gristle
Senior Member
It's their own fault at the end of the day? In absolutely every instance?
What idiocy.
What idiocy.
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- Thread starter T-Bor
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adma
Superstar
Here's some subversion. Wear this to a Ford rally
dt_toronto_geek
Superstar
I live in 51 Division, on a weekday evening the whole division only has 8 vehicles on the road. That's enough officers? Residents here wait hours during the day if there's a car break-in or minor crime on the property, at night forget it - we're on our own.
On another matter, Ford's director of communications, Adrienne Batra, clarified Ford's stance on gay marriage, saying that the Etobicoke North councillor has clearly acknowledged his belief in a traditional, heterosexual definition of marriage. Further, regarding events like Pride he believes that the City should not be funding parades.
tkip
Active Member
Funny you should this because earlier today on the radio, Jerry Agar was debating with Helen Kennedy on her stance that since Rob Ford believes in traditional marriage between men and women that he's unfit to be mayor of the city and it was such hypocritical bullshit that came out of her mouth.
Mostly because she kept ranting about how we can't have a mayor that doesn't represent all people from all walks of life (which is simply impossible and impractical) and since he believes in traditional marriage, she personally doesn't want him to be mayor because she said he was unfit and a threat to human rights. Absolute nonsense and his belief in traditional marriage has nothing to do with running the city and delivering services.
But her own intolerance really shined when she refused to respect the difference of opinions, views and beliefs of others in the population that differ from her own and wants people that hold such views to be brought down and silenced. Pure hypocrisy and shows she's something of a bully herself. She was actually quite belligerent on the air and tried her best to shout everyone down.
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GraphicMatt
Looking forward to a FRESH START for Toronto
Politics is about character. Belief in only 'traditional marriage' is the stuff of backwards, spiteful and small-minded people. Not fit for the job. Not by a long shot.
Fresh Start
Banned
Well that sure ain’t Rocco Rossi, whom on his website says he would not implement a hiring freeze on police, fire, EMS services: http://roccorossi.com/speeches/let-this-be-our-last-budget-crisis-2/
Sorry. Try again.
Are you focused on this one issue, or on several issues?
"$100,000 is a lot of money for the average person. But if it's ensuring public safety, then it's worth it." - Joe Pantalone
http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/cri...2--toronto-police-100k-club-continues-to-grow
So who are you going to assign blame on for Pantalone's support of police operating budget?
Police Chief Bill Blair made the most of anyone on the force, $270,052.59. Deputy chiefs Kim Derry, Keith Forde and Anthony Warr were next with salaries of $199,361.05, followed by Deputy Chief Jane Dick, who earned $185,729.81. Mr. Pugash earned $148,117.35. As you can see, the waste actually starts from the top down.
Frontline beat cops in Toronto are already asked to work rotating shifts and are regularly scheduled to work 7 days in a row without any extra pay for it. Imagine how hours and shifts like that would impact on your family life. Not to mention the fact that they are asked to go into the situations we all run away from.
So crime has been going down since we started hiring more police officers, don't we want that trend to continue?
Lorne Gunter wrote a good column concerning skepticism of 'falling' crime rates. He makes the point that this may really be the result of falling rates of crime reporting (not that this justifies ever higher policing and a growing surveillance state). I might add that the falling proportion of the population comprised of youth (the most crime-disposed portion of the population) may also have something to do with the trend. If we were to divide the crime rate by the youngest portion of the population over various time points, we might not have such a flattering graph. Even with just reported crime, it's still higher than in the 1960s.
The Toronto Police Service has requested $896 million in funding this year, up from $854 million in 2009. Meanwhile however, the TTC is looking for a seven per cent boost to its already $1.3-billion operating budget. 74%-82% of their operating budget goes towards workers’ salaries. Which is the bigger scourge on society, the $100k per annum ticket booth collector getting paid to just sit there and stare into space half the time; or those whom everyday go out there risking their lives on our behalf?
Furthermore the TPS is already scaling back its spending, with police bosses lowering the annual budget requests from $896.2 million to $892.2 million, according to the Toronto Police Services Board. $4 million in savings came from reductions in medical and dental benefits, maintenance and utilities, vehicle and equipment spending, sick pay contributions, city charges for janitorial and custodial services and delays in hiring civilians. And this past March the TPSB held public forum sessions to see where an additional $5.9 million in savings could be made.
