[freshcutgrass]

They might have gold-plated subways if most people who worked downtown also lived there. But they don't and they never will even with the condo boom. People will always care more about where they live than where they work

Well, while 420,000 jobs is quite impressive for downtown, so is around 300,000 residential population. If it's so unpopular, why does it have the fastest growing population by far? I'm pretty sure that downtown has the highest walk/bike to work percentage of any employment centre in the city (or pretty much anywhere).



and that's what makes the dis-proportionality of revenue not so cut and dried.

How so?

Downtown Toronto comprises 3% of the city's land area, yet accounts for 25% of the city's property tax revenue. It's also responsible for a healthy chunk of development fees and Land Transfer Taxes.

That's pretty cut and dried.

 

[voxpopulicosmicum]

You can listen to it here : http://www.torontosun.com/2013/07/04/ford-fest-heads-east-to-scarborough

It will be performed tomorrow live at Ford Fest.

Here are the lyrics:

Mayor Ford (The World Will Remember)

(c) 2013 Jenny James, Brian Mann, Paul Chalmers, Sonia Watkins

Verse 1
Mayor Ford the tax payer’s Lord
Toronto’s own, our votes he won
He’s big and grand
On wasting people’s money he takes a stand

Verse 2
He’s the money crusader
The excess cost eliminator
A big heart that always cares
A man who’s fair and keeps things square

Chorus
Mayor Ford, cost cowboy and rollback viceroy
Toronto’s defender, economic mender
Blatant attacks won’t make him collapse
Cause Mayor Ford will bounce right back
Mayor Ford, the world will remember

Verse 3
We’ve seen tax and spend heroes before
Their fancy speeches, oh what a bore
They had their thrills and now we’re forced to pay their bills
That’s why we’re sore

Verse 4
All the crazy accusations
Won’t break apart the Ford Nation
He’s the man who perseveres
His political mandate will adhere

Chorus
Mayor Ford, cost cowboy and rollback viceroy
Toronto’s defender, economic mender
Blatant attacks won’t make him collapse
Cause Mayor Ford will bounce right back
Mayor Ford, the world will remember

Guitar Solo…

Ending Chorus
Mayor Ford, cost cowboy and rollback viceroy
Toronto’s defender, economic mender
Blatant attacks won’t make him collapse
Cause Mayor Ford will bounce right back
Mayor Ford, the world will remember

I guess "crack binge" and "protected by dirty cops" are hard to rhyme.

 

[adma]

i don't know, i don't think it is philistinism to affirm individual property rights over old bricks. It's a different issue if a building is or should be listed or protected in some way obviously, but bashing and insulting people does the heritage 'cause' more harm than good really... and isn't it just this attitude at the crux of the Ford Nation/urban elitist divide? Whether we're talking about latte-sipping poseurs or heritage zealots it's about the all too easy perception of being completely out of touch. Ford taps into it like a Sun Tzu master.

Though upon reading this thedeepend post in that same thread, it's an interesting depiction of what I might call, well, "EIFS Nation" a la Ford Nation, delusional misguidedness in the face of snake oil and all...

from my perspective, the use of EIFS is reaching crisis proportions in the city. i think we are approaching critical mass, where this blight is starting to seriously impact the architectural integrity and heritage of the city.

while it is depressing to see any building coated with this garbage--one is now seeing an increasing number of architecturally notable buildings being destroyed in this way--from the Victorian posted here, to hundreds of lovely
Edwardian homes, 20s-30s apartment buildings, 50s-60s modernist office buildings, apts and shops, the whole gamut. it's like an invasive species or a virus, gobbling up perfectly fine buildings, replacing them with characterless, lifeless, dead shadows of themselves. and sadly, it is also the blight of the future.

i keep waiting for it to abate, for another solution to emerge-but it just seems to get worse and worse.

the most chilling thing about it that the EIFS industry is a formidable enemy.

whoever is selling this system to owners is not only preying on their architectural ignorance, but they are also incredibly effective and aggressive at getting people signed up. these salesmen seem to be spreading tentacles out over the entire city, gobbling up one neighbourhood after another. and it is a total racket, because any owner that acquiesces is actually decreasing the value of their property.

i'm curious as to who exactly is promoting and selling this system. is it a few big companies? a whole bunch of mom and pops? are there trade associations and trade publications involved in pushing it? is it word of mouth among similarly budget conscious, architecturally illiterate building owners?

solution wise, i've often wondered about the efficacy of mounting a public awareness campaign that seeks to both educate property owners and call out the industry for selling what amounts to a weapon of mass historical destruction.

one wonders whether a few high-profile articles, social media campaigns, hashtag eifsblight, etc. might be enough to at least get a conversation going in the City of Toronto about this very troubling phenomenon. it might start to make owners at least stop and think for a minute, before the pull the trigger on murdering their own property.

