[adma]

Ah, quiet down, will ya all

 

[DENTROBATE54]

^ Depictions like that also reinforce negative stereotypes. You know, just once I'd like some damn respect around here!

 

[Prometheus The Supremo]

sometimes i wonder.... whiteface?

 

[EnviroTO]

Of course if you break down my comments into stand-alone sentences as you've done many times now, when it takes the whole paragraph to get the whole fucking gist, scope and concept of said statement of course I'll sound like that.

Every sentence should mean something you can explain. Explain the concept of "overflowing with anonymity" in any context.

And now the world knows she's a 'nigger' and will probably get blacklisted from any future journalist outlets because she suddenly becomes the 'black problem' in their lily-white sometimes yellow corporations. Places where editorial self-manipulation of what's of news value allows their psychological predispositions about black issues to cloud their objectivity.

Are you for real?

Then they're even then. It still doesn't make the incident any less detrimental for a descendant of slaves and the segregated.

How do you know she is a descendant of the slaves or was ever segregated? Her family history might not include slavery or segregation. She could be an Ethiopian that came over recently.

Historical racism was done to harm the quality of life of blacks. Segregation by choice hopes to correct society's unfair treatment of the black community. We could sit on our hands and wait for the establishment to accomodate 'our' social concerns but since it's oh been 500 years of oppression, I think we're done waiting.

What are those social concerns that are not accommodated? How does segregation by choice end segregation? If whites choose to segregate themselves away from blacks is that segregation by choice as well?

By whose authority, the racist regime that'll invalidate a job candidate because they just happened to choose to attend an africentric aschool over dropping out altogether? What, we don't reward good work ethic, drive and initiative in this country anymore?

You can work as hard as you want but if the knowledge you gain and the products you create are not in demand you end up with nothing.

So they can remain wards of the state and welfare babies; in contrast to your bluebloods and trust fund brats?

It was you that stated the point of this school was to prevent dropping out and keeping these people out of trouble. If a Playstation 3 course is added to the curriculum because the students like the idea that will prevent them from dropping out and keep them out of trouble. What I am saying is that if the goal is not to teach them skills useful to the workforce or teach them what is useful in college or university then what is the point?

Only a bigoted mind would see africentricity as a negative.

Only a racist would choose segregation over multiculturalism. Only a bigoted mind would believe skin colour determines a person's likes and dislikes.

I guess you've missed the dozen or so times in the "TDSB ponders black-focused schools..." thread where I said the cirricula would only slightly variate from the regular system's.

If the curriculum varies so slightly why is a whole new school required? Existing schools already have elective courses.

No. I think society has. I think the negrophobes on this very website have.

Who are the negrophobes on this website? I haven't given up on them. I hope that they will return to school, study, get good grades, go to university, and join the workforce.

If you drop out of regular schools, you don't have the grades to go anywhere.

Of course. It doesn't matter what colour you are. If you drop out of school you don't have the grades to go anywhere.

This is the second chance at life, the unforgiving general system hasn't allotted other black dropouts up to this point and doesn't seem willing to rectify.

The doors of the education system are always open. At any time these students can report to summer school for a second chance or repeat the year for a second chance.

I interviewed my high-school aged associates and they in turn questioned their friends. The overwhelming feedback I got was positive and in favor of a better tomorrow for what was once uncertainty and paranoia.

You interviewed your friends asking whether they would prefer a better tomorrow?

See the difference when you actually give a fuck about the people you're defending, instead of backing a racist parking attendent who doesn't know you exist!?!

I'm fighting for honesty. This guy might be racist and if he is then I hate him for it. What I don't like is people jumping to the conclusion that racism exists where it might not.

Oh no problem, I know it takes time to come up with this number of brainfarts to hurl at innocent people trying to save other individuals from racism.

These aren't brainfarts. They are logical analysis of the facts and honest questions you seem to like to avoid giving straight answers to.

Making standardized cirricula more appealing to students, universally leads to better comprehension of course materials. I'm not even wasting time reading the rest of that.