Government over-spending impoverishes cities and damages our economies while driving up costs needlessly. The era of endless ongoing government spending to provide jobs has surely finally been recognized for the prosperity killer it is. A few capital projects are fine to build infrastructure, but beyond that government sucks at least 1.5 jobs out of the economy for every govt. job created. By funding organizations which should be able to carry themselves, such as the CBC (federal waste of $1B/yr) and city transit ticket-takers earning $100,000 a year while simple machines can sell tickets, shows true contempt for Canadians. However to single out police enforcement in isolation when there’s many other municipal divisions out of 55,000 workers that easily could be downsized, makes it seem like you have a vendetta against public safety and security.
Fresh Start
Banned
The majority of Canadians support traditional marriage and as law abiding citizens tolerate the gay community. Many don't agree with my lifestyle choice but it is the law. It is a federal law, not a provincial law or a local bylaw. Once it's made law it cannot be overturned. Ford has no jurisdiction over the matter, but to condemn the man over and over again for being a free-thinker and not compromise his beliefs in a bid to curry favor votes, even at the risk of further alienating himself from the mainstream consensus, says a lot more about your own character than his.
GenerationW
Senior Member
Oh right, that tipped the scales for you to decide not to vote for him.
Did you miss the earlier posts with links to poll results showing that the majority of Canadians support same-sex marriage?
AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
FS:
Oh really, once something is made law it cannot be overturned? History isn't littered with examples of rights being taken away - and some communities paid a VERY high price for making that errorenous assumption. Besides, if one doesn't respect the spirit of the law, how likely are they to uphold it when given any opening NOT to?
Interestingly, the very fact you called it "lifestyle choice" is telling, no? I don't know about YOUR homosexuality, but mine certainly wasn't a "lifestyle choice". I am curious as to where you picked that lingo up from.
Nice try - but just how many Chiefs and Deputy Chiefs are there in the TPS? That's like RF accounting all over again - pick on numbers that sounds outrageous (if that) but missing the big picture as always.
Correlation (if that) vs. causation. And if you are too lazy to track down and post that article by Lorne Gunter, here it is: http://www.edmontonjournal.com/opin...factors/3320593/story.html?cid=megadrop_story
So yes, assuming that crime rate is linked to demographics, they shouldn't police spending be tied to it also? Surely, someone who is a proponent of rationality would come to that conclusion no?
Now let me do some correlation of my own - I wonder how crime rates correlated with oh, say the degree of income disparity in the society, especially compared to the good old 60s? Or on that matter, the degree of extreme poverty.
They have always been working rotating shifts - and regularly scheduled to work 7 days in a row without extra pay? The union won't have anything to say about THAT, right. If anyone doesn't like those hours and shifts - they don't have to take up the job - surely, working as a police officer is a choice, no?
You made it sound as if the 7% boost in budget goes directly into the salaries of existing workers - but of course, we all know where you stand on expanding service. And why shouldn't the TTC have a large operating budget, considering a) 80% is recouped from fares and b) the number of passenger trips it services per year? Perhaps you should also inform me what portion of the police budget is a) recouped from the service users beyond the property tax and b) also goes into salaries...
Not that I like the idea of ticket collectors, but to put things into perspective - just how many ticket collectors actually get 100K per year?
Since we're getting all nostalgic concerning crime and all, we should consider the relationship between say, the increasing role of the state and the growing economy between what the 40s and 60s. I wonder why you didn't comment about THAT.
AoD
Oh really, once something is made law it cannot be overturned? History isn't littered with examples of rights being taken away - and some communities paid a VERY high price for making that errorenous assumption. Besides, if one doesn't respect the spirit of the law, how likely are they to uphold it when given any opening NOT to?
Interestingly, the very fact you called it "lifestyle choice" is telling, no? I don't know about YOUR homosexuality, but mine certainly wasn't a "lifestyle choice". I am curious as to where you picked that lingo up from.
Nice try - but just how many Chiefs and Deputy Chiefs are there in the TPS? That's like RF accounting all over again - pick on numbers that sounds outrageous (if that) but missing the big picture as always.
Correlation (if that) vs. causation. And if you are too lazy to track down and post that article by Lorne Gunter, here it is: http://www.edmontonjournal.com/opin...factors/3320593/story.html?cid=megadrop_story
So yes, assuming that crime rate is linked to demographics, they shouldn't police spending be tied to it also? Surely, someone who is a proponent of rationality would come to that conclusion no?
Now let me do some correlation of my own - I wonder how crime rates correlated with oh, say the degree of income disparity in the society, especially compared to the good old 60s? Or on that matter, the degree of extreme poverty.