 

[JWBF]

You can listen to it here : http://www.torontosun.com/2013/07/04/ford-fest-heads-east-to-scarborough

It will be performed tomorrow live at Ford Fest.

Here are the lyrics:

Mayor Ford (The World Will Remember)

(c) 2013 Jenny James, Brian Mann, Paul Chalmers, Sonia Watkins

Verse 1
Mayor Ford the tax payer’s Lord
Toronto’s own, our votes he won
He’s big and grand
On wasting people’s money he takes a stand

Verse 2
He’s the money crusader
The excess cost eliminator
A big heart that always cares
A man who’s fair and keeps things square

Chorus
Mayor Ford, cost cowboy and rollback viceroy
Toronto’s defender, economic mender
Blatant attacks won’t make him collapse
Cause Mayor Ford will bounce right back
Mayor Ford, the world will remember

Verse 3
We’ve seen tax and spend heroes before
Their fancy speeches, oh what a bore
They had their thrills and now we’re forced to pay their bills
That’s why we’re sore

Verse 4
All the crazy accusations
Won’t break apart the Ford Nation
He’s the man who perseveres
His political mandate will adhere

Chorus
Mayor Ford, cost cowboy and rollback viceroy
Toronto’s defender, economic mender
Blatant attacks won’t make him collapse
Cause Mayor Ford will bounce right back
Mayor Ford, the world will remember

Guitar Solo…

Ending Chorus
Mayor Ford, cost cowboy and rollback viceroy
Toronto’s defender, economic mender
Blatant attacks won’t make him collapse
Cause Mayor Ford will bounce right back
Mayor Ford, the world will remember

Reads like something from a political rally, a political rally outside of election time, paid for by Deco Labels.

Now isn't that interesting.

 

[gwanstarr]

I do not enjoy living surrounded by this amount of raw, unfocused and nonsensical beligerance and if I were not caring for family in the area, I would leave for Quebec or Mars or someplace not populated by such a sea of unrepentant imbeciles.

MarsOne Application

 

[CowboyLogic]

Yeah, but most of Ford's staff were actually football coaches, which mitigates a lot of their usefulness, now matter how few of them there are (were, now that they've all quit).

This still hasn't been addressed. Remember the repairs to Don Bosco's parking lot?

I don't think most of the staff were actually football coaches, and nobody knows how useful any of the staff actually were.

I'll agree that the Don Bosco repairs were an abuse of resources. Presumably they would be dealt with at some point and Ford consistently solves other minor issues for other constituents, but he still shouldn't be pushing his personal problems to the top of the queue. That being said, I only said Ford has a better track record than most, not that he's completely 100% squeaky clean, and I think his track record speaks for itself.

Cowboylogic:


You missed my point - having a lower budget is different from how that money is spent. One can spend less and still spend it on inappropriately. I for one don't recall that Miller's staff were hired by their football connections, much less doing work with/using city resources for work with absolutely no bearing on the official duties of the office. That's bar none a waste (and I haven't even started on the appropriateness of hiring someone on the basis of casual connections vs. merit).

Its a waste if they're doing their coaching in lieu of their office duties. They were supposedly working in a volunteer capacity. That's hard to delineate, so I do have a problem with it and would agree its wasteful, but in general, he does have a good track record on these issues.

I don't have a problem with hiring people based on casual connections. Nepotism is a part of life. People hire people they know and who they think they can trust. I've gotten friends hired at jobs, I've gotten hired at jobs through other people - its just how these things work, unfortunately. Connections are just generally a bigger determiner of employment than experience or skills.

Beyond that, regarding the office expense disclosure - the whole point isn't the reduction of cost but transparency on how it was spent. Would you really have us believe that he spent absolutely nothing on anything as a mayor? And if the expenditure isn't official, how is the city supposed to have a record of what money went to what sources? There are very good reasons why costs associated with city business should be spent with funds that can be traced publically.

AoD

His office's expenditure is clearly noted on the city of Toronto website. He did spend funds, just a lesser amount than many of the other councilors.

You see the trees but not the forest. A well-staffed mayor's office is crucial to making sure that the behind-the-scenes working and political scheming goes well and the right message is crafted. Look at Ford's track record and you can see that he lacks the ability to whip votes and craft an effective message (outside his rants) at the moment. And even with his reduced budget he's still wasting money on football coaches.