I'm not surprised you are unwilling to read it but in case you change your mind I will post it again because it is important to this discussion:

The current curriculum in a normal school is set up with base courses that the ministry has determined are essential and then there are additional electives. If students don't want to learn English or French, math and science too bad for them because Canada requires people which have a basic understanding of these things. If you want to replace math with African crafts that doesn't create a useful graduate. If the only point is to replace one elective course with another that is something that can be done at the existing schools in the existing curriculum. I think it is pretty racist to say that because a person has dark skin there is no point preparing them for university, that they can't possibly be interested in the same things other students are, and that they automatically want to take an African history course.

Are you slow or what? That's when the genocide occured stupid. Go watch Don Cheadle's movie "Hotel Rwanda" for a history lesson.

I own the DVD and know all about Rwanda. Don Cheadle was great in that movie. White people weren't doing anything to blacks in that movie, or in reality, other than the white Canadians which were doing as much as they could under the rules the UN gave them. The Belgians relinquished control of the country in 1962 and a black government had run the show ever since. Your post stated what whites are "doing" in the "current day". The year 1995 might be recent but whites didn't do anything to blacks in 1995... the whole tragedy of Rwanda was that the UN or other nations did nothing. I guess you didn't understand it.

Anyone could of said "no, this is immoral" !

If everyone sought to be moral weapons meant to kill humans wouldn't exist at all. The official word from the gun lobby is "guns don't kill people, people kill people". Because guns are legal in so many countries around the world there is really no way to prevent a government from getting ahold of them.

Yes but black-on-black violence would wash the blood off your hands, now wouldn't it? Nothing sells by-lines like "whites are completely culpability free in the orchestration of this mass genocide," right?

I'm pretty sure there is no blood on my hands regardless. I'm pretty sure the genocide in Rwanda and Sudan was fully orchestrated by black people. The Germans and Belgians hold some responsibility for the position of power the Tutsi's had and the UN and countries of the world hold some responsibility for not stopping the genocide... this includes white, black, and other countries. The bulk of the responsibility though must be held on those who actually committed the crime.

Maybe that exists because every time blacks come at you people straight for justice and equality, you spit in their faces and tell them it's raining!

Sounds like you are saying spitting in someones face justifies racism. I've never spit in anyones face before. However, there was a reporter that called a parking attendant an a-hole. Not as bad as spitting in a face mind you.

Stupid is as stupid does. If he was any type of moral victim in this, he wouldn't have resorted to the dirtiest, lowest common denominator in the book. He could have told her respectfully to park somewhere else, case closed!

She could have refrained from escalating an impolite statement asking her to move her vehicle to obscenities. Case closed!

Someone did to me. I was minding my own fucking business and they came up into my face spewing "nigger".

I said "there aren't too many people walking down the street uttering unprovoked profanities at anyone". I didn't say there were none. You are saying someone called you a profanity... that doesn't sound like a large number which would indicate that a societal problem exists. That sounds more like a few individual wackos. Society can't be judged by the actions of a few individuals which don't represent even a small fraction of the population. I have had a car load of kids roll down their window and drive by yelling profanities as well but it doesn't happen often.

I never said it had to do with African studies. Can you not separate your bigotry from reason for one second to see the conversation has transitioned from that?

I'm not a bigot. Maybe you are. You have decided that blacks can't co-exist in a multicultural school. You have decided that blacks can't succeed with the curriculum all the other races are using. You have decided that non-blacks aren't good enough role models for blacks. You have decided that blacks are very different from other races.

I have said I want black students sitting next to my children in the same class. I have said blacks CAN succeed with the same curriculum. I have said that blacks aren't really different than any other race and saying one insult is no different than another. You want to differentiate based on race. I don't. That makes you sound more racist than me.

I was talking about support groups, a relatable voice that lived through similar experiences and survived racism themselves.

I support one-on-one support for people with low self esteem. That would include people who are bullied, people who have been picked on due to race, people who come from broken families, etc. You don't need a separate school for that.

Do you know what he looks like?

He is white, she is black.

His SIN card number? His home address? His phone number?

No, the only SIN number I know is my own... that doesn't make everyone else anonymous..

Do you know any identifible aspects about this person that'd stop him from future infractions against minorities?

His employer knows who he is and a quote in the paper shows other people expressing views about a person they know so he certainly isn't anonymous. Future infractions against minorities? You mean calling someone who happens to be a minority a bad name? No. I would imagine that he and she both will continue to call people bad names when agitated.

