[picard102]

Here is another one for not calling a SoE, from someone in emergency management and public safety.

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/toron...ight-decision-on-state-of-emergency-1.2476746

"Some mayors may have [made the declaration]. Most, in my experience, would have come to the decision that no, looking at it objectively, there's not enough criteria here to make that declaration. So I think he made the right decision,"


Yet some have suggested declaring a state of emergency may have helped the sick or elderly trapped in highrise apartments with no power.
"What would the declaration of an emergency do for these people? Would it really help them?" Kinchea asked. "Would it really make the situation better? And in the case of simply declaring an emergency, no. There's nothing in that declaration that would help them. There's nothing that a declaration would allow the city to do to help these people that they couldn't do without that declaration."

 

[pattycakes]

Maybe this was another reason SOE wasn't declared:

"NEWSNATIONAL
Military to charge provinces, communities for disaster relief

OTTAWA — The Canadian Forces has decided to start charging municipalities and provinces to cover the costs whenever the military is called upon to help in emergencies such as floods and wildfires, according to internal Defence Department documents obtained by Postmedia News.

Military officials say federal budget cuts are to blame for the move, which ends a 15-year practice of waiving efforts to recover such costs and could force communities and provinces to think twice before calling the Canadian Forces for help."

http://o.canada.com/news/national/military-to-charge-provinces-communities-for-disaster-relief/

 

[W. K. Lis]

Maybe this was another reason SOE wasn't declared:

"NEWSNATIONAL
Military to charge provinces, communities for disaster relief

OTTAWA — The Canadian Forces has decided to start charging municipalities and provinces to cover the costs whenever the military is called upon to help in emergencies such as floods and wildfires, according to internal Defence Department documents obtained by Postmedia News.

Military officials say federal budget cuts are to blame for the move, which ends a 15-year practice of waiving efforts to recover such costs and could force communities and provinces to think twice before calling the Canadian Forces for help."

http://o.canada.com/news/national/military-to-charge-provinces-communities-for-disaster-relief/

Another downloading of costs from the higher levels of government. Brought to you from the Conservatives in Ottawa. (This is not approved by this taxpayer.)

 

[LowPolygon]

It is just so mind-boggling how delusional Rob Ford is.

It is truly disturbing (and even frightening) that the mayor of our city has a serious and untreated mental illness. We are all continuing to pay the price. All thanks to the selfishness of those who voted for him.

Narcissistic Personality Disorder
"Narcissistic personality disorder is a pervasive disorder characterized by self-centeredness, lack of empathy, and an exaggerated sense of self-importance. As with other personality disorders, this disorder is an enduring and persistent pattern of behavior that negatively impacts many different life areas including social, family, and work relationships."

"People with narcissistic personality disorder are typically described as arrogant, conceited, self-centered and haughty. Because they imagine themselves as superior to others, they often insist on possessing items that reflect a successful lifestyle. Despite this exaggerated self-image, they are reliant on constant praise and attention to reinforce their self-esteem. As a result, those with narcissistic personality disorder are usually very sensitive to criticism, which is often viewed as a personal attack."

Symptoms include:

• An exaggerated sense of one's own abilities and achievements.

• A constant need for attention, affirmation and praise. (*Ford Nation cult of personality, family picnics, Rob as "rock star" etc)

• Exploiting other people for personal gain.

• A sense of entitlement and expectation of special treatment.

• A preoccupation with power or success.

• Feeling envious of others, or believing that others are envious of him or her. (*downtown elites, in the case of RF)

• A lack of empathy for others.

 

[Riverdale Rink Rat]

Re: Declaring an SOE

IMHO, the 'wouldn't have helped Hydro' argument totally misses the point. You declare an emergency in order to focus attention on the situation and co-ordinate resources. Hydro had warned from early on that there were parts of the city that they could predict, with some certainty, would not get power for several days. Getting vulnerable people out of those locations is the point of the emergency powers.

Now, maybe it wasn't necessary. And maybe if we had an articulate Mayor, he could have explained that. But Hizzoner was driving around in his suit coat campaigning! Flipping BURGERS!

