[casita]

The army would respond, the same as when Mel called them for help. The army could have gone door to door, providing information, supplies or rides to warming centres. The manpower could be used for tree removal, even directing traffic at intersections.

In 1999, Toronto EMS requested and received four military Bison ambulances. ( Toronto ambulances are not equipped with snow tires, BTW. )

By co-incidence, the Reservists happened to be in their armouries due to a field exercise being cancelled because of the snow storm. They were put to work shovelling out TTC stops instead. They were not "called up".

The Regular Force soldiers from the Initial Response Unit ( IRU ) were called-up from CFB Petawawa. They not were put to use in the Emergency. See, "Troops Battle Boredom at the Mall" ( click to enlarge ):
http://cdn.thegridto.com/wp-content/uploads/ts-99-01-17-snow-facts-lastman.jpg

Seeing how the current ( no pun intended ) emergency occurred during the Holiday season, many of the Regular soldiers from Petawawa would be on Christmas leave. They get a long "Block Leave" during this time. Many return to their home towns, ( minus their uniforms and equipment ).

 

[Michael62]

Declaring the Toronto Ice Storm an SOE emergency may not have increased the manpower or made the hydro repairs happen quicker but it would have given acknowledgement to those individuals experiencing extend power outages. It grants an understanding that in emergency situations things are progressing as quickly as possible. A declared SOE provides an assumed knowledge that patience may be part of the solution.

 

[The Golem]

The Big 6 Newsmaker of the Year: Rob Ford

With 43% of your votes, Toronto Mayor Rob Ford is the Day 6 Newsmaker of 2013. Ford has only agreed to a handful of interviews since the crack video story broke in May, and often declines to answer questions. We've assembled a list of questions that some of the key reporters on the story and others would like Mayor Ford to answer. Mayor Ford was sent these questions on December 17, along with an invitation to answer them in an interview or in writing. Mayor Ford did not respond to our request. Some questions below refer to information from police documents, including the Project Brazen and Project Traveller "Information To Obtain" docs. Information from these documents has not been proven in a court of law.

A lot of these questions have already been answered. What is really needed is for one reporter (eg Kevin Donovan or Robyn Doolittle) to have an actual interview with Rob alone.

DonPeat, The Toronto Sun:
1. Do you not feel shame about what you have done?
2. What happened the night and early morning of April 20 at 15 Windsor?
3. What makes you think Toronto residents will ever trust you again enough to re-elect you in 2014?
4. Why won't you speak to Toronto Police investigators?
5. What does getting high on crack cocaine feel like?

Answers:
1. Yes, and I have apologized and am moving forward.
2. Not going to comment on an ongoing case.
3. We'll see what happens. My record, still popular everywhere I go, saved a billion dollars, gave Scarborough a subway, etc. (usual campaign rhetoric). Want a fridge magnet?
4. Lawyer's advice.
5. I was so drunk, don't even remember.

Christie Blatchford, The National Post:
6. How could you have said, in front of all those TV cameras, what you did about your wife? Do you have any idea how coarse you sounded? And why did you then and do you always, offer a quick "I apologize" and expect to be immediately forgiven?
7. Do you have any friends who don't have criminal records and, without naming them, who are they in a general way?
8. Why do you think losing weight is your biggest challenge given your acknowledged binge drinking and occasional drug use?

6. I was complimenting her!
7. I meet a lot of people and have many friends. When you meet someone do you start off asking them if they have a criminal record.
8. I have not had a drink or done any drugs in ___ weeks. That's all in the past.

Jonathan Goldstein, Wiretap, CBC Radio:
9. When was the moment you realized this whole thing might have gotten away from you?

9.The people decided and I'm still mayor, so nothing has "gotten away" from me.

Robyn Doolittle, The Toronto Star:
10. At the end of the so-called crack video, you look directly at the person filming and say: "That better not be on." What happened next?
11. Wiretaps suggest you offered the dealer $5000 and a car in exchange for the footage and that he intended on asking you for between $100,000-$150,000. Were you being extorted?
(Note: Rob Ford called these an allegations an "outright lie" in a December 5 appearance on the Washington, DC radio program The Sports Junkies.)
12. If you had never gone into politics, what do you think your life would look like right now?

