[Goldie]

What is the status on this structure?

Joy Gas Station at Sunnyside (moved & renovated at taxpayer expense).
I believe the City is still looking for some entrepreneur to lease it and make it useful.

 

[k10ery]

What is the status on this structure?

http://news.nationalpost.com/2012/05/14/peter-kuitenbrouwer-no-joy-for-forgotten-toronto-landmark/

 

[k10ery]

Then and Now for June 4.


Then. 49 Dunvegan Road, c1910. Residence of W. Carter. JT?

Can I do the honours?

W. E. H. Carter, employed by E. T. Carter & Co., and Carter & Smith - according to the 1913 City Directory. E. T. Carter was the fur trading company, and presumably the family business. Carter & Smith were mining engineers working in northeastern Ontario. W. E. H. had earlier (1901) worked as the Secretary of the Ontario Bureau of Mines.

Meanwhile, Burke, Horwood & White designed a house at 49 Dunvegan Road in 1914 for Mrs T. M. Gibson. The name and the date are both a little confusing. is this the same house?

 

[Earlscourt_Lad]

to the removal of a "it's not a bearing wall"; the lack of workmanship continues . . .


Regards,
J T

Purlins need props, as they say.

 

[Urban Shocker]

With respect, I do not think that Casa Loma is "off topic". The subject was Chorley Park, reviled and ultimately demolished because of its drain on the public purse. Since the same issues are in the news now with Casa Loma I think the comparison is a useful one, and adma's discussion of changing attitudes to preservation is right on the mark.

It's also perfectly legit to consider the societal values that enabled Casa Loma to be so celebrated in its day, rather than merely situate such buildings in their design context in relation to equivalent buildings in other countries. The acquisition of vast personal wealth, and the construction of a building that primarily expresses ostentatious wealth because wealth was seen as moral and virtuous at the time, in a world that was about to be swept away by the First World War, leaves us with Casa Loma as a touchstone to that past - just as Joy gas stations are a touchstone to the world of gas jockeys and service stations and the era that followed the Great War.

 

[thecharioteer]

It's also perfectly legit to consider the societal values that enabled Casa Loma to be so celebrated in its day, rather than merely situate such buildings in their design context in relation to equivalent buildings in other countries. The acquisition of vast personal wealth, and the construction of a building that primarily expresses ostentatious wealth because wealth was seen as moral and virtuous at the time, in a world that was about to be swept away by the First World War, leaves us with Casa Loma as a touchstone to that past - just as Joy gas stations are a touchstone to the world of gas jockeys and service stations and the era that followed the Great War.

"The Edwardian age was probably the last period in history when the fortunate thought they could give pleasure to others by displaying their good fortune before them". James Laver, Edwardian Promenade, 1958

"Perhaps the most over-the-top Fifth Avenue mansion of all time was the childhood home of Huguette Clark, built in 1907 by her father, the silver king and Senator William Andrews Clark, at the corner of 77th and Fifth. The elaborate townhouse, designed in the height of Beaux Arts style, boasted "121 rooms, 31 baths, four art galleries, a swimming pool, a concealed garage," and a private underground rail line to bring in coal for heat. It cost Clark $7M—that's $162M in today's dollars—to build, but stood for only 20 years, bought by a developer after Clark's death for less than half the construction cost and demolished to make way for 960 Fifth Avenue".

http://readnewyork.com/2012/02/history-lessons-looking-back-at-manhattans-lost-gilded-age-mansions/

 

[adma]

It's also perfectly legit to consider the societal values that enabled Casa Loma to be so celebrated in its day, rather than merely situate such buildings in their design context in relation to equivalent buildings in other countries. The acquisition of vast personal wealth, and the construction of a building that primarily expresses ostentatious wealth because wealth was seen as moral and virtuous at the time, in a world that was about to be swept away by the First World War, leaves us with Casa Loma as a touchstone to that past - just as Joy gas stations are a touchstone to the world of gas jockeys and service stations and the era that followed the Great War.

Though I'd urge caution in Casa Loma's case because it was regarded as an over-the-top "instant landmark" folly even within its own time and by the standards of the day...

 

[Mustapha]

Can I do the honours?

W. E. H. Carter, employed by E. T. Carter & Co., and Carter & Smith - according to the 1913 City Directory. E. T. Carter was the fur trading company, and presumably the family business. Carter & Smith were mining engineers working in northeastern Ontario. W. E. H. had earlier (1901) worked as the Secretary of the Ontario Bureau of Mines.

