her own and before that my uncle came in 1994 and lived for 1 years till he got on his own.


I noticed though Latinos and Eastern Europeans tend to stay close to downtown....

 

[King of Kensington]

That's right. One could say that most parts of Toronto are so multicultural that any group that can manage, say, 20% of the population in a local area can drown out other groups and make their presence disproportionately visible through stuff like restaurants, stores, institutions, etc., and then the area becomes known as a ___-ese or ___-ian area. One example I like to use is the Filipino community, which is tens of thousands of people strong but is, in some ways, virtually invisible.

Exactly. Areas that people tend to think of as homogeneous tend to be quite diverse and rarely are majorities of areas actually made up of said group. Forest Hill is about 50% Jewish, but that means 50% are not Jewish. 40% of Kensington/Chinatown is Chinese. The Danforth is only around 10% Greek. The same is true in 905 - you have a lot of Italians in "Chinese" Richmond Hill and "Jewish" Thornhill, etc., lots of Italians, Portuguese and Blacks in "Indian" Brampton, etc.

 

[Disparishun]

Exactly. Areas that people tend to think of as homogeneous tend to be quite diverse and rarely are majorities of areas actually made up of said group. Forest Hill is about 50% Jewish, but that means 50% are not Jewish. 40% of Kensington/Chinatown is Chinese. The Danforth is only around 10% Greek. The same is true in 905 - you have a lot of Italians in "Chinese" Richmond Hill and "Jewish" Thornhill, etc., lots of Italians, Portuguese and Blacks in "Indian" Brampton, etc.

However, most statistics are geared towards visible minorities or not. Jews, Greeks, Italians, Portugese, etc. do not exist.

 

[scarberiankhatru]

Not that it figures into these census numbers, but to some white people, Eye-talians, etc., *are* visible minorities, at least to the point that local concentrations amount to "ethnic" neighbourhoods.

 

[Dan416]

The GTA is so un-multicultural nowadays. Go to Richmond Hill, and 90% of the people are Chinese. Go to Woodbridge and 90% of the people are Italian. Go to Brampton and 90% of the people are Indian I think? Over at Yonge and Eglinton, the locals are whiter than a fresh snowfall. Everyone gets along together which is fantastic, but different ethnic groups don't seem to want to live together.

Have you been to Mississauga? It's very mixed, with lots of Chinese, Indians, Italians, Polish, Portugese, Arabs, etc.

 

[W. K. Lis]

I think that in the ethnic homes, they rent out the extra bedrooms to boarders or relatives, or create (illegal) basement apartments, to help pay off the mortgage. The boarders probably belong to their own ethnic group. In addition, the boarders don't record their rent on their income tax, in return for a lower rent.
In the older parts of the city, they are returning to single family setup, after paying off the mortgage.