10. Good question Robyn.
11. I cannot discuss a matter that is before the courts (Lisi trial).
Ford legally can talk about it but has used this answer before.
12. Football coach, of course.

Jackson Proskow, Municipal Affairs Reporter, Global News:
13. What was in those packages you exchanged with Sandro Lisi?
14. How did you come to know the people who provided you with crack cocaine?
15. Have you ever drank or used drugs at work?

13. Again, cannot discus a matter before the courts/Not going to throw a friend under the bus.
14. Was so drunk that night it's all a blur.
15. That would be irresponsible.

Greg McArthur, The Globe and Mail:
16. Between May 16 and 18, less than 48 hours after the Star and Gawker published stories about you smoking crack cocaine, 13 phone calls were made to Sandro Lisi from phones belonging to you. What did you discuss with him? Why did you need to speak with him so many times?
17. Over that same period Mr. Lisi also made a number of phone calls to two alleged drug dealers who had a copy of the video. Toronto police say that over those two days, Mr. Lisi told them they would harmed if they didn't hand over the video. What did Mr. Lisi tell you about his conversations with the accused drug dealers?
18. During those two days, Mr. Lisi also made five phone calls to the home of Fabio Basso, your longtime friend who lives in the alleged "crackhouse" where the video was made. And on May 21st, three days after he called Mr. Basso, someone burst into that home and assaulted Mr. Basso and his family members. Since then, have you spoken to Mr. Basso? If so, what did he say about the attack? If not, why not.

16. Already answered (see 13)
17. See 16.
18. See 17, or "Next question!"

Jayme Poisson, The Toronto Star:
19. Mayor Ford, after the mass shooting on Danzig St. in 2012, you said that you had declared "war" on gangs in this city. On Project Traveller wiretaps, alleged members of the Dixon City Bloods street gang describe several situations involving you and drugs. The men who tried to sell the now notorious "crack video" are also alleged members of this gang, and are now facing gun and drug trafficking charges. Can you give us a complete and honest account of your association and dealings with these alleged Dixon City Blood gang members?
20. Did you, or anyone associated with you, offer $5,000 and a car or any other reward in exchange for videos or photos documenting your drug use?

19. I have no idea about drug dealers conversations with each other.
20. Already answered this. Next question.

Kevin Donovan, Toronto Star:
21. Mayor Ford, from the moment I saw the video of you smoking crack cocaine I have had a nagging question. Who is the man, a friend it seems, who is loudly goading you off camera into making rude, racially charged and homophobic statements? What is the name of that person?
22. Mayor Ford, when the Toronto Star exposed your involvement with Sandro Lisi, who had tried to retrieve the video and who had told people he was your drug dealer, you pointedly told the world you do not "throw my friends under the bus." Was this a message to Mr. Lisi in the hope that he would not turn police informant on you?
23. Mayor, you have described yourself as a family man and the best father there is. Do you think it was wise to have Sandro Lisi, a man convicted of threatening to kill a young woman, attend a child's soccer game? Would you please tell us what Mr. Lisi gave you that day and what you gave him in return.
24. Mayor Ford, many of the people you surround yourself with have criminal records, some for drugs, some for violence. Do you intentionally seek these people out and if so, for what reason?

21. Drunken stupor, don't remember.
22. Was just stating my opinion.
23. Lisi is a good man and I trust him.
24. I also 'surround myself' with Toronto councilors.

George Stroumbolopoulos, George Stroumbolopoulos Tonight:
25. Why is your brother always there in interviews?
26. If you were in City Council and a Mayor acted like you did, would you call for their resignation? (Note: Ford responded to City Council's vote to limit his powers on Nov. 15.)

25.He's not here today.
26. Saved the city a billion dollars, sticking to agenda, etc.

Natalie Alcoba, The National Post:
27. Mayor Ford, your former press secretary, George Christopoulos, told police that you said you knew Anthony Smith, the man pictured with you in the notorious photo taken outside 15 Windsor Road. Smith was a suspected member of the Dixon City Bloods who was gunned down outside a down-town nightclub in March. You've commented on the photo before - but I want to ask you specifically, did you know Anthony Smith? Do you know anything about why Anthony Smith was killed?
28. Mayor Ford, since you were elected, how often did you go to the house on Windsor Road that police believe to be a crack house? What did you do there?

