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Had a couple minutes and quickly drew in paint an idea for how to fix the intersection of Bow Trail Westbound, 9th Ave. Eastbound and 14th St. West... I just got back from Europe where I noticed they do something there I hadn't thought of; they integrate a single roundabout into interchanges... not like we do with the Flanders thing. So here we go:

Green lines on the map are roads at grade, blue is above grade and brown is below grade. I'll include a cross section that hopefully isn't too confusing.

Quick explanation is that I hate this section of road so I wanted to find a better way. I think traffic circles are efficient when there isn't one or two directions that dominate it. A lot of what's there actually stays the same; Bow Trail is Westbound traffic only and goes under 14th St. West, 9th Ave Eastbound traffic only and goes over 14th St. West, and there are no traffic lights involved so traffic still free-flows through the area.

What I've changed is I've ran 14th St. West right through the roundabout, but still given drivers on 14th, 9th and Bow ramps to access the roundabout. The roundabout is at grade so the south portion goes over 14th while the north portion goes under it. I even added a local access road off the roundabout for what businesses are there now and hopefully the development that will fill the area whenever the soil gets remediated. I think with the local access road you could eliminate all the entrances and exits off of 9th Ave and Bow Trail to the adjacent properties (excluding the ones just south of 9th Ave.

I'm obviously no expert, what you can't tell by the paint drawing, but this is better than what's there now isn't it? You could even build up the roundabout to be level with 9th Ave. and have 14th St. go right under it before it has to go over Bow Trail and the Bow River? Then you could stick some art in the middle of it (everyone's favourite).

WestCircle.png


Here's the cross section
WestCircle_CrossSection.png

This isn't and won't ever be a big LA-style intersection of major roads (I think I maintained go flow and still gave drivers access to go from say 9th Ave to Eastbound to 14th St. westbound if they wanted), so I don't think you need some big interchange but maybe I'm wrong...
 
darwink said:
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Or you just save a boatload of money and slow down the traffic on Bow Trail, like in the approved 2010 plan:
View attachment 419451
Click to expand...
You had that in holster! What's going on with the 14th here? I see its an Urban Boulevard but is it above grade, below grade? On Bow trail it looks like there a median straight through it so there's no way its at grade?
 
In relation to the eventual creosote cleanup, I'd rather see EB Bow Trail more aligned to the north and flowing into 5th ave; WB would flow more out of 4th Ave (moreso than 6th ave as currently). 4th and 5th effectively flow to/from Memorial on the east side.

Bow Tr could be trenched with a flood barrier and linear park/pathway on the north side and several ped crossings. Probably would need to be a cut/cover tunnel from around 11 St to 8 St, which would allow more space for the pathway and eliminate a conflict with the red line.

6th and 9th become the urban boulevards to/from West Village, but still with Bow Tr entrance/exits on the west side. West Village wouldn't be a rush hour hell-hole this way.
 
lemongrab said:
In relation to the eventual creosote cleanup, I'd rather see EB Bow Trail more aligned to the north and flowing into 5th ave; WB would flow more out of 4th Ave (moreso than 6th ave as currently). 4th and 5th effectively flow to/from Memorial on the east side.

Bow Tr could be trenched with a flood barrier and linear park/pathway on the north side and several ped crossings. Probably would need to be a cut/cover tunnel from around 11 St to 8 St, which would allow more space for the pathway and eliminate a conflict with the red line.

6th and 9th become the urban boulevards to/from West Village, but still with Bow Tr entrance/exits on the west side. West Village wouldn't be a rush hour hell-hole this way.
Click to expand...
Sorta like this?:
1660172992592.png
 
That's fair - I know it isn't a particularly risky spot, but I'd rather avoid new development near a flood plain...weather seems to be getting more extreme so I don't think it's crazy to think about the 1:1000 flood plain. Amazingly, a lot of WV would be safe even from that...but taking an even higher level view I wonder if that land should have a different use altogether: flood protection and public-use park space/tourist attraction.

We know EV needs to build out before development in WV, but I think there is still a ton of space to build up Downtown-West (officially 14th St to 9th St between river and 9 Ave, but of course there are open lots further east, especially just south of Eau Claire). Otherwise the west half of DT will be a bit of a zombie zone separating the main part of DT from WV...

I'd redevelop most of Shaganappi Golf Course to a TOD sooner than later (less concern about cannibalization of EV) and turn WV into more of a green space...something between Dale Hodges Park and Gardens By the Bay in Singapore...ideally something better suited to 4 seasons in CGY (selfishly I'd love to see XC skiing that would be lost from Shag). It is possible to dream pretty big considering the scale of the creosote clean-up and amount of earth that will be moved in the process.