The only reason NOT to declare an emergency, as far as I can tell, was to keep CP 24 on his tail.

 

[guy caballero]

6 days later over 25,000 "customers" are stil without power from ice storm.
That could be 50,000- 75,000 people still living in an emergency situation.

The SOE would have had more manpower to remove fallen trees and put the tons of wire needed in place.
Common sense should rule but......

This says everything about importance of SOE....

Here is another one for the state of emergency vote:

Toronto should call the ice storm what it is: an emergency
By failing to declare a state of emergency, Toronto is putting the lives of many of its most vulnerable at risk.

By: Cathy Crowe and Alison Kemper Published on Fri Dec 27 2013

The emergency in Toronto is not about the speed at which hydro workers have accomplished their tasks (they are truly heroic), it is the unknown distress of hundreds of thousands of Torontonians whose homes could no longer provide warmth, whose elevators weren’t working, whose kitchens could no longer provide food, whose telephones could no longer connect them to the outside world and whose medical conditions could no longer be managed.
...

In December in Canada, a home that has lost power and heat is habitable for only a short time. By Christmas Eve, with temperatures plummeting to -12 C, many darkened homes were approaching temperatures of 0 C.
...
What happened to the thousands of Torontonians who weren’t able to book a hotel, go to their in-laws’, eat in restaurants or leave town? How are they doing? We have no idea. We have been told that emergency calls have been five times their normal level, and we hear sirens screaming down our roads constantly.
...
What will we find in a week — in our rooming houses, in our high rises, in the little wartime bungalows that are scattered across our city? Will we have escaped without increased deaths? Or will we regret our lack of action this week?
From Sunday onward, our political leaders debated the worth of declaring an emergency. Perhaps it was the shame we remembered after former Mayor Mel Lastman declared his own “snow emergency” and called in the Armed Forces to remove metres of snow. Perhaps it was Rob Ford’s desire to have a central and positive role in the drama rather than being sidelined after an emergency declaration. Likely, his misunderstanding of the difference between martial law and a state of emergency has prevented such a move. Perhaps it was the city management’s long-standing resistance to provincial interference that made staff reluctant to ask for help.

Sadly, Torontonians have been left out in the cold.



Cathy Crowe is a long-time street nurse and Distinguished Visiting Practitioner at Ryerson. Alison Kemper, PhD, is Assistant Professor, Entrepreneurship and Strategy, Ted Rogers School of Management.

 

[mrtinfoilsocket]

The SOE would have had more manpower to remove fallen trees and put the tons of wire needed in place.
Common sense should rule but......

How would an SOE have brought more manpower to the problem? I'm honestly willing to be convinced but not one single source has been able to explain that. Just a bunch of people saying that in their opinion it would. (That Toronto Star article is the same thing - long on opinion and short on facts).

In fact the CBC article (posted earlier by somebody else) quotes two experts in emergency management acknowledging that an SOE wouldn't have made a difference.

 

[DeathSilver]

No more bombshells in sight....when is Lisi due back in court? I suspect developments will only occur when/if Lisi rolls over and cooperates with police. At least that's my guess. Thoughts?

 

[guy caballero]

How would an SOE have brought more manpower to the problem? I'm honestly willing to be convinced but not one single source has been able to explain that. Just a bunch of people saying that in their opinion it would. (That Toronto Star article is the same thing - long on opinion and short on facts).

More manpower would allow for quicker removal of trees and other damaged items that are slowing recovery.
It is that simple.



It is vacation time for most. My guess is that the key players are out of town.

 

[guy caballero]

This....

Here is another one for the state of emergency vote:

Toronto should call the ice storm what it is: an emergency
By failing to declare a state of emergency, Toronto is putting the lives of many of its most vulnerable at risk.

By: Cathy Crowe and Alison Kemper Published on Fri Dec 27 2013

The emergency in Toronto is not about the speed at which hydro workers have accomplished their tasks (they are truly heroic), it is the unknown distress of hundreds of thousands of Torontonians whose homes could no longer provide warmth, whose elevators weren’t working, whose kitchens could no longer provide food, whose telephones could no longer connect them to the outside world and whose medical conditions could no longer be managed.
...