You're changing the goal posts here. I said he had a good track record in terms of accountability and spending taxpayer money, people disagreed and I countered that he cut his office's budget and staff significantly. Whether that's a good thing or not is an entirely different subject - we're just talking about whether he has a good track record on these issues.

 

[jje1000]

I don't have a problem with hiring people based on casual connections. Nepotism is a part of life. People hire people they know and who they think they can trust. I've gotten friends hired at jobs, I've gotten hired at jobs through other people - its just how these things work, unfortunately. Connections are just generally a bigger determiner of employment than experience or skills.

Connection should not be the primary detetminer in totality, because it would mean that you could have hired someone with the wrong skill set, who would be totally useless for that opening you're looking to fill. Look at Dave Price- what opening was he supposed to fill?

You're changing the goal posts here. I said he had a good track record in terms of accountability and spending taxpayer money, people disagreed and I countered that he cut his office's budget and staff significantly. Whether that's a good thing or not is an entirely different subject - we're just talking about whether he has a good track record on these issues.

Not quite changing the goal posts, because I'm not Alvin nor part of the original discussion stream. What I'm adding is a side note on how cutting his budget has affected his mayoralship. While it's nice to see the mayor cutting down on his own budget, it should raise the question of how people pay for their office- I think that Ford's councillor expenses were zero, but it meant that they were using their personal funds. What kind of limitations would that bring to people who aren't wealthy? Office budgets are there for a reason- to level the playing field, and they're a small percentage of the city budget. I'd rather Ford ensure that they're used properly rather than engage in a measuring race to see who uses the least.

 

[Eug]

What I find bizarre is that Rob Ford was actually investigated for NOT claiming high office expenses.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Eug:

Not high, but reasonable expenses - do you think 700 bucks of city-related expenses for a mayor with an office budget of 1M+ for a city with a budget of close to 10B is reasonable? And if there are additional expenses that wasn't on the books - what are they for, to whom are they paid to? What rights does the city have in looking into them even though they are part of city business but wasn't paid out by the city? These are transparency and accountability issue - and less an accounting one.

AoD

 

[Silence&Motion]

You can listen to it here : http://www.torontosun.com/2013/07/04/ford-fest-heads-east-to-scarborough

It will be performed tomorrow live at Ford Fest.

Here are the lyrics:

Mayor Ford (The World Will Remember)

(c) 2013 Jenny James, Brian Mann, Paul Chalmers, Sonia Watkins

Verse 1
Mayor Ford the tax payer’s Lord
Toronto’s own, our votes he won
He’s big and grand
On wasting people’s money he takes a stand

Verse 2
He’s the money crusader
The excess cost eliminator
A big heart that always cares
A man who’s fair and keeps things square

Chorus
Mayor Ford, cost cowboy and rollback viceroy
Toronto’s defender, economic mender
Blatant attacks won’t make him collapse
Cause Mayor Ford will bounce right back
Mayor Ford, the world will remember

Verse 3
We’ve seen tax and spend heroes before
Their fancy speeches, oh what a bore
They had their thrills and now we’re forced to pay their bills
That’s why we’re sore

Verse 4
All the crazy accusations
Won’t break apart the Ford Nation
He’s the man who perseveres
His political mandate will adhere

Chorus
Mayor Ford, cost cowboy and rollback viceroy
Toronto’s defender, economic mender
Blatant attacks won’t make him collapse
Cause Mayor Ford will bounce right back
Mayor Ford, the world will remember

Guitar Solo…

Ending Chorus
Mayor Ford, cost cowboy and rollback viceroy
Toronto’s defender, economic mender
Blatant attacks won’t make him collapse
Cause Mayor Ford will bounce right back
Mayor Ford, the world will remember

Oh my god. This is the greatest thing the Ford Era has ever produced. I picture an 80's-style montage of Ford ripping up union contracts, knocking streetcars off their tracks with a bulldozer, and coaching his football team to a Metro Bowl championship. It ends with a shot of Rob and Doug shaking hands in front of dark, empty City Hall with a big "closed" sign on the front door.

 

[Eug]

Eug:

Not high, but reasonable expenses - do you think 700 bucks of city-related expenses for a mayor with an office budget of 1M+ for a city with a budget of close to 10B is reasonable? And if there are additional expenses that wasn't on the books - what are they for, to whom are they paid to? What rights does the city have in looking into them even though they are part of city business but wasn't paid out by the city? These are transparency and accountability issue - and less an accounting one.

AoD

Meh. If he wants to spend his own money printing stuff, then so be it. The main issue with accountability is people spending too much on stuff like mascot suit rentals.