27. No
28. It's not a crack house. What I do on personal time is personal. Let he who is without crack cast the first stone. No wait how does that saying go...

Mary Walsh, This Hour Has 22 Minutes
29. Why do you always lie first and tell the truth later, why not simplify your life and tell the truth first?

29. You scared my daughter. Now you're scaring me!

 

[The Golem]

This isn't exactly exciting or groundbreaking but thought I'd put it here in case people haven't see it. Blair did an interview with TheStar and made a number of comments about the Ford investigation. He said a few things that allude to the idea that the investigation is still ongoing.

http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2013/12/28/chief_bill_blair_police_carding_can_sometimes_be_illegal.html

Blair is such a weasel. And I expect that Lisi is going to plead guilty, take 3 years in jail (and then probably get a job at Deco Labels LOL). There will be no trial, no witnesses called, no testimony from Ford.

 

[picard102]

Declaring the Toronto Ice Storm an SOE emergency may not have increased the manpower or made the hydro repairs happen quicker but it would have given acknowledgement to those individuals experiencing extend power outages. It grants an understanding that in emergency situations things are progressing as quickly as possible. A declared SOE provides an assumed knowledge that patience may be part of the solution.

Given how stupid and self absorbed people are in general, I wouldn't expect people's reactions would be different either way. We'd still have people complaining that their power wasn't restored first.

 

[Admiral Beez]

Sure, a fire is the same thing as being without power. There is no reason, living in a country defined by it's winters, that one should be able to live in a structure protected from the elements for more than an hour in the cold.

There is something to be said for taking personal responsibilty.

When I lived in Fredericton, where winter power cuts were quite common, many homes had an alternative heat source such as a pellet stove. I recall many homes where a wood or pellet stove was in frequent use, and this was in an urban setting. Pellet stoves are neat, and very efficient and clean burning. Of course they can't be used everywhere, such as condos, so I present pellet stoves not as the definitive solution, but as an example of how people don't surrender their fate to the government, and instead take responsibility.

During one three day power cut in NB I well recall the time we emptied the freezer onto the back deck (t'was -20'C) and cooked everything on top of the pellet stove. The only perishables we lost were those things like milk. Of course, having experienced many a power failure, we had huge jugs of water and canned food in the basement. The kids thought it was a hoot.

I'm thinking of converting my semi's fireplace to a pellet stove for the next failure. http://www.naturalheat.ca/

 

[ThinkRicky]

Heh, freezing temps for days on end with no heat and no power? Just deal with it babies, nobody's gonna save you. Bootstraps!

 

[typezed]

Given how stupid and self absorbed people are in general

Misanthropy as a framework for emergency planning in large societies. Guaranteed to work wonderful.

 

[newearthling]

There is something to be said for taking personal responsibilty.

When I lived in Fredericton, where winter power cuts were quite common, many homes had an alternative heat source such as a pellet stove. I recall many homes where a wood or pellet stove was in frequent use, and this was in an urban setting. Pellet stoves are neat, and very efficient and clean burning. Of course they can't be used everywhere, such as condos, so I present pellet stoves not as the definitive solution, but as an example of how people don't surrender their fate to the government, and instead take responsibility.

During one three day power cut in NB I well recall the time we emptied the freezer onto the back deck (t'was -20'C) and cooked everything on top of the pellet stove. The only perishables we lost were those things like milk. Of course, having experienced many a power failure, we had huge jugs of water and canned food in the basement. The kids thought it was a hoot.

I'm thinking of converting my semi's fireplace to a pellet stove for the next failure. http://www.naturalheat.ca/

This was helpful advice.
The people deriding others for whining or for being babies because they haven't ever experienced an extended period with no heat are not getting it.
I have taken 'survival courses'. I know how to build fires in the snow, know how to start a coal from rubbing two sticks together (it is a lot of work) and know how to build a debris shelter. I could survive outside, for a few days anyway, without any supplies, if need be.
I still would have been freaked out had I lost power and heat during this ice storm.
It is all about what you are used to. We can still have compassion for people who freaked, even if someone else would have been MacGuyver Man.
The thing that I learned from this is that we as a society need to include emergency preparedness in our day to day lives. Severe weather is going to happen more, not less. We need to know how to survive, we need to stock up on supplies, and we need to know our neighbours.

