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treplow

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For all the faults of the CDPQi (and there were/are many), at least they got a full brand new rapid transit line in Montreal built relatively quickly. Contrast that with the Blue line extension, which has been talked about (and talked about and talked about) for decades before only now seeing some concrete steps towards construction. Based on the provincial and municipal government's track record to date I expect the REM East to be in service no earlier than about 2052.
 

Xav

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For all the faults of the CDPQi (and there were/are many), at least they got a full brand new rapid transit line in Montreal built relatively quickly. Contrast that with the Blue line extension, which has been talked about (and talked about and talked about) for decades before only now seeing some concrete steps towards construction. Based on the provincial and municipal government's track record to date I expect the REM East to be in service no earlier than about 2052.
How quickly did the Ontario line get to construction? Toronto didn't have large scale projects for a long time either, and the Ontario government didn't have to give full control to a private entity to get it built. The past is not necessarily a good indication for the future.

If ARTM gets half the powers CDPQi was given by the government, projects will move much quicker.
 

ARG1

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How quickly did the Ontario line get to construction? Toronto didn't have large scale projects for a long time either, and the Ontario government didn't have to give full control to a private entity to get it built. The past is not necessarily a good indication for the future.

If ARTM gets half the powers CDPQi was given by the government, projects will move much quicker.
Its really a question of political political beholdence. The Caisse was able to push through projects like the REM at full force because they're technically not democratically elected and as such have far fewer risks when it comes to electioneering.

As for Ontario, it really comes down to 2 things:

1) A lot of projects like the Ontario Line and expanded SSE and EW are based off previously studied material, and as such the design work was far easier to do compared to a new project being designed from scratch. This is why a project that is covering a lot of new ground like the YNSE isn't going as rapidly.

2) Doug Fordism. He just doesn't care, and really wants to ram through projects on his own volition. Now I know this is contradictory to what I said about government agencies, but the point I'm trying to make is pulling a Doug Ford is a very risky move. It might work out like it currently is for him, but it could also easily backfire. Doug Ford's cramming of projects is definitely rising the amount of pandering to NIMBYs that the NDP especially are committing right now.

So, maybe you're right about the ARTM and the possibility of getting more powers? But you can't really say for sure.
 

robmausser

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How quickly did the Ontario line get to construction? Toronto didn't have large scale projects for a long time either, and the Ontario government didn't have to give full control to a private entity to get it built. The past is not necessarily a good indication for the future.

If ARTM gets half the powers CDPQi was given by the government, projects will move much quicker.

The other part is simply money too. The Crosstown took a long time not just because it was a technically challenging project, and it was full of political infighting and lots of regulation etc, but also because the way the Liberals procured the project in small stages helped them to balance the budget etc. There are ways you can kind of cook the books so to speak when you pay for things in small chunks over a longer period of time.

CDPQi's projects went so quickly because they basically shoveled money into it, and its the same reason for the Ontario Line.
 

p_xavier

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The other part is simply money too. The Crosstown took a long time not just because it was a technically challenging project, and it was full of political infighting and lots of regulation etc, but also because the way the Liberals procured the project in small stages helped them to balance the budget etc. There are ways you can kind of cook the books so to speak when you pay for things in small chunks over a longer period of time.

CDPQi's projects went so quickly because they basically shoveled money into it, and its the same reason for the Ontario Line.
EAs were streamlined for transit projects in Ontario and not in Québec, meaning that "Why didn't you study paddle boats" type of questions are still asked at the BAPE.
 

asher__jo

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NoahB

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Of course, however it's good to see a mayor able to counter the Premiers autocratic tendencies (Unlike Tory against Ford). I think we'll end up with a much more compelling transit project even if there is moderate cost increases.
The downtown portion has been abandoned and now streetcar-loving councillors will come asking for urban trams again. The pessimist in me thinks they will not suddenly decide to burry the line downtown using tiny trains anymore. Instead, I see them creating a scenic LRT line that will be as fast as a bus going to the outermost regions of the island, taking forever to get to the green line to transfer to downtown.

Remember that Plante's Pink Line and its western tram portion? Whatever happened to that?
 

asher__jo

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The downtown portion has been abandoned and now streetcar-loving councillors will come asking for urban trams again. The pessimist in me thinks they will not suddenly decide to burry the line downtown using tiny trains anymore. Instead, I see them creating a scenic LRT line that will be as fast as a bus going to the outermost regions of the island, taking forever to get to the green line to transfer to downtown.

Remember that Plante's Pink Line and its western tram portion? Whatever happened to that?
I don't think you'll see the downtown portion happen.
 

Xav

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Remember that Plante's Pink Line and its western tram portion? Whatever happened to that?
The Lachine tramway is currently being studied by the province, more to come later this year actually! The pink line is just a dream for now :p

Frankly, downtown doesn't need more transit. Eastern Montreal does.
 

robmausser

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I would love to see a cost breakdown of how much money really was saved by using the old CN rail tunnel vs just boring a new tunnel next to it, considering all of these complications. Of course you would have to factor in any refurbishment to the old tunnel that would need to be done that now would not be needed due to this rebuild.

However, if the cost was close, then this is an epic fail. It would have been much more wise in that case to build a new tunnel for the REM, as this effectively killed the ability to have VIA and other trains continue into Garre Central from the East. Two tunnels are always better than one.
 

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