In December in Canada, a home that has lost power and heat is habitable for only a short time. By Christmas Eve, with temperatures plummeting to -12 C, many darkened homes were approaching temperatures of 0 C.
...
What happened to the thousands of Torontonians who weren’t able to book a hotel, go to their in-laws’, eat in restaurants or leave town? How are they doing? We have no idea. We have been told that emergency calls have been five times their normal level, and we hear sirens screaming down our roads constantly.
...
What will we find in a week — in our rooming houses, in our high rises, in the little wartime bungalows that are scattered across our city? Will we have escaped without increased deaths? Or will we regret our lack of action this week?
From Sunday onward, our political leaders debated the worth of declaring an emergency. Perhaps it was the shame we remembered after former Mayor Mel Lastman declared his own “snow emergency†and called in the Armed Forces to remove metres of snow. Perhaps it was Rob Ford’s desire to have a central and positive role in the drama rather than being sidelined after an emergency declaration. Likely, his misunderstanding of the difference between martial law and a state of emergency has prevented such a move. Perhaps it was the city management’s long-standing resistance to provincial interference that made staff reluctant to ask for help.

Sadly, Torontonians have been left out in the cold.



Cathy Crowe is a long-time street nurse and Distinguished Visiting Practitioner at Ryerson. Alison Kemper, PhD, is Assistant Professor, Entrepreneurship and Strategy, Ted Rogers School of Management.

 

[mrtinfoilsocket]

No more bombshells in sight....when is Lisi due back in court? I suspect developments will only occur when/if Lisi rolls over and cooperates with police. At least that's my guess. Thoughts?

This isn't exactly exciting or groundbreaking but thought I'd put it here in case people haven't see it. Blair did an interview with TheStar and made a number of comments about the Ford investigation. He said a few things that allude to the idea that the investigation is still ongoing.

http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2013/12/28/chief_bill_blair_police_carding_can_sometimes_be_illegal.html

The investigation into Ford’s activities adds significant uncertainty to the 2014 mayoral election campaign, which formally begins on Wednesday. Blair said the looming campaign does not make the investigation any more urgent.

Blair would not commit to informing the public when the Ford investigation is complete.

 

[mrtinfoilsocket]

More manpower would allow for quicker removal of trees and other damaged items that are slowing recovery.
It is that simple.

No I understand exactly what more manpower would do. That's not in question.

What I'm asking is "How would an SOE bring more manpower?". Nobody has been able to explain this. In fact most credible sources say that it would NOT.

 

[dforthandbview]

No more bombshells in sight....when is Lisi due back in court? I suspect developments will only occur when/if Lisi rolls over and cooperates with police. At least that's my guess. Thoughts?

Lawyers, crown and judge are due in court Jan. 14 for the pre-trial meeting.

 

[kaboi]

The SOE has more to do with Ford then anything else. That he possibly didn't declare a SOE out of his own malicious need for power is further indictment of the man himself... but that's really par Ford the course.

There is that, but don't discount his gross misunderstanding of what calling an emergency actually means! He said the city would shut down, stores would close and the TTC would halt. Oh, and people would start to panic. (Mind you, I would probably panic if the stores closed and the TTC halted for no good reason...)

I'm tired of watching people debate the finer points of whether this is/isn't an emergency when it's clear our mayor has NO CLUE.

One of Ford's very few remaining powers is the ability to declare an emergency, and once again he has proven himself incapable of exercising it.

 

[mrtinfoilsocket]

I'm tired of watching people debate the finer points of whether this is/isn't an emergency when it's clear our mayor has NO CLUE.

One of Ford's very few remaining powers is the ability to declare an emergency, and once again he has proven himself incapable of exercising it.

Very true! There was a cbc article posted earlier called "Ford made the right decision on state of emergency". There was a reader comment there that really struck home for me:

Probably the right decision. Probably the wrong reason.