I wouldn't worry about any retaliation against your friend beyond a bleep-on-the-radar branding from the media that's less dehumanizing than branding he's committed.

He isn't my friend. He was called an asshole which is dehumanizing enough, and then he was called a racist without any analysis of whether or not it is true.

Treat us with respect, we're the nicest people on earth. Fuck with us, we give it back tenfold!

I think the white mantra is more along the lines we really don't expect respect. We understand we will be blamed for everything anyways because it is the easiest thing to do. If we prevent a crime we are not being fair to those apprehended, if we don't prevent a crime it is our fault for not stopping it.

She has learned that she can call white people any name she wants and if they respond with an insult she can claim racism and the media will listen.

As a journalist she's in aposition to do so. I couldn't complain to the police some 'human being' called me the N-word on a TTC bus. I'd be laughed out of the precinct or worse told my complexion made me worthy of such abuse!

Well name calling hasn't been made a crime yet as far as I know. If you actually think you can get a police officer on tape saying your complexion makes you worthy of abuse you should definitely do it because that is obvious racism. Racists need to be taught a lesson.

Consider the example she made out of him is justified for 500 years of oppression and lack of media presence for black social issues until very recently.

I don't think it works that way. There isn't enough evidence to say he is racist and he certainly can't be held responsible for over a century of oppression.

Everything I post you dissect into little fragemnts which stand alone might cause confusion. In response you've constantly called said comments "illogical". Do you live to embarass people for speaking their minds or are you that dim-witted you'd spend this much time setting up rhetorical questions you know I can't or rather, refuse to dignify with an answer?

I'm simply trying to get you to explain your sentences. I honestly can't figure out what you are trying to say sometimes. This part of the discussion comes from you saying your speech is eloquent and you bringing up a comparison between yourself and Darwin, Einstein, Malcolm X, Jesse Jackson, and Al Sharpton because your use of the language might make you seem looney. My response was that there is no comparison because people understood what they were saying.

You replied:

My point was none of those figures, apart from the last two, were universally accepted and praised while they were still alive.

Which I found funny because you use the word none or never in your sentences far too much to describe something that is definitely not none or never. In the case of this sentence you said none and then added a condition which removed 40% of the people you were talking about. That is like saying nobody voted Liberal in the last federal election, except for 31% of the population.

From that you then went on to post:

Darwin. Einstein. X. Jackson. Sharpton. The last two obviously aren't dead yet. Had I not made the distinction you would've said I'm illogical because the last two are still alive.

Why would I think that you are illogical because two of the five are still alive? That doesn't make sense. I'm sorry for the fact I find you using advanced vocabulary and false logic as funny.

You sir are.

No. I'm not. I am analyzing your sentences as well as the points they contain and pointing out their flaws or the points I disagree with. You on the other hand have admitted to using an "enigmatic language".

Unlike you, I take people's advice, respect their opinions and make accomodations in order for everyone to get along.

What advice has been offered to me? I respect everyones opinions even though I don't necessarily agree with them. You have called me a number of names. That doesn't sound like like respect and accommodations to me. I can quote something from almost every post you have made which is disrespectful.

You said to dumb it down into a ready-made, easily-accessable lingua franca I did it. You on the other hand have been a greater foil on my side than even that troll that keeps pestering me.

OK. I promise not make light things you have said in earlier posts from now on if you promise to keep you sentences clear and concise. The truth is there are things you post which don't make sense even if there might be a point that made sense that you were trying to convey. The reason I kept repeating your quote is because you aren't admitting it made no sense and instead you try and say whoever can't understand it is an idiot. Rather than admit it makes no sense you go on to say it is eloquent.

 

[adma]

^ Depictions like that also reinforce negative stereotypes. You know, just once I'd like some damn respect around here!

But it's a true cartoon masterpiece--and more reverent than it appears.

Whatever your racial identity, you're as much of a wimp as the sappiest 70s singer-songwriters--come to think of it, Dan Hill is black, too...

 

[TKTKTK]

Eh, getting all fussed over racial identity is so 20th Century:

http://revver.com/video/518749/black-women-love-us/

 

[Steve_D]

You know, just once I'd like some damn respect around here!

Respect is something you earn. I'm not really surprised that you don't know that.

 

[theowne]

&BigD

And now the world knows she's a 'nigger' and will probably get blacklisted from any future journalist outlets because she suddenly becomes the 'black problem' in their lily-white sometimes yellow corporations.