 

[dt_toronto_geek]

An immediate declaration on Sunday morning might have expedited the response of outside hydro crews. Someone on this board said they knew hydro workers out of town who were expecting a call that never came - could it be their bosses didn't think Toronto needed the extra help?? Outside hydro workers didn't start until Tuesday, surely that could have happened sooner if the world knew this was a SOE.

It might also have expedited a stronger response - for example, door-to-door checks on vulnerable people and evacuations where necessary. That started later, after the -10 temperatures on Xmas eve.

Even if I'm wrong about that, I don't know that you could look at this case as typical of emergency situations. I get the feeling that the premier's response has been about working around Rob Ford. It seems to me that both Norm Kelly and the premier felt it was an emergency from the get go and agreed to forego a declaration, thereby backdooring the usual emergency protocol route. Ironically, this has made a SOE seem unnecessary, but I'm not sure that's really true. Expedient in this case, but I worry that this may muddy the waters in the future. The ability to declare a SOE exists for a reason.

If Ford had called an SOE, as I believe he should have once the devastation became fully realized by sometime Sunday morning, a Joint Operations Team would have been assembled from the Working Group as identified in the Toronto Municipal Code Emergency Management and work with the Province - and this event certainly seems to fit the definition of such, if I read correctly. From there responsibilities would have been delegated, executed, monitored and progress updated. First order of business should have been a mail blast to every resident in the city on Monday via Canada Post regarding the situation, what was being done, who was in charge and where safe warm safe centres were located. Red Cross called in to help organize warming centres. Every division should have had all resources on board by at least Tuesday to organize all available first responders, community organizers, City staff, apartment/condo building managers/staff available to knock on every door in the city without power to check on people, see who was in need of assistance, communicate any new information and answer questions. Brainstorming continues with the Working Group to address all immediate issues of resident's safety and full response & resources put to the emergency.

Fail. Mayor campaigns. Hydro workers bust their asses.

http://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/municode/1184_059.pdf

There is something to be said for taking personal responsibilty.

When I lived in Fredericton, where winter power cuts were quite common, many homes had an alternative heat source such as a pellet stove. I recall many homes where a wood or pellet stove was in frequent use, and this was in an urban setting. Pellet stoves are neat, and very efficient and clean burning. Of course they can't be used everywhere, such as condos, so I present pellet stoves not as the definitive solution, but as an example of how people don't surrender their fate to the government, and instead take responsibility.

During one three day power cut in NB I well recall the time we emptied the freezer onto the back deck (t'was -20'C) and cooked everything on top of the pellet stove. The only perishables we lost were those things like milk. Of course, having experienced many a power failure, we had huge jugs of water and canned food in the basement. The kids thought it was a hoot.

I'm thinking of converting my semi's fireplace to a pellet stove for the next failure. http://www.naturalheat.ca/

When half or a third of this city's residents live in highrises (whatever the number is) keeping their home warm is pretty much impossible during a power failure, unlike many options available for a free-standing home. Further, many are unable to navigate the stairs (elevators not working) and there is the issue of safety for many in dark corridors and stairwells should they be able to leave for water and supplies. Many don't have cars and many of those who do had blocked streets for days. Shops & stores don't have power so where do they get their supplies? How do apartment/condo residents cook? Most simply aren't prepared here for three, five, eight day power outages which is why I believe an SOE should have been declared.

 

[Riverdale Rink Rat]

If Ford had called an SOE, as I believe he should have once the devastation became fully realized by sometime Sunday morning, a Joint Operations Team would have been assembled from the Working Group as identified in the Toronto Municipal Code Emergency Management and work with the Province - and this event certainly seems to fit the definition of such, if I read correctly. From there responsibilities would have been delegated, executed, monitored and progress updated. First order of business should have been a mail blast to every resident in the city on Monday via Canada Post regarding the situation, what was being done, who was in charge and where safe warm safe centres were located. Red Cross called in to help organize warming centres. Every division should have had all resources on board by at least Tuesday to organize all available first responders, community organizers, City staff, apartment/condo building managers/staff available to knock on every door in the city without power to check on people, see who was in need of assistance, communicate any new information and answer questions. Brainstorming continues with the Working Group to address all immediate issues of resident's safety and full response & resources put to the emergency.