Of course back to the OP that could mean just about anything for Bow Tr
 
lemongrab said:
That's fair - I know it isn't a particularly risky spot, but I'd rather avoid new development near a flood plain...weather seems to be getting more extreme so I don't think it's crazy to think about the 1:1000 flood plain. Amazingly, a lot of WV would be safe even from that...but taking an even higher level view I wonder if that land should have a different use altogether: flood protection and public-use park space/tourist attraction.

We know EV needs to build out before development in WV, but I think there is still a ton of space to build up Downtown-West (officially 14th St to 9th St between river and 9 Ave, but of course there are open lots further east, especially just south of Eau Claire). Otherwise the west half of DT will be a bit of a zombie zone separating the main part of DT from WV...

I'd redevelop most of Shaganappi Golf Course to a TOD sooner than later (less concern about cannibalization of EV) and turn WV into more of a green space...something between Dale Hodges Park and Gardens By the Bay in Singapore...ideally something better suited to 4 seasons in CGY (selfishly I'd love to see XC skiing that would be lost from Shag). It is possible to dream pretty big considering the scale of the creosote clean-up and amount of earth that will be moved in the process.

Of course back to the OP that could mean just about anything for Bow Tr
Click to expand...
What I wonder is how long this can go untouched. All that's left is car dealerships, Metro already left downtown for TAZA. If the remaining downtown dealerships leave this could sit empty for decades. Are owners of the land able to do anything with it, or as soon as you want to turn soil do you have to clean it up?
 
AFAIK city owns most (maybe all?) of the affected land. I am curious how much revenue they are getting out of it (and Shag Golf Course for that matter).

The city was pursuing legal action against Domtar, but it seems like its been years now of radio silence.

It seems like we are decades away from residential/commercial development catalyzing anything, but maybe there are some different ideas could spark action and draw federal/provincial support much sooner? CGY has some great parkland, but nothing central remotely close to Stanley Park, Mont-Royal, Central Park, etc. Even Parc La Fontaine in MTL is twice as big as PIP, and it's MTL's 4th largest urban park after Mont Royal and the two islands.

When in doubt, build green space.
 
CalgaryTiger said:
What I wonder is how long this can go untouched. All that's left is car dealerships, Metro already left downtown for TAZA. If the remaining downtown dealerships leave this could sit empty for decades. Are owners of the land able to do anything with it, or as soon as you want to turn soil do you have to clean it up?
Click to expand...
The GM dealership (formerly GSL, now Wolfe) is on its way out already. Their new location will be Old Banff Coach Road and 101 Street SW:

DMAP

developmentmap.calgary.ca

In terms of Shaganappi Golf Course, I think I recall hearing somewhere that when that land was donated to the City, it was under the condition that it was always to be a golf course, so not sure if it can be redeveloped. Not 100% sure though.
 
lemongrab said:
AFAIK city owns most (maybe all?) of the affected land. I am curious how much revenue they are getting out of it (and Shag Golf Course for that matter).

The city was pursuing legal action against Domtar, but it seems like its been years now of radio silence.

It seems like we are decades away from residential/commercial development catalyzing anything, but maybe there are some different ideas could spark action and draw federal/provincial support much sooner? CGY has some great parkland, but nothing central remotely close to Stanley Park, Mont-Royal, Central Park, etc. Even Parc La Fontaine in MTL is twice as big as PIP, and it's MTL's 4th largest urban park after Mont Royal and the two islands.

When in doubt, build green space.
Click to expand...
If the City and CMLC didn't have EV and Victoria Park I assume this is where those efforts would go. Until those are done or they can at least see the light at the end of their tunnel (2040?), I don't think they spend one second thinking about this.

East Village is actually where they should've built the massive city centre park. Its where the two rivers meet, you have Fort Calgary (or what's left of it), St. Patrick's Island, the Zoo, a future Culture and Entertainment District. Condo development was already happening on the west side of downtown. They didn't spur any more development by creating EV, they actually stole it from the west side of downtown, at least IMO. Imagine all the EV condos in the west.
 
MichaelS said:
The GM dealership (formerly GSL, now Wolfe) is on its way out already. Their new location will be Old Banff Coach Road and 101 Street SW:

DMAP

developmentmap.calgary.ca

In terms of Shaganappi Golf Course, I think I recall hearing somewhere that when that land was donated to the City, it was under the condition that it was always to be a golf course, so not sure if it can be redeveloped. Not 100% sure though.
Click to expand...
Yikes, Wolfe is leaving. This is going to be a problem sooner than later.

What about a Mini or Frisbee Golf Course... wonder if that would fulfill the agreement?
 
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