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Admiral Beez said:
Speed isn't really the issue here, IMO. If I hit you at 50 kph or 70 kph, you're dead either way. I'm not saying skip the speed cameras, but what we ALSO need is enforcement of the non-speed related traffic offences, such as:
  1. Running red lights (at every light, not just a few)
  2. Turning right at red lights without first stopping to clear pedestrians, cyclists or traffic.
  3. Running through flashing pedestrian and school guard crossings
  4. Running pass open streetcars and flashing school buses
  5. Slow rolling through stop signs (use camera to enforce)
  6. Illegal and unsafe u-turns (much worse now with uber and lyft)
  7. Going the wrong way on residential streets (I see this at least a half dozen times a month in Cabbagetown)
  8. Parking on sidewalks (damn Amazon chumps and the like)
  9. Parking or even driving in bike lanes
  10. Illegal parking blocking rush hour lanes
I'm all for using police state technology to catch and fine people for any of the ten above, in addition to speeding and the ubiquitous dangerous driving and DUI.
Click to expand...
In Europe, where Vision Plan started out, they are slowly doing away with useless stop signs (replaced with yield signs and painted shark's teeth on the roadway). They replaced them with raised intersections and raised crosswalks, which force the motorists to open their eyes and slow down. The speed humps in the middle of blocks are also useless, should be replaced with road chokers.
tceprimer67.jpg
From link.

tceprimer79.jpg
 
vic said:
At 50 you'll have a somewhat better chance of seeing, reacting to, slowing down for, and possibly avoiding the person you're about to hit.
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I’m hitting you at 50 kph because I’m looking at my phone or otherwise distracted, and won’t likely be seeing or reacting to you until you’re under my bumper.
 
Admiral Beez said:
I’m hitting you at 50 kph because I’m looking at my phone or otherwise distracted, and won’t likely be seeing or reacting to you until you’re under my bumper.
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At 70, you're driving too fast to notice until it's too late. At 50, there's time for pedestrian/driver to GTFO.
 
TRONto said:
Does anyone outside Toronto and the old part of cities need to know how to parallel park? I think most drivers could easily go through 5 years without parallel parking once.
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This test shows the manoeuvring abilities of the potential motorists. Some people don't turn the steering wheel all the way to get through tight obstacles. Seen that with right or left turns, where the motorists end up in the extreme lane (IE. making a left turn and end up in the right lane after the turn).

mhl3rkcexk051.jpg
From link.
 
TRONto said:
Does anyone outside Toronto and the old part of cities need to know how to parallel park? I think most drivers could easily go through 5 years without parallel parking once.
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Lots of smaller communities still have on street parking.

The bigger issue is testing the ability to manoeuver in close quarters and while backing up, which is important just about everywhere. (everywhere there’s a parking lot, anyways). Really, that skill needs to be in place by the G2 point as even a novice driver will do that regularly. Parallel parking tests are just a proxy for that.

As I understand the G test, it’s there to test higher speed and highway driving. And simply to create a graduated learning curve that is really just a probationary period. Lots of smaller-community test centers are nowhere near a 400 highway and don’t test freeway skills. That’s a huge deficit.

There is some sense to not retesting previously demonstrated skills that are “cornerstones”.

Having said that, parallel parking and backing require regular practice or the skill is lost. It’s not a “learn once and never forget” proposition. And it can be vehicle specific - different dimensions, wheel base, etc.

I’m not sure I agree with “licensed for life”. But I’m not sure the G2-G progression helps much with that, or with anything else.


- Paul
 
W. K. Lis said:
This test shows the manoeuvring abilities of the potential motorists. Some people don't turn the steering wheel all the way to get through tight obstacles. Seen that with right or left turns, where the motorists end up in the extreme lane (IE. making a left turn and end up in the right lane after the turn).

mhl3rkcexk051.jpg
From link.
Click to expand...
This seems more realistic:
1641925035023.png
 
I'll submit that banning right turn on red would do more for pedestrian safety in Ontario (and Toronto) than most other measures. A trip to Montreal in the summer was quite the eyeopener. I didn't have to worry at every single intersection as a runner that I was about to get run down by an impatient right turning driver rolling the red light looking left to see if they could roll right into the turn.
 
https://twitter.com/x/status/1480938845826863117

Is a community safety zone still a zone if it covers half the city?

Councils are increasingly abusing community safety zones and speed cameras if you ask me. The province designed the legislation on them for them to be placed in key locations with high sensitivity to speeding like school zones, high pedestrian areas, etc., but failed to realize that municipalities can designate literally any street they want as a community safety zone for no reason whatsoever.. so now they are getting placed on suburban arterials, rural sideroads, etc.

If Toronto wants to designate the entire city as a massive safety zone perhaps they should be talking to the province about simply just increasing speeding fines instead.. it's abusing the legislative tools and their intents to try and pull something like this.
 
To be fair, most streets in those three ridings (and a few others) are high pedestrian areas relative to most streets in the province.
 
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