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Don Mills is part of the second round, as is Jane and Scarborough-'Malvern'. Lots of issues with Don Mills left to figure out, especially the southern terminus. Many have argued (even a prominent leather-wearing transit advocate/critic) that it might just make sense to send the DRL up to Don Mills/Eglinton anyway instead for the south part.
I could see that working, but it all seems so pointless if we're just going to be getting regular LRT on Eglinton :(

If Don Mills is going to go all the way to Bloor, I would like to see it go to Broadview station, so it could hook up with the King and Dundas lines. Then the DRL could run to Pape and go down. If you ask me, the combination of these two routes would give people a very strong number of options. Perhaps during rush hour there could be a Don Mills-King LRT! I think that there are a lot of people who would just take the LRT to work, so it could even just provide relief to the Yonge line on it's own.

Too bad that the alignment is holding things up, because Don Mills and Jane are (surprisingly) the most likely to work out well in my opinion. If they worked on at least Don Mills first, then they could spend more time figuring out the logistics of more *ahem* controversial routes, i.e. Sheppard, Eglinton and Finch (well at least the part east of yonge) Kind of weird how these routes are the ones being pushed first, eh?
 
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^^Well, to be fair, Don Mills, Malvern, and Jane all have their own share of problems. Don Mills needs to have the terminii (Markham extension) figured out, Jane is very controversial, and would be very difficult to implement (IMO, Kipling would have been much better), and Malvern doesn't even have a correct alighnment figured out. They are doing the most crucial one first, so Eglinton, Finch, and Sheppard. Of course, I'd leave Sheppard for the end, till we can figure out what to do, but go ahead with Don Mills instead.
 
The announcement will be significant.

RCCAO welcomes Ontario government plan to merge Metrolinx and GO Transit

The planned consolidation of Metrolinx and GO Transit by the province will result in infrastructure projects starting faster for construction firms to work on, says one construction association.

“This move shows that the province wants a faster start on construction projects though its Move Ontario plan and getting shovels in the ground overall,â€

http://dcnonl.com/article/id33258
 
Expanding Metrolinx may threaten TTC
http://www.metronews.ca/toronto/comment/article/207340

Urban Compass by John Sewell
URBAN COMPASS
April 03, 2009 1:00 a.m.
Be the first to comment


The TTC will be seriously challenged by the provincial plans to strengthen Metrolinx as the regional transportation authority.

A more powerful Metrolinx will run GO Transit, and the elected local politicians on the Metrolinx board will be replaced with provincial appointees as it expands long distance commuting in the GTA.

Yesterday Premier Dalton McGuinty announced $9 billion for three new lines to be built in the next seven years: On Eglinton from Pearson airport in Mississauga to Kennedy; on Finch; and in the Region of York.

Where will the money come from to operate these new commuter services which will all operate seriously in the red?

GO Transit carries almost 50 million riders a year, at a deficit of about $5 per rider. (Someone travelling into the downtown from Oakville by GO transit gets $10 in subsidy every day from the province.) York Region Transit carries 10 million riders at a subsidy of $2.50 per rider.

Carrying commuters long distances always operates at a deficit that grows with the length of the ride, and escalates even more if it is by rail rather than by bus.

The fear is when Metrolinx looks for money to run these new services, it will demand it from the one healthy transit system in the GTA, the TTC.

The TTC dwarfs the other transit systems in the GTA in the number of passengers carried, 450 million per year, and its subsidy, roughly 50 cents per rider.

In the past few decades the TTC has found money to run its subways, which serve as an inexpensive and attractive commuter services for people living outside of the city, by cutting streetcar and bus service and by raising fares. The effect has been to reduce the number of local transit riders in the city who get tired of waiting for a streetcar or bus that never seems to come and costs a lot for a short ride.

That’s the worry with a more powerful Metrolinx: Downtown transit will be sacrificed to pay for a regional commuter system.




:confused: maybe I'm missing something, but if GO's fare recovery is 82% how is a $12.50 ticket subsidized by $10.. shouldn't it be the other way around?
 
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I hear basically what you're saying - it's reasonable to be sketpical. Just don't let it get the best of you. In answer to some of your questions.

-Yes, I think these are the ones that are shovel ready. Lots of people on these boards advocate for a DRL but there is a reason there is no money for the DRL: The city didn't ask for it or plan for it.

