Allandale25
Senior Member
Good news?
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- Thread starter drum118
- Start date
Northern Light
Superstar
Given that they only just went back to 30M service on the LSE last weekend; and apparently demand was sufficiently high that they feel the need to add cars, I would say yes, if by good news we mean ridership is returning to pre-pandemic levels for leisure travel.
ARG1
Senior Member
The inevitable day has finally arrived:
While long term this is a sound decision, I find it interesting how they don't address the main reason that the station hasn't closed yet, that being the lack of fare integration with the TTC. While they do raise a good point that with a daily ridership of 150 students there is very little reason to have this station when the students can change at Downsview Park and have a 4 min ride to York U, its important to note that with this change, these students now have to pay an additional $3.20, plus the extra cost of reaching Downsview Park GO compared to York University GO, assuming they do not have a Monthly Pass on the TTC.
While long term this is a sound decision, I find it interesting how they don't address the main reason that the station hasn't closed yet, that being the lack of fare integration with the TTC. While they do raise a good point that with a daily ridership of 150 students there is very little reason to have this station when the students can change at Downsview Park and have a 4 min ride to York U, its important to note that with this change, these students now have to pay an additional $3.20, plus the extra cost of reaching Downsview Park GO compared to York University GO, assuming they do not have a Monthly Pass on the TTC.
Northern Light
Superstar
The inevitable day has finally arrived:
While long term this is a sound decision, I find it interesting how they don't address the main reason that the station hasn't closed yet, that being the lack of fare integration with the TTC. While they do raise a good point that with a daily ridership of 150 students there is very little reason to have this station when the students can change at Downsview Park and have a 4 min ride to York U, its important to note that with this change, these students now have to pay an additional $3.20, plus the extra cost of reaching Downsview Park GO compared to York University GO, assuming they do not have a Monthly Pass on the TTC.
A question I have..... what % of that '150' could simply access the TYSSE in York Region and subway down at no additional fare vs those who originate far enough north that that option isn't really open to them?
ARG1
Senior Member
0%? The previous two GO stations are Rutherford and Maple, and while it is possible to reach VMC from those stations, its not exactly easy, and could easily add a lot of time to your trip. Heck, according to GMaps, if you want to get from Rutherford to VMC, its faster to take the GO train down to Downsview Park and transfer to Line 1. This would get you to VMC in 26 mins rather than 36 mins.
Northern Light
Superstar
I find that improbable, I assume some portion of York students wouldn't drive themselves to Rutherford Station (if that was there boarding point), and one could select the Keele Bus as an alternative, and its a straight-line to Pioneer Village Station from Rutherford in 18M-20M depending on time of day.
Coming from Major Mack (Maple) adds only a few minutes.
I would certainly agree that a material number of the students (I'd go so far as to say a clear majority) currently using GO may well board further north on the line, and that for them the inconvenience would be greater.
But I would still like to know how many of those riders originate at Rutherford or Maple, and I assume it isn't zero. (but perhaps I'm wrong, that is why I would like to know what the number is).
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Needless to say, I wasn't disagreeing with you, simply wondering about the exact extent of the inconvenience caused.
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ARG1
Senior Member
I think either way though its a massive inconvenience to everyone who relied on it, if not fiscally, then it applies a pretty major hit on their travel times even if its a direct bus service.
Garuda
Active Member
Finally! In March 2020 the station closed in all but name. Now it’s officially closing in name!The inevitable day has finally arrived:
While long term this is a sound decision, I find it interesting how they don't address the main reason that the station hasn't closed yet, that being the lack of fare integration with the TTC. While they do raise a good point that with a daily ridership of 150 students there is very little reason to have this station when the students can change at Downsview Park and have a 4 min ride to York U, its important to note that with this change, these students now have to pay an additional $3.20, plus the extra cost of reaching Downsview Park GO compared to York University GO, assuming they do not have a Monthly Pass on the TTC.
reaperexpress
Senior Member
The insanity stems from the hamfisted way in which short-distance fares were reduced in 2019 (which I documented here). The logical solution would have been to reduce the flat fare and increase the zone fares, producing a steady cost gradient which reduces the price for cheap trips and increases the price for long trips. But intsead, they kept the zone fares the same, increased the flat fare and then added some inconsistent discounts to shorter trips. Which, surprise surprise, results in some pretty ridiculous prices for trips around the cutoff distance for those short-distance discounts (~20 km).