I understand what you're saying to a certain extent, but it's stuff like this that only serves to support Rob Ford's position. People are sick of it.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Its a waste if they're doing their coaching in lieu of their office duties. They were supposedly working in a volunteer capacity. That's hard to delineate, so I do have a problem with it and would agree its wasteful, but in general, he does have a good track record on these issues.

Not only their coaching - but all the activities surrounding it without any relation to official city business. Do you seriously expect us to believe that they are doing so in a "volunteer capacity" during work hours?

I don't have a problem with hiring people based on casual connections. Nepotism is a part of life. People hire people they know and who they think they can trust. I've gotten friends hired at jobs, I've gotten hired at jobs through other people - its just how these things work, unfortunately. Connections are just generally a bigger determiner of employment than experience or skills.

That's a rather casual dismissal of good hiring practices - there is a reason why rules exists to reduce nepotism, and by extension corruption - especially in government.

His office's expenditure is clearly noted on the city of Toronto website. He did spend funds, just a lesser amount than many of the other councilors.

700 bucks, on an office budget of 1+M? Even cell phones/plans alone would have cost that much for an office staff of his size. And if the city didn't pay for that, what legal right does city have to the access communications made on said phones, should the need arise?

You're changing the goal posts here. I said he had a good track record in terms of accountability and spending taxpayer money, people disagreed and I countered that he cut his office's budget and staff significantly. Whether that's a good thing or not is an entirely different subject - we're just talking about whether he has a good track record on these issues.

If you don't have a full picture of how his staff spent their working hours (let's not even get to the mayor himself, given the lack of clarity with his work hours/schedule - if one's Chief of Staff have no clue where his worship is most of the time, is that a good sign that they are "working"?), I am not sure how you can come to the conclusion that he has a good track record in terms of accountability. As to spending taxpayers money, I am not sure if the output justified that rosy conclusion.

AoD

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Eug:

Meh. If he wants to spend his own money printing stuff, then so be it. The main issue with accountability is people spending too much on stuff like mascot suit rentals.

I understand what you're saying to a certain extent, but it's stuff like this that only serves to support Rob Ford's position. People are sick of it.

The "main issue with accountability"? A mayor with a 100K+ salary that doesn't even have a publically available agenda doesn't matter; the question of his staff with a total salary of x+ dollars spending their time on non-city business doesn't matter; the question of how one can run an office his size with clear costs that somehow isn't accounted for anywhere doesn't matter - and yet one is supposed to get worked up over a mascot suit rental of what, $500 at a public event for the benefit of the public (yes, because it's like the councillor is going to get re-elected thanks to the mascot)? People can be sick of it all they want (because yes, we all want to wash our hands off good governance) but the asymmetrical response is troubling.

AoD

 

[Eug]

Eug:



The "main issue with accountability"? A mayor with a 100K+ salary that doesn't even have a publically available agenda doesn't matter; the question of his staff with a total salary of x+ dollars spending their time on non-city business doesn't matter; the question of how one can run an office his size with clear costs that somehow isn't accounted for anywhere doesn't matter - and yet one is supposed to get worked up over a mascot suit rental of what, $500 at a public event for the benefit of the public (yes, because it's like the councillor is going to get re-elected thanks to the mascot)? People can be sick of it all they want but if they can't see their own double standards I think we have a serious issue here.

AoD

Like I said, if you're getting worked up over this, I can sort of understand it... but it only serves Rob Ford's position. In the greater scheme of things, it's the opposite of scandalous. People overwhelmingly either don't care or else agree with Rob Ford on this issue.

OTOH, they do care about frivolous expense spending, very much so.

And you know what? I too empathize with the Joe Public's attitude here. If you're getting worked up over this, and want to stick it to Rob Ford specifically because of this, then I think you're focusing your energies in the wrong direction. Same goes for the conflict of interest nonsense.

Sure, complain about his transit policies, or even complain about his homophobic tendencies and his misinformation on HIV spread or whatever, but stop trying to do him in on technicalities because it just annoys the electorate.

 

[AlvinofDiaspar]

Eug:

I understand the matter of optics but there are very good reasons to get worked up over this - faulty governance is what lead to multi-million dollar blowups like MFP. If the electorate can't understand the importance of good governance and chose to focus on little things, that's their perogative, but don't say we haven't warned them of the consequences. If their annoyance is a necessary price, then perhaps they should stayed annoyed because you know what, governing doesn't happen on its' own and it is annoying work.

As the saying goes, the people get the government they deserved. I just hope that they also take personal responsibility in their choice when the day comes (which of course, they don't).

AoD