Fail. Mayor campaigns. Hydro workers bust their asses.

http://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/municode/1184_059.pdf

When half or a third of this city's residents live in highrises (whatever the number is) keeping their home warm is pretty much impossible during a power failure, unlike many options available for a free-standing home. Further, many are unable to navigate the stairs (elevators not working) and there is the issue of safety for many in dark corridors and stairwells should they be able to leave for water and supplies. Many don't have cars and many of those who do had blocked streets for days. Shops & stores don't have power so where do they get their supplies? How do apartment/condo residents cook? Most simply aren't prepared here for three, five, eight day power outages which is why I believe an SOE should have been declared.

I don't know. I think a pellet stove would work great on the 27th floor of Minto Midtown.

Also, I CANNOT BELIEVE Torontonians don't have block heaters for their F-150s. And, given the raccoon population, mandating rifles would probably help, what with the pellet stoves and all.

 

[mrtinfoilsocket]

If Ford had called an SOE, as I believe he should have once the devastation became fully realized by sometime Sunday morning...

Just a question though - what's to stop all that from happening WITHOUT an SOE?

I guess that's been my point from the beginning. A declaration of SOE doesn't guarantee good decision making and a non-declaration doesn't guarantee bad decision making. We've spent all this time going around in circles debating whether the technical definition of SOE should have been called. But isn't it the wrong issue to be discussing? Shouldn't we just be discussing whether the crisis was handled well or poorly in general?

They could have declared an SOE and then still handled it incompetently. On the other hand they could have not declared an SOE and then handled it brilliantly. An SOE doesn't by itself open up any option/resources/strategy that wouldn't otherwise be available without it as far as I can tell.

 

[adma]

I've yet to see evidence of any maturity, let alone an increasing amount of it...

Especially when followed up with this tidbit...

Of course, it might be cruel to chastise a 15-year-old for the “I lost a bit of credibility in him at that time" malaprop...

 

[dt_toronto_geek]

What's to stop all that from happening WITHOUT an SOE?

An SOE would have immediately brought all these people together (listed in the .pdf) in an organized fashion and protocol would have been followed - it's there for a reason, and this week is a reason (IMO). As it's been run now it appears to me to be a hodge-podge of people (good people most of them) randomly thrown together with little order in place, the SOE helps establishes clear order. We don't even get regular and timely press conferences for goodness sakes and in between them conflicting news trickles out, all of which varies depending on what TV or radio station you listen to. It's shameful.

There's no guarantee that good decision making would be made in an SOE, but my sense is when you put a whole lot of very smart people together in a room 3 or 4 times a day all of whom lead various agencies and departments in the city, there's a pretty good chance good decisions would be made when they come together in an organized and timely fashion. Unlike what we have witnessed this week, save for first responders and hydro crews. This should have been an "all hands on deck" for every city worker from the Mayor, heads of most every department to social workers on foot out in the communities affected. Everyone. You can't tell me that if heads of agencies/departments had control of all the structure of their departments from top down all kept informed and tasked with duties and responsibilities that this wouldn't have gone so much better. From looking after citizens and communicating information to getting branches and trees off streets once it was safe to do so.

Fail.

I really hope that over the next week or so dead bodies don't start getting discovered in homes and apartments due to the gross mismanagement of this storm.

 

[JWBF]

Heh, freezing temps for days on end with no heat and no power? Just deal with it babies, nobody's gonna save you. Bootstraps!

Bend over, we have a strap for you.

I don't know. I think a pellet stove would work great on the 27th floor of Minto Midtown.

Also, I CANNOT BELIEVE Torontonians don't have block heaters for their F-150s. And, given the raccoon population, mandating rifles would probably help, what with the pellet stoves and all.

Emergency generators for at least basic function should be manditory; enforce it with an insurance requirement.