Um, no. You know sometimes I can sympathize with your arguments until you go all crazy like this. We're not in Alabama, come on.

Only a bigoted mind would see africentricity as a negative.

Er...only a bigot would oppose segregation of a certain kind of people because of their race? You'll have to explain that one to me...

 

[DENTROBATE54]

But it's a true cartoon masterpiece--and more reverent than it appears.

Whatever your racial identity, you're as much of a wimp as the sappiest 70s singer-songwriters--come to think of it, Dan Hill is black, too...

What was the point of posting that link if even it demonstrates that blacks before me found it offensive and advocated to have it removed from public view. That you'd be so fecicious to dig that up to post here just to offend me says alot more about your character than mine, wimp or no wimp !

Eh, getting all fussed over racial identity is so 20th Century: http://revver.com/video/518749/black-women-love-us/

I also found "White Chicks" tacky, unfunny and offensive too. If those women found didn't get that they were being ridiculed, then that's their problem. I'm not telling people what they should do but it'd be nice to know I'm not alone in fighting systematic bigotry, while the rest of you are desensitized to the suffering.

Respect is something you earn. I'm not really surprised that you don't know that.

Coming from you that's rich. You've never one day said one thing to me worthy of my affections, countenance and least of all respect. In fact, if you had any self-respect at all you wouldn't continually jump into threads I'm in just to post slanderous remarks about me. (Everyone I encourage you to backtrack Steve_D's history on UT to see for yourselves what I mean).

&BigD

Um, no. You know sometimes I can sympathize with your arguments until you go all crazy like this. We're not in Alabama, come on.

Er...only a bigot would oppose segregation of a certain kind of people because of their race? You'll have to explain that one to me...

Big D, I like that !

Um, no. We're not in Detroit. It's not like a significant number of the population would be leaving the public school system for an experimental program that might be shelved anyway if preformances don't improve. My point is, we should at least give it a try, when so far public schools have been periless in the fight to stop underachieving black dropouts.

As for potential harm to the journalist's career. Yes it's a very likely posibility she put her neck and career on the line to expose this individual. Her selfless act should be commended and praised, not nailed to the cross!

---
Oh and Enviro, don't think I've forgotten about you. We'll hash it all out tomorrow !

 

[theowne]

My point is, we should at least give it a try, when so far public schools have been periless in the fight to stop underachieving black dropouts.

But WHY do we need a school to focus on BLACK dropouts?? Are you saying that black people are somehow separate from all others and need some kind of special need? Why not just create schools for struggling students and cater to the needs of struggling students? I don't get why it has to be a "black" thing. Struggling students are struggling students. Who's going to choose students for these schools, and how? Are you going to go to a class, see the kids who are failing their classes, and then tell the non-black people to sit down and take the black students long with them. Why? What's the point?

The problem is the idiotic "gangsta" culture and that's what we need to target. That's what makes kids feel like they should dropout and that grades aren't important and that fighting and "busting rhymes" or whatever is the cool thing to do. And I seriously believe that it's the biggest problem.

As for potential harm to the journalist's career. Yes it's a very likely posibility she put her neck and career on the line to expose this individual. Her selfless act should be commended and praised, not nailed to the cross!

What does that even mean? Are you saying that no one knew she was black until this guy called her a ni=/er? I think they noticed, they just didn't care.

 

[TKTKTK]

I also found "White Chicks" tacky, unfunny and offensive too. If those women found didn't get that they were being ridiculed, then that's their problem. I'm not telling people what they should do but it'd be nice to know I'm not alone in fighting systematic bigotry, while the rest of you are desensitized to the suffering.

They're not being ridiculed, they're being celebrated! Ironically celebrated, perhaps, but essentially in the same spirit that all drag is offered up in.

If you think this is systematic bigotry and suffering than you are wrong. Simple.

 

[TKTKTK]

when so far public schools have been periless in the fight to stop underachieving black dropouts.

What? Public schools have been without peril (danger) in the 'fight' to stop underachieving black dropouts.? Have been full of peril? Have fought perilously? What do you mean?

As for potential harm to the journalist's career. Yes it's a very likely posibility she put her neck and career on the line to expose this individual. Her selfless act should be commended and praised, not nailed to the cross!