I know I said I was done....but maybe I need to ask what the definition of "shovel ready" is......Adam Giambrone was quoted as telling people on Eglinton (those worried about the construction) to relax....there are still studies to be done.....the decision on when/how construction will start is at least 6 months away and construction is, at least, 14 months away.

As recessions go, if this one is still around in 14 months waiting for this project to get us going again.....we would be better off keeping the money and feeding ourselves because we will be in really really deep doo doo
 
450 million per year, and its subsidy, roughly 50 cents per rider.


its 459 million for 2007 and TTC Chair on Cp24 said it was about 3% to 473 million for 2008.
 
Durham media: Toronto shouldn't get all the money


hume on the transit plan


and from the Globe

Questions remain in much-touted transit plan
JEFF GRAY
April 3, 2009
Despite Premier Dalton McGuinty's decision to fund a $7.2-billion chunk of Mayor David Miller's light-rail vision, the ambitious plan still faces questions about how the lines will be built and how much they will cost.

The projects endorsed this week would put dedicated light-rail lines down the middle of Finch Avenue and along Eglinton Avenue from Scarborough to Pearson Airport, with a tunnelled section through the centre of town. The Scarborough RT would also be extended.

Toronto Transit Commission staff have been hard at work on the details, but some questions remain, including the final alignment of the lines, traffic problems, concerns from some along the routes about construction and the final costs.

"Any project, of any nature, has technical issues," said Councillor Adam Giambrone, chair of the TTC. "The good news is ... we know that all the challenges are surmountable."

The approximately 30-kilometre Eglinton line, for example, was originally projected to cost $2.2-billion when first proposed in 2007.

Now, its estimated cost - which includes a 10-kilometre tunnel - has risen to $4.6-billion. The new figure is based on estimates from Metrolinx, the province's regional transportation agency.

Mr. Giambrone said the revised estimate now includes the costs of a carhouse to store the new fleet of vehicles, but could not spell out the other price increases.

Already, some are dreading the construction.

The TTC chairman said Eglinton's tunnel will be constructed with a mix of methods. Some of it will use underground boring machines, but other sections will use more disruptive, but cheaper, "cut and cover" - digging down from the surface.

Jordan Applebaum, chairman of the Eglinton Park Residents' Association, said the city must mitigate the effects of construction, especially as diverted traffic spills onto side streets.

"We will be looking to [the city] to make sure our side streets are safe," he said.

TTC engineers are also examining the needed overhaul for Kennedy Station at the new line's eastern end, and how the light-rail vehicles will thread their way through the many highway off-ramps around Pearson Airport to the west.

Meanwhile, the $1.2-billion, 23-kilometre Finch line from Highway 27 to Don Mills, which will run completely on the surface, has its own challenges.

TTC engineers have determined that a 36-metre-wide road is ideal when putting two light-rail tracks down the middle of a city street, separated from the traffic.

But from Bathurst to Yonge Street, Finch is just 30 metres wide, forcing the TTC and city staff to devise other designs, including considering widening the road "over time" to avoid snarling traffic.
 
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This false dichotomy of local vs. regional transit is infuriating. It's all one transit network and the people screaming for one at the expense of the other have no idea how a big city works.
 
Seemed to be as much a criticism of their own politicians for not standing up. What DOES Durham have on the table to be funded about from an east-west BRT? Though they should do well in the Lakeshore electrification ...

These communities aren't exactly the easiest ones to build higher-order transit - and make Mississauga look transit-friendly in comparison!
 
Oshawa (and to an extent, Whitby) were the only Durham municipalities with decent transit. Some of Oshawa's service was actually cut back after DRT. It has been taking DRT a long time to integrate and rationalize the route system - York and Waterloo Regions did it much quicker.
 
This false dichotomy of local vs. regional transit is infuriating. It's all one transit network and the people screaming for one at the expense of the other have no idea how a big city works.
I respectfully disagree. It should not take me longer to get from one side of downtown to the other, than it does for a 905er to take the train in from Oakville. There is nothing false about it, and the trend will only deteriorate the longer that Harper's Cons continue to shun urban centres like Toronto.
 
The dark days that gave us the Sheppard Subway and Highway 407 (A quick way across the GTA and used by thousands on Go Transit 407 routes)...
Oh, those were very dark days indeed :rolleyes:

Didn't they also dig a hole at eglinton then fill it back up?

If Dalton does lose in the next election he could always stage a coup *form a coalition. Is there anything comperable to the Governor General for Ontario? :p
 

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