They have always been working rotating shifts - and regularly scheduled to work 7 days in a row without extra pay? The union won't have anything to say about THAT, right. If anyone doesn't like those hours and shifts - they don't have to take up the job - surely, working as a police officer is a choice, no?
You made it sound as if the 7% boost in budget goes directly into the salaries of existing workers - but of course, we all know where you stand on expanding service. And why shouldn't the TTC have a large operating budget, considering a) 80% is recouped from fares and b) the number of passenger trips it services per year? Perhaps you should also inform me what portion of the police budget is a) recouped from the service users beyond the property tax and b) also goes into salaries...
Not that I like the idea of ticket collectors, but to put things into perspective - just how many ticket collectors actually get 100K per year?
Since we're getting all nostalgic concerning crime and all, we should consider the relationship between say, the increasing role of the state and the growing economy between what the 40s and 60s. I wonder why you didn't comment about THAT.
AoD
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OttoSchloss
Active Member
You lost me at "lifestyle choice".
AlvinofDiaspar
Moderator
OS:
Indeed. What kind of self-respecting faggot is he?
As to the matter of his character - well, I am saying it again - ill-informed, foul-mouthed obnoxious bullying, denial, apologize under duress, touchy-feeling "I am getting better", I am "human" retort. Rinse, repeat when controversy arise. THAT's his character.
AoD
Indeed. What kind of self-respecting faggot is he?
As to the matter of his character - well, I am saying it again - ill-informed, foul-mouthed obnoxious bullying, denial, apologize under duress, touchy-feeling "I am getting better", I am "human" retort. Rinse, repeat when controversy arise. THAT's his character.
AoD
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Asterix
Active Member
It'd be also of relevance to see how many hours those 100k collectors are working.
Say someone had been a unionized employee for the last 25 years and was up to a $30/hr salary.
At 40 hrs/wk * 52 wks that is $62.4k/yr. But some of these collectors are reported as working huge overtime. Let's say our 25 year veteran is working 20 hours/wk overtime at time and a half (do they get double? more for working at statutory?). 20 hrs/wk * 50wks *$45/hr = $45k/yr.
Total pay is now $62.4k + $45k = 107.4k and we have a $100k collector.
Tewder
Senior Member
I caught that interview too and didn't find her to be 'ranting' or belligerent at all, and quite the opposite in fact. It was Jerry who would barely let her get a word in edgewise and explain her point of view which presumably is why he had her on his show in the first place. The truly belligerent individuals were Jerry and Sue-Anne Levy who was nothing short of insulting, quite frankly.
If you managed to hear the viewpoint of Helen Kennedy over the rantings and ravings of the other two it was simply that she believes in a separation of religion and state (which is sort of fundamentally what we're about in N. America after all, no?) and that religious belief should never trump basic rights, no matter how much of a 'majority' any one religious belief may represent. The fact that Ford has a belief system is not a problem - we all do - but that he voiced or espoused one while running for office is unacceptable. The mayor is elected and paid for his/her ability to serve all citizens regardless of perspective. Quite simply, his comments call into question his judgement and his ability to do this. In the context of previous comments he has made this is not an unreasonable doubt.
Redroom Studios
Senior Member
Rob Ford = major tool.
that video at the top of the page where he discusses his opinion on bike lanes is an embarrassment. I actually feel embarrassed that I live in the same country with this guy and his kind of mentality. Besides the fact that his view on bike lanes is neanderthal, he is actually completely erroneous in what he is trying to point out. Doing away with bike lanes does not eliminate bike traffic. Infact his supposed concern for the safety of cyclists mingling with automobile traffic is completely false because the point of bike lanes is to give cyclists a defined safe space to ride in rather than have a free for all with other traffic.
Amsterdam we are not... and we dont stand a chance if Ford becomes mayor.
that video at the top of the page where he discusses his opinion on bike lanes is an embarrassment. I actually feel embarrassed that I live in the same country with this guy and his kind of mentality. Besides the fact that his view on bike lanes is neanderthal, he is actually completely erroneous in what he is trying to point out. Doing away with bike lanes does not eliminate bike traffic. Infact his supposed concern for the safety of cyclists mingling with automobile traffic is completely false because the point of bike lanes is to give cyclists a defined safe space to ride in rather than have a free for all with other traffic.
Amsterdam we are not... and we dont stand a chance if Ford becomes mayor.