"Very likely posibility [sic]"? Based on your knowledge of what? Your years of experience in the media? Have you ever even been inside a newsroom? Ever ACTUALLY seen how news is assembled, and by whom? Ever talked face to face with an editor? Your conspiratorial imaginings are nothing to base arguments on.

You don't know what you're talking about, but still you're pretty sure she's a victim - and only because you know she's black?!

 

[DENTROBATE54]

But WHY do we need a school to focus on BLACK dropouts?? Are you saying that black people are somehow separate from all others and need some kind of special need? Why not just create schools for struggling students and cater to the needs of struggling students? I don't get why it has to be a "black" thing. Struggling students are struggling students. Who's going to choose students for these schools, and how? Are you going to go to a class, see the kids who are failing their classes, and then tell the non-black people to sit down and take the black students long with them. Why? What's the point?

The problem is the idiotic "gangsta" culture and that's what we need to target. That's what makes kids feel like they should dropout and that grades aren't important and that fighting and "busting rhymes" or whatever is the cool thing to do. And I seriously believe that it's the biggest problem.

It wasn't me who said it had to be blacks but rather based on government sanctioned statisitics that prove people of Afro-Canadian background are four times more likely to dropout than their white/Asian couterparts. Four times! That africentricity part comes in precisely to offer a counter-culture to the one perpetuated by white media outlets using black mug-shots for target practice in the nightly news headlines. It's to counter the "Gangsta/bust a rhymes" BET/CHUM/MTV depictions of illiterate, Ebonic-speaking blacks who engage in low-life behaviour. I have to believe the vast majority of black people in society are not that and wish to not see future generations of blacks become that.

That's how this school hopes to turn around lives and create better tomorrows. It could happen in the current system but its not. Any typical multicultural high school in Toronto, can start out at grade 9 with 900 students, a third of which can be black. By grade 12 only 6 will graduate. Of that 6, maybe one will survive university and enter a career with certain job security. How many of the grade 7 white/Asians successfully climbed up the same ladder?

You all might think I'm racist, but something's just not right with that picture and it does need to change, by any means necessary!!

What does that even mean? Are you saying that no one knew she was black until this guy called her a ni=/er? I think they noticed, they just didn't care.

Job resumes don't carry photo I.D. Someone can hire you over the phone then meet you in person and change their minds. Her name is permanently attached to this article and anyone can google that info and form preconceived notions that she's a liability for standing up for herself and doing the right thing, no matter the cost to her livelihood. If only we all could be that fearless !

They're not being ridiculed, they're being celebrated! Ironically celebrated, perhaps, but essentially in the same spirit that all drag is offered up in.

Okay, I'll give you that one. It was still lame though IMO, as my preference is dark humour ! Periless? I'll give you that one too. It was a typo, I meant to say 'powerless'. What are you, Enviro-lite?

 

[EnviroTO]

We're not in Detroit. It's not like a significant number of the population would be leaving the public school system for an experimental program that might be shelved anyway if preformances don't improve. My point is, we should at least give it a try, when so far public schools have been periless in the fight to stop underachieving black dropouts.

Detroit is an interesting example. In Detroit non-black residents voluntarily segregated to the suburbs leaving black people in control of everything. You seem to support voluntary segregation while I am completely against it. I look at what has happened in Detroit since and it doesn't seem like a shining example that we should aspire to. The cities who have supported gentrification projects seemed to have faired far better in maintaining a vibrant city and reducing racial tensions.

Why try segregation of all things? Why try splitting up the population based on race? The reason we shouldn't try it is that feeding the idea that blacks are different from everyone else does the opposite of making them equals. Instead of getting the education system to say: "Hey you are one of us. Let us help you out." we are getting them to say: "Hey, you're black! Do you want to go to black school and learn black stuff?". That doesn't seem like a good solution to remove the "black" label.

 

[adma]

What was the point of posting that link if even it demonstrates that blacks before me found it offensive and advocated to have it removed from public view. That you'd be so fecicious to dig that up to post here just to offend me says alot more about your character than mine, wimp or no wimp !

If you're the sort to seriously side with those advocating to have it removed from public view, altogether, well...racial identity is no substitute for cultural philistinism.

"Sometimes, when we touch...
The honesty's too much..."