Union to Downsview Park, and Union to Eglinton are both 17.1 km. Prior to the fare adjustment they both cost $5.02. But during the adjustment, Eglinton got a short-distance discount but Downsview Park didn't, so the price to Eglinton dropped to $3.70 while the price to Downsview Park increased to $5.17.
If Metrolinx wants to be trusted with fare integration between transit agencies, they first need to sort out the fare systems of the agencies they already own. UP Express has been semi-integrated with GO for nearly five years, and they still maintain incompatible presto readers which are a perpetual source of incorrect fares for trips to/from Bloor or Weston. Since those stations have the same entrances for UP and GO customers, it's easy to check in on a GO reader, and check out on an UP reader (or vice versa), which actually counts as two check-ins, resulting in a huge penalty fare for two failed check-outs.
All they need to do to resolve this headache is make the Union UP platform and Pearson station their own GO fare zones such that a Union-Pearson trip costs whatever they want it to cost. Then it would not matter which particular Presto reader customers use at Bloor and Weston.
Nobody "relied" on York U station. Downsview Park station accomplishes everything York U station did, and then some. Closing the station only adds 2 minutes for passengers heading to York University from the north (while also saving 2 minutes for everyone on the train who isn't going to York University). The only issue is the lack of fare integration, which is indeed a very significant issue. Maybe if York U staff had focused their efforts on that issue rather than spreading outright lies about the effects of closing the station, then more progress would have been made by now.
I'd also like to point out that most of the people using the station were not students, they were staff. That's why the university was begging GO to keep the station open to serve 150 (staff) trips, while they actually forced GO to close the York University Bus terminal, adding a transfer and double-fare for the 26,000 (student) trips which formerly used it.
Well getting people to ride the weekend service which does exist is the most effective way to justify more weekend service.
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ARG1
Senior Member
Which is precisely my point...
Interesting...
Although these 2 don't seem to be comparable. While I don't deny that's a possibility, at least to me it seems like wanting to get rid of busses on campus is quite a bit different from getting rid of a train that stops 20 mins walk away. I'm not sure they should be equated...
smallspy
Senior Member
That was certainly not my observation when I did use the station when it was still open.
Dan
ssiguy2
Senior Member
Didn't exactly know where to pose this question so this thread looked as good as any..........................When will the actual announcement be made about who the winner bidder is? With the announcement will we also know exactly what types of trains and technology they will use?
generalcanada
Senior Member
the rumor is around march 2022. cant remember exactly where i remember hearing that but ya its coming soon
as for the trains its 100% going to be catenary with most likely diesel backup for non-electrified lines like kitchener and lakeshore west past aldershot
very small possibility that battery gets used for those non-electrified lines but very unlikely
ssiguy2
Senior Member
March/2022? That means that ML has only 3 and a half years to electrify 300km of track, receive an entire new fleet of vehicles, potentially redo stations to ensure level boarding, do all the substation work, and train the staff? At ML glacial speed, Torontonians will be lucky to have RER by 2030.
generalcanada
Senior Member
wait who said 2025 was a hard date?
metrolinx has been loose with the dates for this reason.
its a huge project and yes theres been complications for years, but with the large amount of early works projects happening like culverts, bridges and utility work we should see construction start to pick up.
as for the construction timeline once it gets built 2030 does sound like a conservative date for full completion
you can also separate "service increases" on the barrie line and "electrification" into 2 different projects combind into one.
metrolinx has been loose with the dates for this reason.
its a huge project and yes theres been complications for years, but with the large amount of early works projects happening like culverts, bridges and utility work we should see construction start to pick up.
as for the construction timeline once it gets built 2030 does sound like a conservative date for full completion
you can also separate "service increases" on the barrie line and "electrification" into 2 different projects combind into one.