Meanwhile, Burke, Horwood & White designed a house at 49 Dunvegan Road in 1914 for Mrs T. M. Gibson. The name and the date are both a little confusing. is this the same house?

Thank you k10ery. I know zip about the history of this house so I can't be useful.

 

[Mustapha]

It's also perfectly legit to consider the societal values that enabled Casa Loma to be so celebrated in its day, rather than merely situate such buildings in their design context in relation to equivalent buildings in other countries. The acquisition of vast personal wealth, and the construction of a building that primarily expresses ostentatious wealth because wealth was seen as moral and virtuous at the time, in a world that was about to be swept away by the First World War, leaves us with Casa Loma as a touchstone to that past - just as Joy gas stations are a touchstone to the world of gas jockeys and service stations and the era that followed the Great War.

Along this line... I had to spend a day at Hearst Castle 12 years ago (family holiday thing). I thought it awfully hyped for what you actually saw. I wouldn't recommend it nor would I visit it again, but that's me.

 

[Mustapha]

"The Edwardian age was probably the last period in history when the fortunate thought they could give pleasure to others by displaying their good fortune before them". James Laver, Edwardian Promenade, 1958

"Perhaps the most over-the-top Fifth Avenue mansion of all time was the childhood home of Huguette Clark, built in 1907 by her father, the silver king and Senator William Andrews Clark, at the corner of 77th and Fifth. The elaborate townhouse, designed in the height of Beaux Arts style, boasted "121 rooms, 31 baths, four art galleries, a swimming pool, a concealed garage," and a private underground rail line to bring in coal for heat. It cost Clark $7M—that's $162M in today's dollars—to build, but stood for only 20 years, bought by a developer after Clark's death for less than half the construction cost and demolished to make way for 960 Fifth Avenue".

http://readnewyork.com/2012/02/history-lessons-looking-back-at-manhattans-lost-gilded-age-mansions/

That link is fascinating, thecharioteer, thank you. The Ralph Lauren 'flagship' store - the former Rhinelander mansion - on Madison Avenue is worth a visit.. you can walk around inside - and even buy something if the merchandise strikes your fancy.

 

[Mustapha]

Then and Now for June 5.


Then. 148 Farnham Avenue. Residence of W. R. Wilson. c1910.

Now. September 2011.

 

[wwwebster]

Meanwhile, Burke, Horwood & White designed a house at 49 Dunvegan Road in 1914 for Mrs T. M. Gibson. The name and the date are both a little confusing.

The 1914 directory lists the house as vacant. The 1917 and 1919 directories list the occupant as Mrs. Jane Gibson, and by 1921 the occupant is George Grieve. The house pictured is by Bond and Smith. The Burke, Horwood & White plans may have been for an interior renovation, or a backyard extension, or simply a dream never realized.

 

[DTowner]

Waddesdon Manor, the bogus Loire chateau the Rothschilds built in rural Buckinghamshire in the 1870s and 1880s, strikes me as a reasonable equivalent to Casa Loma in pretense and vulgarity.

The Rothschilds also struck, big time, in France, and quite amusingly so - Château de Ferrières, a fake Renaissance monster home built in the 1850s, was designed by Joseph Paxton, no less. It's based on Mentmore, which the same architect designed for the family in Buckinghamshire. "Build me a Mentmore, but twice the size" Baron James is reputed to have directed. And he did.

Pretense and vulgarity are in the eye of the beholder. In my layman opinion, Chorley house was beautiful as were the grounds. If it were still standing it could've been used for events, weddings, movies... Most people aren't educated on the history and design of castles to know that it is a folly or mistake. They take it at face value and I bet most Torontonians now would've liked it (as would've tourists). I'll take a vulgar and pretensious castle over an idiot-proof-designed, cheap-looking building like TD Centre. THOSE should be torn down. But, we're way too far in the game for that (as with the Gardiner). x

 

[DSC]

Well, I guess it's worth an old fashioned physical visit then. Thanks DSC.

Yes, a visit is clearly in order and the Toronto Port Authority seem to have quite a substantial photo-archive. I just borrowed "Reflections of Toronto Harbour" from the TPL - it is filled with (not terribly well reproduced) photos that appear to belong to TPA. Let's hope they do some digitisation!

 

[adma]

I'll take a vulgar and pretensious castle over an idiot-proof-designed, cheap-looking building like TD Centre. THOSE should be torn down.

I could imagine one referring to, say, the Hudson's Bay Centre, but...TD? Really?